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CCP! Please clarify the future plans for WiS!

First post
Author
Soulpirate
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#2621 - 2012-01-17 20:12:26 UTC
Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:
Issler Dainze wrote:


I find this a very unsettling "throw the WiS fans a bone to shut them up" kind of answer.



I was really responding to this...I find this to be uncalled for despite everything we have gotten from the Dev's at this point.

Agreed.
oldbutfeelingyoung
Perkone
Caldari State
#2622 - 2012-01-17 21:24:17 UTC
Issler Dainze wrote:
CCP Bayesian wrote:
Rek Seven wrote:
CCP Bayesian wrote:
Time for some new information on our plans.

The effort is being led by a new, small team inventively named Team Avatar. We're tasked with maintenance and improvement of existing systems, developing new features for the Captains Quarters, NeX Store and Character Creator and prototyping multiplayer gameplay for Incarna. Our top priority after dealing with defects that are live on TQ is to come up with a solid vision and find the gameplay for future work on a multiplayer Incarna release.

We are interested in your ideas and will trawl this epic thread to see what you guys have been discussing. Any more suggestions would be good to put in the Features & Ideas Discussion forum just so that they are more visible to us.


I would be grateful if you could clarify...

I assume that you're main tasks for now will revolve around improvements to the performance and aesthetics of CQ/avatars but when you say that you will be prototyping multiplayer gameplay for incarna, are you talking about multiplayer features that with be brought to the existing CQ experience or are you referring to the creation of a new area specifically designed for multiplayer interaction?

This may help when we are making suggestions


Basically, "our top priority after dealing with defects that are live on TQ is to come up with a solid vision and find the gameplay for future work on a multiplayer Incarna release". From my perspective anything we do has to be compelling and if we can find a compelling gameplay experience in expanding the CQ with multiplayer aspects then that is something we'd definitely look at. We are definitely going to be looking at letting you out of the CQ though as they'd get crowded pretty quickly. ;)


There have been tons of suggestions about "compelling" experiences that don't require some major "gameplay". Corp meeting room, dock viewing platforms, war planning rooms..... the list goes on. This sounds like the kind of answer that allows CCP to rationalize years and years of us being locked in the captains cell with nothing but new NEX store items being added. Even just letting other players in your CQ.

"Sorry players, for the third year we are unable come up with compelling ambulation, but look, new pants with a matching hat for $17.95 RL!"

I find this a very unsettling "throw the WiS fans a bone to shut them up" kind of answer.

Issler



come on Issler for now at least they got a small team on this
We all know bc of the sudden change of direction WIS is low on priority after FIS and that consolecrap called DUST
At least we got some attention from CCP


we have to wait and watch hat they will do an not what they say for now
we have to be patient ,we have a 5 man team now ,yesterday it was nothing or we did know nothing

R.S.I2014

Bloodpetal
Tir Capital Management Group
The Mockers AO
#2623 - 2012-01-17 21:51:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Bloodpetal
Someone recommended that WIS should be "Free to Play" and that to fly and earn skill points you have to use PLEX (Pilots License... makes perfect sense) - or subscribe of course.


That'd be a brilliant way to boost certain station activities and fill stations - and add new professions - passenger transport for capsuleers.

Meanwhile, providing certain players the opportunity to explore EVE and pay for it when they felt like it - providing a social experience for those who are interested in a SCI FI social experience.


Combined with some of the other ideas (included the ones I presented earlier) this would be a GREAT addition to EVE IMHO.

I know a lot of my friends would love to login to EVE without paying for it - and I could socialize with them and get them to work in a Bar, let's say, and socialize with other players.

Some would become "Traders" but not able to fly and would need transport pilots to move things for them, etc.


Highly recommended and great suggestion whoever came up with it. Consider DUST players will be Free 2 Play as well, and this becomes a great paradigm that makes sense across EVE and adding intrigue and an easy "Return value" for players who want to be part time EVE players - and for Bitter vets to complain at while sitting in bars telling tales of grandeur who don't want to play EVE for a few months to those souls who have never stepped off a station.

Where I am.

DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#2624 - 2012-01-17 21:57:34 UTC
Getting a little recognition from CCP is better than none. Especially when it's positive feedback pertaining to the topic of this thread. I'm glad CCP is active again with the community and I look forward to them continuing to do so.

