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why are people against "walking in stations"?

Author
Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
#81 - 2016-11-24 17:59:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Nana Skalski
Alphea Abbra
Project Promethion
#82 - 2016-11-24 22:02:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Alphea Abbra
Jotunspor wrote:
Alphea Abbra wrote:
Jotunspor wrote:
(...)But of course. What do i know? Right? (...)
I found the essential bit of the insane rambling. The part where you admitted that you don't know anything, and thus we can disregard the rest of your illogical, unintelligable, incoherent ramble.



Big smile And another one! It's cute, though. What the fanboys cling on to with an actual affection. Muffin...
I think the big difference is this: We're critical, analyse proposals and evaluate them on their merits and the dev.s prior shown abilities. We're not fanboys, rather the opposite.
I didn't expect someone with your intellect to be able to grasp the finer points, though. That you know close to nothing about EVE, its history, its players, or even the general trends of the MMO game world, has been made painfully obvious. You replacea real argument with "cute" and "fanboy". That might work (Though I doubt it) in other games, and not at all on the EVE forums.
Jotunspor
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#83 - 2016-11-25 02:29:51 UTC
Alphea Abbra wrote:
I think the big difference is this: We're critical, analyse proposals and evaluate them on their merits and the dev.s prior shown abilities. We're not fanboys, rather the opposite.
I didn't expect someone with your intellect to be able to grasp the finer points, though. That you know close to nothing about EVE, its history, its players, or even the general trends of the MMO game world, has been made painfully obvious. You replacea real argument with "cute" and "fanboy". That might work (Though I doubt it) in other games, and not at all on the EVE forums.


There is no argument. Because every time a fanboy or fanboy(s) are faced with nothing but logic distilled down to zero, they come up with random diarrhea to justify the garbage state of the product and/or company they defend with a personal affection. But I thoroughly enjoy it.

Damn. I guess all that education with Carl Sagan wasn't good enough to get me to know EVE. I knew I should've shown more initiative. Not "knowing" (lol) anything about EVE really absolves me of any credibility. Darn it all. I've only been playing the game for longer than an entire generation of video game consoles. I suppose I should have started playing since 2003. Then maybe it would change the fact that the game is missing many essential components to a video game. And that gamers and gaming journalism laughs at it on a regular basis. And that the game has become stagnant that it's only generating more flak from the gaming community. And that the "developers" (tweakers, really) do next to nothing, but come up with a bit more tools, changes to some rules/mechanics - and most of all - create new ships for players to use.

Oh... wait. It doesn't.


Shallanna Yassavi
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#84 - 2016-11-25 04:34:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Shallanna Yassavi

If they manage to actually deliver something which can MMO dogfight on the same scale as EVE, that might actually kill EVE. It's pretty unlikely they will be able to deliver it. Only thing is, when I first saw the kickstarter years ago, it talked about a game you could play both on and offline, and I think it talked about your offline progress translating into progress in the persistent universe, which means it would have committed a cardinal sin in Internet multiplayer games: trusting the client. I don't think Roberts quite understood the law of diminishing returns and how it applies to game development: someone may have 300M to throw at a game's development, but it's not going to be 100x the game of a game which only took 3M.

What that project *did* accomplish was to get people seriously thinking about stick-and-throttle games in space again. About the biggest commercial one was IL-2 Sturmovik (not in space). Another interesting one I know of was open-source Vegastrike, which has some seriously impressive capabilities, but is a pain to edit (and the devs have lives now). There was a fan total conversion of Freespace 2 called Wing Commander Saga, which was a nice linear game with a couple of serious random difficulty spikes.

A signature :o

Alphea Abbra
Project Promethion
#85 - 2016-11-25 08:05:01 UTC
Jotunspor wrote:
There is no argument. Because every time a fanboy or fanboy(s) are faced with nothing but logic distilled down to zero, they come up with random diarrhea to justify the garbage state of the product and/or company they defend with a personal affection. But I thoroughly enjoy it.
So this is a response to yourself? If it's an attempt to respond to why people are against WiS, it's incoherent.
You are either using a completely different definition of fanboys than everyone else, or you're mistaken.

Protip: Calling some of the people who most vocally attacked both the company and the product for 'fanboys' will get you first puzzled looks, then get you discredited. Whatever education you got with Carl Sagan, it should have prepared you to take a hard look at the evidence and evaluate that. I don't think you got an education with Carl Sagan - maybe you watched some of his videos on YouTube?
mkint
#86 - 2016-11-25 12:19:11 UTC
Alphea Abbra wrote:
Jotunspor wrote:
There is no argument. Because every time a fanboy or fanboy(s) are faced with nothing but logic distilled down to zero, they come up with random diarrhea to justify the garbage state of the product and/or company they defend with a personal affection. But I thoroughly enjoy it.
So this is a response to yourself? If it's an attempt to respond to why people are against WiS, it's incoherent.
You are either using a completely different definition of fanboys than everyone else, or you're mistaken.

