Player Features and Ideas Discussion

And if you were to watch the roundtable you would see that the Merc community (or those of us present) unilaterally agree with you about this

Hi as a new player I could add some new thoughts about the wardeck issue that those two groups arguing here might not see.

My personal experinces were these:

- huge number of groups and solo players ganking new players in highsec, they are picking up t1 industrials, they do not care about obvious botting freighters on autopilot route (hows that it still flies CPP?) and all of that outside the war

- EVE basically forces new player to join a new corporation and all over the starting areas are mobile depots aiming for new players to join a corporation. Nowhere is written that then you can get war anytime and newbies are a target no.1 in any war because they lacks knowledge of how to recognize they are in warl, with whom etc.

- players declaring a wars/ganking are years and miles stronger by skills and experience than their target. I have yet to see a wardeck between two similarly strong corporations. So far it was always bigger/older/more experienced corp declaring a war to small/new/non pvp corps only

- ganking corps are declaring multiple wars (probably max) in order to get higher chance of finding a war target in the area where they gank. They do not care about fighting, they just want to gank a lonely target in highsec

- ganking corps are joining into multiple wars as ally in order to avoid wardeck limits and payments, again for same purpose

- majority of the wardecked corp players are either sitting in station till war ends or they leave corporation

- if a structure is packed up, there is no winner or loser in war and majority of wars ends with concord "length safety mechanism"


The problem here is that there are no safety mechanism. Yes eve is unique in a way its harsh world where all kind of things are possible, but does it mean the current system is perfect? Hardly.

I don't know how it should work, thing is that eve is so different that mechanisms from other games would probably not worked here at all.

However starting with notifying player that entering a corporation will then expose him to be part of the war an PvP and not "forcing new player into corporations" by opportunity system would be a good start.

Other games usually have multiple safety systems such as that too big corporation cannot declare war to small corporation (varios methods of calculating that, not just per number of members). However thats not going to work here since basically every big corp has a detached small corps operating under different terms or in certain region.

And I am not sure what does fighting for some objective as proposed by OP helps here. It will still come to the fact that the one who declares a war knows in advance they are stronger/smarter and are going to win. So essentially nothing would have changed in most of the wardecks, the weaker side would not fight.

But maybe its a good start. There would be less wardecks and it might help against the kind of war my corp is in atm where 2 players are camping our hg sectors in cloak whole day preventing us to mine and waiting for lonely mining/industry to appear in a time of day where we won't outnumber them. Once we group up they just use cloak in their safe spot and goes afk. Very funny.

i actually agree with you on this . theres to many guys with no leadership skills recruiting newbros with no plans for pilot safety . all it leads to is the new player having a bad experiance of eve and quiting before theve even really started

id highly recommend him and his friends join EVE UNIVERSITY so the can learn game in a competant enviroment

Again with this lie that EvE is a "PvP" (insert traditional shoot each other in the face definition) game.
EvE is a sandbox that has many play styles and yes PvP is one of those play styles. In fact given that most items in EvE are player made and that CCP is pushing the game even further in that direction one could argue that resource procurement and manufacturing are the single most important play styles in EvE because without them you would have no ships to fly and no weapons and ammo to shoot people with.


News flash this is a game we ALL play for enjoyment, when there is no enjoyment in it people stop playing.
Wondering if you read the article in this link, it mentions that there needs to be an element of enjoyment for both sides in the war dec equation. I have not had time to sit and watch the video yet but one would surmise that this mention of an element of enjoyment came from the video of the warr dec round table, if that is correct then even the collected group of CSM and players involved would disagree with you on the enjoyment for both sides aspect of war decs.

But hey if you want to continually see the rosters of the corps you waste ISK to war dec reduced to zero because of dodging tactics hey I am OK with that I am perhaps one of EvE's greatest war dec dodgers, I have had lots of practice and frustrated a lot of war dec players along the way. You simply cannot imagine how much fun it is to un-dock a blingy mission ship right in full view of those who just a few minutes ago were your aggressors in a war dec knowing that there is nothing they can do that will not get them destroyed by Concord and knowing full well that because NPC corp you cannot be war decced. On the other hand if you want to actually see some war in your war decs I suggest that a change of attitude may be in order.