We need to continue showing our support and let CCP fully develop some WiS game play content without being rushed.


On a side note, got half a mind to go back thru this thread, quote all the anti WiS posters (They know who they are) and give em a real big juicy "Told you so" middle finger salute. However I'm sure there's no need for that at this time.

Hmmm, time to stop fooling myself, I do feel the need. - 'Neener neener neener', (big loud razz-berry), 'Told you so'. Bear
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation
The Honda Accord
#2625 - 2012-01-17 22:12:33 UTC
My point about this being a "throw us a bone answer" is simple. What we have been told that there are 5 folks, mostly in a maintenance capacity the only "new" WiS content is decorations for the Captains Cell and some new NEX stuff.

I am very happy we are being talked to but I'm disappointed in what I am hearing because I interpret the response as not much different that WiS is dead. They would have to have some folks maintaining WiS and mostly this is what it sounds like we have.

We are then told they are also trying to find a way to make ambulation "compelling" and "relevant". There were dozens of suggestions in this thread alone. If they think something simple wouldn't be a start says they could care less about anyone interested in RP.

What we are basically being told is that once again CCP is falling into the trap of thinking it has be some sort of big game play element. This lets them rationalize putting this off long term. Based on recent "major game play improvements" like the POCO I am not so confident their idea of compelling ambulation game play can be expected to be a good thing.

"Well sure, we could open the door but we don't think it would be compelling..... blah blah blah".

We don't need anything major, some common spaces would be simple and a good start. CCP, show us you actually will open the door and start with something simple. A corp lounge for example. Until I actually see some example of more than one of us in a room at once I don't believe CCP is intending to ever open the door (or even can with the current engine).

CCP, don't over think this, start simple, even if it is just some experiments on the test server to see what we think.

Issler

Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation
The Honda Accord
#2626 - 2012-01-17 22:13:48 UTC
And thanks everyone for making this the biggest thread on the new forums!!!

CCP, this should tell you there are folks paying you money that want that door opened in their lifetime.

Issler
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#2627 - 2012-01-17 22:19:05 UTC
CCP Bayesian wrote:
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
As for posting threads for WiS ideas in 'Features & Ideas Discussion' forum, there's already been quite a few different ones posted. It probably be a good idea if CCP made a sticky thread asking for players to post ideas for WiS gameplay content. Then the various ideas would all be located in one area for easy reference. However, while I was browsing the 'Features & Ideas Discussion' sub forum channel, I noticed there was a definite lack of interaction by CCP.


Thanks for taking the time to scour the sub-forum to find all those threads!

Hopefully you should see an uptake in participation as we really get rolling on this and throw some ideas and questions out. I'm reluctant to start commenting on specific ideas and their relative merits because there are literally almost as many as there are users posting on here. It can be too easy to get sucked into the rabbit hole. I think it's likely we will use that sub-forum to gain focused feedback though.


No problem, there's a lot more threads scattered throughout the different sub forums that contain ideas for WiS content, if you plan on making 'Features & Ideas Discussion' the main sub forum for this, probably be a good idea to post a 'Sticky' in each sub forum channel directing players to post there. Not everyone reads or posts in 'General Discussion' due to obvious reasons.
Flamespar
WarRavens
Imperium Eden
#2628 - 2012-01-17 22:46:50 UTC
Is it worthwhile starting an Incarna version of the 'papercuts' thread? There are a number of small tweaks to the captains quarters itself that I think would be worthwhile (for example being able to disable the tutorial adverts on the screens, or have them disable themselves once you've done them, or once your character reaches a certain age).
Flamespar
WarRavens
Imperium Eden
#2629 - 2012-01-17 22:52:17 UTC
Also the 'war room' idea is epic. Whomever came up with that idea is surely a visionary and should quickly be offered employment at CCP. :P
Indahmawar Fazmarai
#2630 - 2012-01-17 23:15:38 UTC
Issler Dainze wrote:
My point about this being a "throw us a bone answer" is simple. What we have been told that there are 5 folks, mostly in a maintenance capacity the only "new" WiS content is decorations for the Captains Cell and some new NEX stuff.