Protip: Calling some of the people who most vocally attacked both the company and the product for 'fanboys' will get you first puzzled looks, then get you discredited. Whatever education you got with Carl Sagan, it should have prepared you to take a hard look at the evidence and evaluate that. I don't think you got an education with Carl Sagan - maybe you watched some of his videos on YouTube?

Dumb people use insults they see other people use without knowing what they mean. I think this guy saw his older 13 year old brother use "fanboy" as an insult once, and wants to feel like one of the big kids too. That's really the only way the babbling makes sense.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.

Flamespar
WarRavens
Imperium Eden
#87 - 2016-11-25 13:22:01 UTC
Walking in stations was a feature that was designed from the outset to cause battle hardened EVE veterans to wet their knickers at the very thought of introducing something new to the game.

It delivered.
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#88 - 2016-11-28 16:52:42 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
DaReaper wrote:
Ila Dace wrote:
Capsuleers would have to have a good reason to leave their capsules.

The problem with WiS is that it would be a completely different game. It would be something like a Star Wars Galaxies kind of thing (which I wouldn't mind), but it wouldn't be Spaceships & Spreadsheets.

Do I want avatar game play? Yes. Is it worth building in Eve? No.



i disagree, Avatar gameplay could have a lot of uses in eve. but ti needs ot be done right, and not ****


And CCP can't do it. They've proven that. Which leads me to this question that i'd really like an answer for:

How many times does CCP have to prove they can't do it before people just let it go? Like you said, it wasn't 18 months, it was 5 years, and MOST of the Jesus features they promised (member Atmospheric Flight, I member) never ever happen. how many more half decades do we want them to waste before trowing in the WiS towel?

Heck, at this point I'm starting to think the "player owned stargates" are going that way, when was the last time we heard of those?

So yea, how many times?



in an interview after alpha, Seagull mentioned expanding the cluster, so something is still there. Though at eve vegas i asked her 'i have a question about the 2014 vision' and her automatic response was 'is this about player build star gates?' it wasn;t. but after i asked my question and moved on i thought 'damn, now i want to know what she was going to say' lol

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.

DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#89 - 2016-11-28 16:56:01 UTC
Valkyrie Harkonnen wrote:
Please, dont bring Star Citizen here. That thing is one of the reasons the gaming industry is falling apart. Too many idiots paying for vaporware ends up with horrible broken games or even games that never see the light of the day.


Star Citizen is the greatest scam in the gaming industry. More than 100 million dollars for a vaporware. It created a cult of idiots.



correct, SC is NEVER coming out fully. Its a cluster **** of a train wreck. and if its ever released it will mostly die a painful death

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.

Tristan Valentina
Moira.
Villore Accords
#90 - 2016-11-28 19:34:38 UTC
Players buy Svipuls..... We have no idea how ROI works.

The big thing with walking in stations is that it was packaged up with some very pay to win conversations that where had internally in CCP. Gold ammo and the like for real money.

WIS is a casualty of the community of EVE making a very direct statement against pay to win elements in the game, and CCP course correcting to a place where the players are happy.

Anyone who says WIS is not content is full of it. There are tons of systems in EVE no one interacts directly with every single one of them. But if people are going to have any reason to interact with WIS it needs to not be controlled by the NEX.

WIS could have been cool but we will probably never see it. Stopped holding my breath a year ago, and look at me I am a Space Barbie.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#91 - 2016-11-28 20:15:50 UTC
Jotunspor wrote:
There is no argument. Because every time a fanboy or fanboy(s) are faced with nothing but logic distilled down to zero, they come up with random diarrhea to justify the garbage state of the product and/or company they defend with a personal affection. But I thoroughly enjoy it.
You've yet to display any logic, despite your boasts.

Vomiting the word fanboy at people who disagree with you isn't logic Roll

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

mkint
#92 - 2016-11-28 20:31:08 UTC
Tristan Valentina wrote:
Players buy Svipuls..... We have no idea how ROI works.

The big thing with walking in stations is that it was packaged up with some very pay to win conversations that where had internally in CCP. Gold ammo and the like for real money.

WIS is a casualty of the community of EVE making a very direct statement against pay to win elements in the game, and CCP course correcting to a place where the players are happy.

Anyone who says WIS is not content is full of it. There are tons of systems in EVE no one interacts directly with every single one of them. But if people are going to have any reason to interact with WIS it needs to not be controlled by the NEX.

WIS could have been cool but we will probably never see it. Stopped holding my breath a year ago, and look at me I am a Space Barbie.

I've still never seen a reason for WIS that isn't already fulfilled by CQ. Anything you *could* do there would be better done through an interface window, making WIS completely unnecessary. A slower more terrible way to do things. Even games that do it semi successfully (thinking warframe's relays) it would work better if it was done through menus.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.