I just play it to murder and get murdered in null sec
I don't see why you have to force others to lower their enjoyment just so you can have yours
Also I don't see why undocking in a mission ship after dodging feels good, it means they won and were able to inconvenience you
I don't need war in war decs, I get my pvp elsewhere

Last I heard locator agents still work pretty well on tracking down targets and such. So does doing your own research on where players might be before initiating war decs.

Playing EVE has basically screwed up my view into other games permanently, and probably in a good way.

I play Warframe quite a bit, because I can play it in "small bites" as these days my attention span is lacking, and you would not believe how much petty complaining goes on in that game, a game may I add, totally free, and that is totally non competitive in any way, but they still feel entitled about everything.

EVE revolves around making other people lose more stuff then you. Regardless of what "measures" you choose to put in place, it does not change that fact, and people will just find new ways to workaround your trying to stop them.

Even if Wardeccing was made impossible in Hisec, dedicated people would just move to infiltrating Corps and just stealing all your stuff that way. It is just the EVE way.

I agree somewhat that Wardeccing is being used as a one-trick pony in many cases just so some Corps can keep their own Hisec safety and kill at will, but I honestly don't know how to make that more manageable.

I kind of dislike the current system in the same way I dislike the bounty system, where basically it has to be examined from the point of view that people with too much time on their hands will just find way to abuse it. Heck, look at how Faction Warfare was manipulated once to be just an ISK printing machine.

I don't think that word means what you think it means.

But really, the only people who ever though the cost scaling system was a good idea were special interest groups that are large and wanted it to be as expensive as possible to declare war on them.

Specifically it was the former CEO of E-UNI who was a CSM member at the time when the inferno war declaration changes were being designed and under whose leadership E-UNI had been engaging in activities to artificially inflate the cost of declaring war on them. There's no doubt in my mind that Kelduum Revaan is personally responsible for the existence of this mechanic which neither the people declaring war, nor the vast majority of the people on whom war tends to be declared think is fair or reasonable.

The cost element of wars seems arse about face. A wardec is basically bribing CONCORD to ignore aggressive acts. The cost of the wardec should maybe be some fixed cost plus an amount that is a function of the difference between the number of members in the corp.

E.g. a 10 man corp is wardecced by a 100 man corp. The fixed cost is say 50 mil, then another 1 mil per each player the aggressor has more than the defender, so in this example an additional 90 mil. This is effectively paying CONCORDto ignore each member of the corp.

The numbers are just for example, the principle being that a small corp attacking a large corp pays the base cost. A large corp attacking a small corp pays a lot more. Even sized corp wars would pay roughly the base cost.

This would allow small dedicated merc companies to flourish, but also give a corp with mumbers to fight back against such corps.
The allies mechanism would need to go though. If another corp wants to help you they should also wardec the opponent. This makes being an ally a real decision with associated risk and cost.

Potentially tie this to a method for a defender to 'win' and wars would hopefully become more two-sided affairs that all can feel invested in.

Let me re-phrase that for you so that it more accurately conveys the real situation and your real meaning.

As a PvP player my fun is more important that your fun as a PvE player.

Yet another of the tired, old and to be honest ridiculous comments we get from members of the war dec groups.
And one has to wonder if you are so concerned about fun why do you ruin other players ability to have fun by declaring war on them? Oh silly me I forgot you are a PvP player and YOUR fun is more important than those you war dec.


No body has EVER inconvenience me in this game and no one EVER WILL, I have to many alts that can do the same thing this character can, alts you could spend decades trying to find but never will.
Mine and the industrial characters and activities of the group of real life friends I fly with are buried under so many layers of alts, alt corps and the use of NPC stations as well as low sec that you and every other war dec player in the game combined will NEVER be able to find them much less disrupt them, so there is no inconvenience there either. And while we go about the things we do unhindered by your useless war decs we do so with the knowledge that it cost you (or someone else) at least 50 mil per week for the privilege of failing miserably at trying to disrupt the things we do for fun and profit.

I did not expect people like you to understand the whole enjoyment of un-docking a blingy mission ship in front of those who had you war decced just a few minutes ago thing. And no they have not inconvenienced me, I am still getting to do EXACTLY what I want to do, not only that but I can do it right in front of them. To be short it is the ultimate f*** you kind of thing, you can try but you cannot affect me or my game play style.


Then one has to ask why do you care what happens to war decs if you do not need them to get your PvP?