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[Ascension] Capital Ship and Upwell Structure Blueprint Adjustments

First post
Author
Messenger Of Truth
Butlerian Crusade
#21 - 2016-11-12 10:16:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Messenger Of Truth
If you feel that some blueprints manufacturing time has got too low, then perhaps this same change needs to be applied to *all* blueprints. The general TE ramp-up that we may be seeing over the last 2 years may only cause more product categories to be flooded. I'm not sure if across the board TE-increases is healthy.

So I wonder if every blueprint should get a 30% TE reduction due to the introduction of ECs witih silly levels of bonuses.

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Visit "Haulers Channel" in game for all matters courier-related.

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Careby
#22 - 2016-11-12 11:59:50 UTC
Messenger Of Truth wrote:
...So I wonder if every blueprint should get a 30% TE reduction due to the introduction of ECs witih silly levels of bonuses.


Starting a year long research job in a destructible EC is not without risk.


Z1gy
Vindicator Corporation
#23 - 2016-11-12 14:26:16 UTC
so 33% percent increase and correct me if my math is wrong

to get an archon BPO from ME9 to ME10 now would take me 343 days 6 hour 53 minutes and 20 sec in high sec station

add that 33% after patch would make that around 456 days in a high sec station?

Vaughn Blackleg
Three Ring Labs
#24 - 2016-11-12 15:28:11 UTC
Fozzie, Please, whatever you do with the prints thats fine, but please can we get stacking BPC's for the Capital components. Please. Have you tried to count out copies for a Titan ?? Painfull. Shocked
Mai Khumm
172.0.0.1
#25 - 2016-11-12 17:05:12 UTC
With another change forcing players into Engineering Complexes, and this one being a shiny one. I'm happy I don't do large scale/Capital Industry to begin with!
Lupercus Mars
Hawking Applied Sciences Institute
#26 - 2016-11-12 18:22:44 UTC
Mai Khumm wrote:
With another change forcing players into Engineering Complexes, and this one being a shiny one. I'm happy I don't do large scale/Capital Industry to begin with!


as someone who does capital industry, this is a good change. Befor this change we where looking at supers beeing build in 8 days and titans in 16 days. Which is just stupid lol
Tipa Riot
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2016-11-12 23:13:40 UTC
CCP, can you please check the invention time of the Industrial Core II, on SiSi and TQ it says for me 10 day. Shocked This can't be right for a ~100M item?

I'm my own NPC alt.

Careby
#28 - 2016-11-12 23:36:26 UTC
Tipa Riot wrote:
CCP, can you please check the invention time of the Industrial Core II, on SiSi and TQ it says for me 10 day. Shocked This can't be right for a ~100M item?


You're not supposed to tell anyone it's on TQ!
Covering YrBack
Wolfspack
UNREAL Alliance
#29 - 2016-11-13 00:29:27 UTC
I dont really understand the trend to **** in players face , but whatever.
If you wanted to buy some supercapital bpo and research it - forget.
Supercapital arrays become dead cargo , cause nobody would risk building supercapital if it takes 2 months on it.
No idea why this affects dreads faxes and carriers since they are expendable one way ticket ships.
If you want to lower supercapital ships percentage in game then you should make fighting points where they can be used.
Since supers will be no longer build on posses , you take off a part of game which required severe scouting and tracking for these posses, cause citadels can be easily found in space.
There are few contracts with leviathan/hel copies and now you want to make it worse ?
Tipa Riot
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#30 - 2016-11-13 08:25:46 UTC
Careby wrote:
Tipa Riot wrote:
CCP, can you please check the invention time of the Industrial Core II, on SiSi and TQ it says for me 10 day. Shocked This can't be right for a ~100M item?


You're not supposed to tell anyone it's on TQ!

Why?
The T2 item is not listed in the market yet, but everybody can simulate the invention. I was not expecting it to actually work, so didn't try ... however if you can start the invention already now, this would be an explanation for the extra time, to make sure the BPC does not come into existence before Tuesday. Did CCP ever do this kind of move before, without notice?

Clarification is required.

I'm my own NPC alt.

Jack Oat
Brothers In Arms.
#31 - 2016-11-13 13:35:19 UTC
CCP Please,

Allow some grace period of a week or two,
to allow players to actually build at least some new infrastructure.

Regards,
Jack
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#32 - 2016-11-13 14:05:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Rivr Luzade
Fozzie and the CSM, how about you use your time more constructively instead? I have something that needs fixing: Sort the god damn list entries in the component section in Blueprints alphabetically! Their sorting is completely random and a mess, whereas everywhere else things are properly sorted in alphabetic order. This has been an issue for over many years now!

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.

Maenth
The Thirteen Provinces
#33 - 2016-11-14 02:15:27 UTC
Rivr Luzade wrote:
Fozzie and the CSM, how about you use your time more constructively instead? I have something that needs fixing: Sort the god damn list entries in the component section in Blueprints alphabetically! Their sorting is completely random and a mess, whereas everywhere else things are properly sorted in alphabetic order. This has been an issue for over many years now!

Same with the list of facilities in the industry panel drop-down menu

Drones. Drones are a means to an end. An end to the ruthless Caldari 'progress' machines. An end to the barbaric 'redemption' proposed by the Amarr. What they see as chaos shall be my perfect order, merely beyond their comprehension.