Jenn aSide
Shinigami Miners
Already Replaced.
#93 - 2016-11-28 20:44:35 UTC
Jotunspor wrote:
Alphea Abbra wrote:
I think the big difference is this: We're critical, analyse proposals and evaluate them on their merits and the dev.s prior shown abilities. We're not fanboys, rather the opposite.
I didn't expect someone with your intellect to be able to grasp the finer points, though. That you know close to nothing about EVE, its history, its players, or even the general trends of the MMO game world, has been made painfully obvious. You replacea real argument with "cute" and "fanboy". That might work (Though I doubt it) in other games, and not at all on the EVE forums.


There is no argument. Because every time a fanboy or fanboy(s) are faced with nothing but logic distilled down to zero, they come up with random diarrhea to justify the garbage state of the product and/or company they defend with a personal affection. But I thoroughly enjoy it.

Damn. I guess all that education with Carl Sagan wasn't good enough to get me to know EVE. I knew I should've shown more initiative. Not "knowing" (lol) anything about EVE really absolves me of any credibility. Darn it all. I've only been playing the game for longer than an entire generation of video game consoles. I suppose I should have started playing since 2003. Then maybe it would change the fact that the game is missing many essential components to a video game. And that gamers and gaming journalism laughs at it on a regular basis. And that the game has become stagnant that it's only generating more flak from the gaming community. And that the "developers" (tweakers, really) do next to nothing, but come up with a bit more tools, changes to some rules/mechanics - and most of all - create new ships for players to use.

Oh... wait. It doesn't.




Watch out Y'all, he played the Carl Sagan card. We're wrong and he's right, because Carl Sagan card trumps all.
PopeUrban
El Expedicion
Flames of Exile
#94 - 2016-11-28 21:43:28 UTC  |  Edited by: PopeUrban
People aren't against WIS really.

They're against WIS taking priority over the spaceship game when the spaceship game is still in need of modernization.

Most people are just fine with WIS being a thing that exists, but not being a thing CCP expends effort on when other spaceship game things (structure revamp, certain balance things) are in bad shape.

There is some hope for WIS fans though. We are rapidly approaching the end of the known bits of Seagull's master plan. In fact we're like 2 or 3 sets of structures and some module tiericide away. You could see us reach the end of that master plan within a year at the current rate of development, depending on how involved the mechanics for "beyond player controlled gates" are.

That, combined with all of the existing art assets from the old WIS prototypes, DUST, and Legion/Nova which they still have people working on could realistically spell a future for WIS as early as maybe 2018. by that point the backlog of "**** that is still really broken about EVE" looks to be wrapped up and they've got a substantial pile of assets to spit and polish for all the the functionality that has been added to the graphics engine since Incarna.
Lothar Mandrake
Mandrake Industries
Mandrake Alliance
#95 - 2016-11-29 05:17:02 UTC
Walking in stations? Screw that. I want to walk on Temperate planets!

-

Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
#96 - 2016-11-29 07:41:09 UTC
Oh yes, at least something like a base on planet, with market, and stuff. Visitable with Nova characters too. Like a common lobby. With strippers and blackjack. Sights of alien nature intermingled with a hazard den. There is so much to explore in that direction.
Josef Djugashvilis
#97 - 2016-11-29 08:02:41 UTC
WiS simply never had any content to offer.

The only real player suggestion was to introduce station gambling.

This is a good a reason as any not to have WiS.

This is not a signature.

Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
#98 - 2016-11-29 08:10:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Nana Skalski
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:
WiS simply never had any content to offer.

The only real player suggestion was to introduce station gambling.

This is a good a reason as any not to have WiS.

It had a lot to offer, primarily for social interactions, but also for exploration, as a new module. Gambling with ISK as only one of them interactions. Pleasure hub all the way.
Jill Xelitras
Xeltec services
#99 - 2016-11-29 14:43:26 UTC
Valkin Mordirc wrote:
CPP had the molecule, a bit of meme for the ingame community now, that had a real world cost of 50 USD which most players thought the price of which was ridiculous,


I'm not usually one to split atoms, but I have to point out that the molecule was actually a monocle and it cost the equivalent of 75 USD.

Now let me check the past 4 pages if anyone else noticed this minor spelling mistake. I so hate being late to the party.

Don't anger the forum gods.

ISD Buldath:

> I Saw, I came, I Frowned, I locked, I posted, and I left.

Jill Xelitras
Xeltec services
#100 - 2016-11-29 15:58:50 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Jotunspor wrote:



Watch out Y'all, he played the Carl Sagan card. We're wrong and he's right, because Carl Sagan card trumps all.


I thought The Donald trumps ... no ?

Don't anger the forum gods.

ISD Buldath:

> I Saw, I came, I Frowned, I locked, I posted, and I left.