I am very happy we are being talked to but I'm disappointed in what I am hearing because I interpret the response as not much different that WiS is dead. They would have to have some folks maintaining WiS and mostly this is what it sounds like we have.

We are then told they are also trying to find a way to make ambulation "compelling" and "relevant". There were dozens of suggestions in this thread alone. If they think something simple wouldn't be a start says they could care less about anyone interested in RP.

What we are basically being told is that once again CCP is falling into the trap of thinking it has be some sort of big game play element. This lets them rationalize putting this off long term. Based on recent "major game play improvements" like the POCO I am not so confident their idea of compelling ambulation game play can be expected to be a good thing.

"Well sure, we could open the door but we don't think it would be compelling..... blah blah blah".

We don't need anything major, some common spaces would be simple and a good start. CCP, show us you actually will open the door and start with something simple. A corp lounge for example. Until I actually see some example of more than one of us in a room at once I don't believe CCP is intending to ever open the door (or even can with the current engine).

CCP, don't over think this, start simple, even if it is just some experiments on the test server to see what we think.

Issler



My own personal guess is that Incarna was never a feature. They were working on WoD so they needed that technology, so they developed it and then they co-opted it for EVE, or tried so. But, in a deep level, Incarna never existed and the "Forever EVE" vid was PR bullshit. There never were WiS plans, but Wod plans and using EVE as a test ground for that technology.

Now they can't develop WoD and WiS is back to square one. They don't even have any multiplayer technology for the CQ.

My hunch is that WiS is vaporware... now with 5 poor devs thrown at it to keep us happy talking about it, but, not something really in the plans once that WoD has been shelved sine die.

Now i am gonna parse through the minutes, but don't expect anything good coming out of them.
Che Biko
Alexylva Paradox
#2631 - 2012-01-17 23:41:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Che Biko
Note: This is for a large part a rewrite from a few pages back, done because CCP Bayeshian will (hopefully) notice the questions.

Hmm, well, I don't know about other folks, but I care about as much about visual additions as I did about the racial CQ's: not much at all. So I really hope that that is not what you think we will enjoy. On the other hand, if you have NeX items ready to be deployed, I see no reason to not do so.
However, what is lacking in Incarna is gameplay and interaction. No amount of furniture/clothes will change that.

I get the idea that you (CCP) for some reason are back to the drawing board, as if a lot of the ideas you've had for this are no good anymore. This is something that baffles a lot of players, as you seemed to have plenty of good ideas, even back in 2008.
I wonder what you people think was wrong with Incarna as you had intended to release it this winter, and why. Was it technical issues? Did you think the players wouldn't like the Incarna features because of the uproar last summer? What will be done differently than you had originally planned?
There was a graphical representation of the workload of "Incarna": ~1/4 character creator, ~1/2 CQ, ~1/4 the rest (multiplayer stuff). Is this still a valid representation?
What would be the shortest time before a multiplayer avatar enviroment will come to TQ, and what the longest?

I am glad that the CCP is finally talking to us again, and that now at least some people are working/planning on WiS.
But...
Feel free to forward my sentiment here to upper management, mostly paragraphs 2 and 5.
Nyssa Litari
Doomheim
#2632 - 2012-01-17 23:56:06 UTC
Che Biko wrote:
{snip}
On the other hand, if you have NeX items ready to be deployed, I see no reason to not do so.
{snip}

One potentially good reason not to release the other clothing they already have is they're trying to figure out how to release clothing and the other NeX items without the NeX (like LP stores, for example). More likely, they're taking time to revamp the pricing (as they've mentioned) first before they turn them loose.
Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E.
#2633 - 2012-01-18 00:23:03 UTC
Thanks for setting up team Avatar. I'm not sure how many Devs work on content, but my guess is 5 people represents a fraction of the total that is close to the fraction of players who want Incarna developed.

Ideas:
Move the pod from the bottom of the stairs to where the "undock" button is, and make the pod be the undock button. When we dock have the avatar appear right in front of the pod and take a few steps forward to get close to the ship hologram. When we undock have the avatar walk to the pod. If its far away, the avatar may not make it there before the screen blacks, but at least its better than now. Then add some lore in a chonicle, like:

"When you get in your pod nanites quickly disassemble your clothes and store them in the pod. The pod is filled and you are 'plugged in'. While this happens your pod flies from the balcony to your ship, and your ship undocks.