Lightning Q
Quantum Dominion
Event Horizon.
#34 - 2016-11-14 10:38:41 UTC
Ellowah

Since I build the normal caps I can agree on longer manufactering times for the carriers/dreads.
The market got saturated (for some caps) after the latest expantions.

However longer ME & TE research I do NOT agree on, it already takes years to get these bpo's researched.
Let alone before the BPO + research is earned back.

Copying I can agree on, since if people will be building less caps less bpc's will be needed, or risk an oversuply of BPC's.
And it's better to sell coppies at a proper price then trowing them away for a few mil.

And indeed sort the Required Materials list alphabeticly ! how hard can that be :p

No experience with supers or titans so can't comment on those %
Messenger Of Truth
Butlerian Crusade
#35 - 2016-11-14 10:47:25 UTC
Careby wrote:
Messenger Of Truth wrote:
...So I wonder if every blueprint should get a 30% TE reduction due to the introduction of ECs witih silly levels of bonuses.


Starting a year long research job in a destructible EC is not without risk.


Only if you don't bother to log in and cancel the job during the 8+days between your EC being first attacked and being destroyed!

Trade Hub Price Checker: stop.hammerti.me.uk/pricecheck

Visit "Haulers Channel" in game for all matters courier-related.

Structure name/system API: stop.hammerti.me.uk/api

Careby
#36 - 2016-11-14 12:00:10 UTC
Messenger Of Truth wrote:
Careby wrote:
Starting a year long research job in a destructible EC is not without risk.


Only if you don't bother to log in and cancel the job during the 8+days between your EC being first attacked and being destroyed!



Canceling research jobs accomplishes nothing. Assuming you don't do your research in wormhole space, the BPO is not at risk either way. But the job installation cost and the time spent researching are lost when the structure is destroyed OR when you cancel the job. I don't know about you, but for me the risk of losing months of research on expensive blueprints is at least something to consider when choosing between EC and station.

For manufacturing jobs, canceling won't save you anything either, but it does deny the attacker a chance at some loot.

Vald Tegor
Empyrean Guard
Tactical Narcotics Team
#37 - 2016-11-15 03:07:32 UTC
So ME 9 to 10 on a titan blueprint will take 1313 days * .3472 = 455 days (- a month or so for the 5% implant) in a destructible facility. New entities seeking to enter this level of gameplay are going to be thrilled!

Good thing some people have grandfathered ME10 blueprints that were handed to them a couple years back.

Build time? Sure. Copy? Yeah, it encourages people to get more blueprints in general and deters the ability of the grandfathered few to saturate the market with perfect copies.

Research? If the bonuses are too strong, the bonuses are too strong and it will affect markets wider than this change. Why arbitrarily increase it for these particular blueprints, instead of toning down the bonuses, or a proper balance pass on blueprints?

If the change does not affect components, only the hulls, will it have the desired result? Particularly in the regular cap department? The research change will only delay the inevitable of producers getting additional hull prints up to acceptable levels. Then it's back to current production rates using their current, researched component library. It does more to handicap new producers entering the market than lower overall production rates, or prevent a would-be increase.
GeeBee
Backwater Redux
Tactical Narcotics Team
#38 - 2016-11-15 03:18:15 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hi folks.

With the upcoming release of Engineering Complexes in Ascension, we're taking the opportunity to look at the build/research/copy times of some of the largest blueprints in EVE. This will help ensure that production rates don't get too out of control with the bonuses on the new structures, and also generally cleans up some of the progression of build times between smaller and larger items.

The current plan is:

  • Titan/Supercarrier blueprints: +100% build/research/copy time
  • Carrier/Dread/Force Aux/Rorqual blueprints: +33% build/research/copy time
  • All Upwell Structure blueprints: +33% build/research/copy time


Shout of the the CSM for helping ensure this stayed on our radar.

Let us know what you think in this thread.
Thanks!


I would like to request the 100% research time on Titan/Supercarrier blueprints not be implemented - no research time increase or at max 33% research time increase is needed. The Market for researching Super/Titan BPO's has been borked ever since Greyscale Nuked the old ME/PE system and converted to this new system. The time and cost of researching blueprints from the old system to the new system is already out of line. This simply reinforces the balance of power in the game to older players.

I'm not going to do the math to show the work but you're making a huge mistake here. I agree with the copy times and build times but not research times, that is already way too high and too long.

Until there is at least some form of incremental progress on the levels of the blueprints I strongly suggest this be reconsidered.
Tasuku Furukawa
SAKUMA DROP
Caladrius Alliance
#39 - 2016-11-15 15:47:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Tasuku Furukawa
I am disappointed that research time is increased by Ascension update. Sad

Why you force new manufacturer to further burden ?

I can't understand ! Twisted

Japanese DUST and EVE player.Character name is DJIPS/Tasuku Furukawa.

Kenrailae
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#40 - 2016-11-15 16:29:41 UTC
Vaughn Blackleg wrote:
Fozzie, Please, whatever you do with the prints thats fine, but please can we get stacking BPC's for the Capital components. Please. Have you tried to count out copies for a Titan ?? Painfull. Shocked



This^

The Law is a point of View

The NPE IS a big deal

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