EVE General Discussion

Its not so much that you were able to fight them off, it is was because you were able to fight them off using a 3rd party tool.

That 3rd party tool gave you an advantage.

That is the problem, not just with ISboxer, but any 3rd party tool that gives somebody in game a distinct advantage is wrong and should be banned.

If you were able to do the same without any 3rd party then good on you and I applaud you, so would everybody else.

The problem as people keep saying is that a 3rd party tool, something which is paid for, something which is not available to all, something which is external to the game, gave you a distinct advantage over other players.

I see no difference between ISboxer and a botting tool. Both give players an advantage they otherwise would not have as they circumvent in game design.

No.

And there you go again...

The solo player is at slight disadvantage against a group in physically entering orders to the accounts.
However, the solo player is at an advantage against the group in that the solo player doesn't need to issue commands to Those that might not follow the commands, in other words, there's no chance of conflicting orders/ or responses.

Now have the solo player with her 10 accounts group with others and their 10 accounts and all using the broadcasting tech. The tech has become a force multiplier. Pair this with a tactic that encourages alpha strikes, and you get what finally put the nail in the coffin for broadcasting in EvE. It wasn't mining, it was single pilot gank fleets unstealthing and bombing multiple others. What can you do the counter that??

Cloak + Bombs + single point of guidance = OP.

Interfering with mining was just a consequence - good or bad depends on your POV.

--Gadget

Gotcha.

Civ VI dropped recently. Go play that.

Edit:
Oh wait, you said RTS...

Yeah, that's never been EvE per se. There are elements, but EvE is the whole shebang: Tactics, Strategy, Pilotics, RP, Economics, building, and Breaking you name it - all elements that makes EvE a great game.

But EvE is a game, not a simulator - no matter what tongue-in-cheek rhetoric that goes around. Being fair isn't really necessary for players in terms of skill or creativity, but being fair is necessary for the tools available. Broadcasting tech messed up that balance.

--Gadget

Well since the core design is based on the group, enjoy the vacay.

--Gadget

Think again.

I'm not sure that is true as a blanket statement. Maybe CCP (and whatever other 'legit' players are) do not want one dude with 10~20 accounts running a fleet. But I don't think CCP has problem with a player is running a roaming toon, while gate camping with a fleet on another account, while being logged on in Jita/Amarr/Rens/Dodixie for market updates, and while having a hauler alt hauling stuff, while another alt is lighting cynos and helping his alliance move around, etc, etc.

What you defined is a very specific and narrow case of multiboxing, for which ISBoxer excelled, and that type of one man army thing may not be so great for game in PVP balance wise, I can completely agree that's something to be looked at.

But the above scenario I mentioned, which is pretty much what I mainly do with my multiple accounts - doing many different things in different places, is that really 'bad for the game'? or is that something 'CCP/legit players don't want'?

What I said above can be done without ISBoxer sure, and I do it without ISBoxer now, but ISBoxer's other functions that people do not talk about much was to have windows/interfaces displayed in customized format, it had very easy to set up multi window switching setup wizard, etc, that allowed you to monitor and switch between clients very easily.

Now, if they were all in the same fleet, flying 10~20 bombers and key broacasting to coordiate and alpha the opposition off with perfectly synced shot - sure, that's probably not good for game balance. But in the scenario I mentioned, having multiple pilots in multiple places doing different things - is that also what you 'legit' player does not want?

Notice that the discussion has 'moved on' a bit here. The OP specifically asked for 'key broadcasting' to come back, to which even former ISBoxer users came here and said 'no'. But there's another voice here that suggest some other functionalities of ISBoxer didn't really 'break' the game and feel that banning such specific uses is just restrictive.

So taking key broadcast away, and when you look at 'multiboxing' from a more general POV, not in really narrow and specific use case of fleet fights, is there really a problem?

When multiboxing 16 toons, 1 is a player character and the other 15 are essentially NPCs -- flawless in their coordination and execution, devoid of any characteristic that differentiate them.

I for one do not enjoy competing against NPCs-- it's not what makes EvE great. How would you feel when 15 NPCs started stripmining your belt? (or, 15 navy omen bots neatly anchored on FC and shot the primary all at the same time?).

It's kind of like voting in a democracy: why should 1 guy have 16 votes while I have only one? Because he's got better hardware to pull it off? Multiboxing is not helping the solo player -- it is in fact the nemesis of the real solo player. (same goes for alts by the way, but as long as there's a real player behind the console it doesn't come off as cheating. So that's okay then I guess).

Bottom line: what we want, are real players. Not bots. So no, you can't have your ISBox back.

I guess we're talking about overlays. So example I have 3 screens, with a 3rd party tool I can create a custom single screen which contains elements from the 3 original screens thus enabling me to control all 3 ships from one screen with a layout of my choosing.

Now with this there is no broadcasting involved. Everything still has to be done manually, the only difference is that you have a custom overlay which makes what you have on screen more efficient.

This is especially handy if you do not have a dedicated monitor per client or you don't have a massive monitor where you can multiple clients windowed one on screen without them looking like postage stamps.

I fully accept that it is very helpful.

I guess the problem lies in, can CCP detect the difference between this setup and somebody doing the same but using multi key broadcasting as well.

yes it is,, so please stop already

No to your stupid request. no to ISboxer and key broadcasting of any kind, should never have been allowed in the first place.