EVE General Discussion

Why can't links be used exactly?

There is nothing about the boosting changes that prevents hem being used at all.

One of the more original ideas to be posted, however thinking of ways this could be exploited, how do you stop it becoming an LP farm?

Based on what is outlined so far, it would be possible to make an alt Corp, use that Corp to wardec the main Corp and then farm LP all day.

same way as you do in FW

the isk to LP ratio is less than the LP earned from the ship

and LP you get is based off the ship. not entirely sure the exact numbers, but it works out in the end for FW without being exploitable (bit like ship insurance and bounty payouts. what you get is less than ship's worth)

It's an interesting idea (but I'm no game designer) and would be worth a thread in F&I to look at it more and calculate some example LP rewards based on some war reports.

question, what about those players not interested in pvp who are in highsec?

also, players who are interested in PvP, why would they be in highsec? when lowsec is the place you go for PvP.
the only people in highsec are those who are not interested in PvP at the time. Gankers might claim to be pvpers, but they only shoot those who don't have a chance to fight back.

thats the thing i just don't understand. these people who say they are "creating content" in highsec......by dragging something designed for lowsec into highsec (FW has suffered alot due to people not pvping in lowsec....every high sec ganker is a person who isn't creating content for FW, and thus murdering PvP)

i understand there are a few legit wardecs for corps who are truely at war (usually in nullsec) and who want to attack members of the enemy corp even in highsec.
and for that, wardec is fine

FW gets it by default with no need to wardec as war target is already set up regardless of where i go.


but overall, the spamming of wardecs, and ganking of carebears(i say carebears, not people linked to nullsec entities) just takes potential PvP content away from the game. (and i feel this majorly in FW as during the european prime time....Caldari space around me is basically empty of caldari forces.....and yet gallente are all over. then come NA prime time, caldari everywhere and decent fights all around as it should be.


imagine if all the highsec gankers and wardec spammers entered FW. how much content would be created. (they don't even need to stay in lowsec. go highsec and kill enemy faction gate guns or security craft. hunt the enemy FW players who are in their empire's highsec. )


plus, when you enter a FW corp, any from the enemy faction can attack you anywhere. including highsec. its pvp done right. cause the only people in a FW corp are those who want to fight, even in highsec.

I don't like the idea of a war following a specific person, but I do like the idea of disallowing war dodging. I have my indy alts, so I has feels for the rest of you carebears out there. Back in the day, war dodging was considered bannable... dunno what the story is now.

In either case, I think the OP is going about it the wrong way (probably in order to get more targets.... fair ). I think the better solution would be to have a cooldown timer on leaving corp if you have a dec dropped on you, similar to how you have a cooldown on dropping roles. I'd say the length should probably be 48 hours, minimum, to cover the 24 hour warm up time for the war going active, and then 24 hours worth of target time on whatever characters want to bail. No weird edge cases with people shifting corps here and there, NPC corps, etc.; no ridiculously one-sided buff, and still keeps players at least partially accountable for wars.

That being said, I do also think the wardec system is ridiculously abused. It is very cheap and easy to start a war on 10 random corps coming in and out of market hubs just to get kills for a week. I would love to see it used more for legitimate tactical reasons only, i.e. shutting down logistics backbone for a corp/alliance rather than stopping a small corp of traders/alts by a 4 man gang, which usually ends up being 2 or 3. I don't think just modifying the cost curve would do that.

that wouldn't help

that would jsut mean they don't undock till the cooldown is done.

and would just play alts.


as people have stated over and over. if people don't want to be murdered by the giant ass gank fleet sitting outside their station, they simply won't play.


if it becomes a common occurance. they might leave the game.....which is a loss for CCP. and for the real PvP community, as that player might one day have gotten into PvP in their own time.


heck i'm an example of that. it took me a long time to get into PvP, i only went into FW when i felt ready.(and thats after a failed nullsec corp experience)

had i been forced into it by the constant war decs(and this cooldown you mention), i would have left.
hell i nearly did, its only me getting this char that prevented me.


i used to have an older character (25mill SP) who move through 15 corps over the course of 2 months. all of them 8-26 person small corps. and all of them war decced soon after i went into jita. (operated out of jita back then. this was september last year to december)

so i stuck to NPC corps for a month(freaking 10% tax...and not appealing to not be "clan mates" with friends)

joined a corp....and immediately got war decced.
frustrated, sold the character to the CEO of the corp and prepared to quit.


quit for 2 weeks, made a new char, saw this char. bought it. was still tempted to not return.
thankfully the spam had died down (for me) at that point.


if the spam had continued, well playign the game out of a NPC corp doesn't build that sense of "comradeship" i like.



in short, if someone doesn't want to PvP, and they stick to highsec. then they won't. they'll leave corp, and if they can't do that cause a "cooldown". they'll quit.