Upon docking the pod is drained and you are cleaned and dried by nanites. Your stored clothing is then reassembled on your body by the nanites. In seconds you are ready to step out of the pod, fully cleaned and clothed, and onto the balcony."

Player created Incarna items: Give us tools for designing clothing, accessories, CQ decorations and furniture. To handle the TTP issue: It has to be vetted by CCP. The player "pays" for this vetting with Aurum. As Aurum is basically created with real money, this pays for the salary of the CCP vetter. If the creation is dubbed acceptable the player gets a BPO for the item.

Eve runs on a one second cycle, dictated by the size of the earth, the speed of light and the fact that players are everywhere. This makes actual combat with avatars difficult. (I think Dust will have distributed servers to get around this). But we can still have Incarna PvP activities: Gambling in establishments. And what should we gamble on in a spaceship game? How about spaceships?

Give us a way to have contests with spaceships that can be viewed on a big screen in an establishment and gambled upon. Races, EW football, all out combat. I'm not a fan of a instanced area where nothing is risked. I think it should be a deadspace area where certain rules are enforced by the game to allow these contests. (Why the game and not players? Because that would be so much effort that few, if anyone, would do it).

Multi-avatar environments need testing. In the short term at least make common areas for us role players. We generate content on our own, and there are enough of us for testing purposes, assuming its on TQ.

Know a Frozen fan? Check this out

Frozen fanfiction

Hanoch Wheel
Free Wheeling Industries
#2634 - 2012-01-18 01:58:55 UTC
Bloodpetal wrote:

...
  • The Sports Arena - Able to play competitive first person style sports with your mates.
  • ...


    Mindcrash mini-game?

    Caldari sport from the novels to those of you not acquainted.

    And FYI good to hear from you Team Avatar. Good luck on this perilous journey of redeeming Incarna.
    Joe D'Trader
    Native Freshfood
    Minmatar Republic
    #2635 - 2012-01-18 02:29:43 UTC
    Can I please invite a friend to my CQ?
    Flamespar
    WarRavens
    Imperium Eden
    #2636 - 2012-01-18 02:45:06 UTC
    CCP Bayeshian. Will you be looking at the ability to invite other players to your CQ? This at least would show that multi avatar environments are indeed possible, and give you the chance to start dealing with any issues have multiple avatars in a single location might raise.

    It might be a good idea to promote this as a 'beta' feature.
    Nikita Keriget
    Doomheim
    #2637 - 2012-01-18 02:49:55 UTC
    Glad to hear there is still at least some investment ongoing.

    My biggest request would be to port over clothing options from the old character creator. There were a lot of distinctive outfits and accessories that I miss dearly. Sad
    Beaches
    #2638 - 2012-01-18 03:00:42 UTC
    I think, for one you should be able to man station defenses from inside the station (using avatars) I also think huge open view ports in social areas would bring people together if not just for the view over the docking bay, but to see war targets or bubbles.

    Boom, simple reasons to use avatars, very simple reason to go to the same place, of course this is just one element which could be built upon.
    DeMichael Crimson
    Republic University
    Minmatar Republic
    #2639 - 2012-01-18 06:24:03 UTC
    I think the CQ should remain a private sanctuary that we can customize anyway we want with plants, pets, trophy's, servants, etc. To show it off to other players, it could have a Vid Phone option in the CQ which would allow others to view you in your CQ. That way the CQ will always be a safe heaven. The station should have other areas set up for more personal Avatar interaction.

    Ever see the movie 'Soylent Green'?

    Charlton Heston stars as a Detective investigating the death of a rich and powerful Corporate leader who lived in a posh apartment complex stocked with hard to get food, paper products, plants and "furniture", one of which was a live-in companion - a woman.



    Arcathra
    Technodyne Ltd.
    #2640 - 2012-01-18 07:53:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Arcathra
    I have just startet a thread about the ideas, suggestions and possible enhancements of the CQ itself in the Features & Ideas forum. Maybe some of you like to contribute your own thoughts to it, I just startet to write some of my thoughts there. Would be nice if we could have a place where all ideas about that could be gathered and discussed.

    Link

    Maybe someone else likes to make a thread about something different, like all ideas and suggestions related to the avatars itself?