I think you missed the bit about adjusting the cost curve - what I probably didn't express clearly enough is I do think the cost needs to be adjusted to make it more prohibitive to wardec spamming, but not enough to completely throw wars out as valid gameplay tactics.

What about players who aren't interested in PvE/Industry/Trade who live wherever? Why am I being forced to make money to buy the ships while being at the mercy of industrials/traders when all I want to do is blow up ships? I'm not being serious, of course - I completely accept that I cannot just completely opt out of three major parts of the game. Everything in Eve is interwoven one way or another. But the same is the case for players not interested in PvP - they can try to avoid it to the best of their abilities, but they cannot just opt out.

Again - I am perfectly fine with people just dropping corp if they don't want to fight. That way the opposing party can see what's up and just move on. This works both against those who actively hunt , and those who prefer to hubhump all day, but of course it also means to forgo the right to set taxes, have structures, offices and so on. But as I said before - Eve is a game where a claim to special privileges can be challenged, and if a corp is not willing or able to fight for those privileges it should not have them.


See, you just defined Hisec as a no-PvP-zone, and I can't tell where you got that idea.

This is a very narrow mindset. Who said that Losec is the only place to PvP in Eve? There's PvP of all different kinds in Hi, Lo, Null and Wormhole Space, and each of those has a different set of rules and allows for different playstyles. The interesting part of Hisec is, that there's a very strict set of rules. In Lo, Null and Wormhole Space, everyone who is not blue, green or purple can shoot you. In Hisec you can ignore the majority of players and concentrate on those you want to kill. Chasing a target half way through empire space, losing him and picking back up the scent can be quite thrilling, as can be running away, trying to lure your pursuers into a trap. But with no way of telling whether the person you are chasing or running from is even still online this has gotten much less worthwhile.

People *want* to PvP in Hisec, and CCP keeps encouraging them by preaching that no place is safe in New Eden. The increase in hubhumping and ganking is in parts at least a symptom of changes that have been made to the hunting playstyle, but they are by no means the only playstyle possible in hisec.


Gankers *are* PvPers. They are playing against other players. Whether those are willing or able to shoot back does not change that fact. Now, I personally am not too fond of the ganking playstyle, and I rarely take part in it, but it is a valid playstyle nonetheless, and yes, it is PvP.


Well, in my book, about everyone engaging in player interactions of any kind creates content. Ganking encourages players to think about their fits and fly with a friend who can web their freighter into warp, hubhumpers encourage scouting and finding alternate routes, and hunters encourage the use of mecenary services which in turn makes hunting much more interesting.


Quite the contrary, wars create PvP content. Mercenary-type gameplay wouldn't even exist if wardecs weren't a thing. Players focused on the high sec hunter/mercenary playstyle wouldn't just pour into FW were wardecs not a thing, just like players who want to mine in highsec wouldn't just go to lowsec if highsec was taken away. Most of them would probably just stop playing because their playstyle doesn't exist.

While still limited to two groups, FW - even in Hisec simply is not the same. If I declare war on a corporation in Hisec, I know this corp, and I want to deal with this corp specifically. Maybe because I don't like the CEOs face, maybe because I don't like them being in my turf, maybe because I get paid to try and murder them. Whatever the case may be, I am not fighting a random nobody who just happened to click a button to join a faceless crowd of people fighting in an artificially created tug of war.

And my point of criticism is that exactly this smallscale playstyle (as opposed to hubhumping/ganking) has been made very difficult and barely worthwhile over the last couple of years.

I hear this argument brought up a lot in these kinds of threads- miners hiring mercs to drive competitors out of business.
It sounds really cool and would restore some faith in humanity if these things occurred regularly, it's just...this sounds so out of character for every miner I have ever met in this game. Does it really happen that often?