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Dev blog: Mining Foreman Revolution

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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#61 - 2016-10-04 23:15:02 UTC
Mara Rinn wrote:
So with all these boosts to mining yield, I should probably hurry up about selling off my stockpiles of ore and minerals, before they're worth nothing?

Only if you want to be part of crashing the market in a panic sale.
David Grogan
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#62 - 2016-10-04 23:38:13 UTC  |  Edited by: David Grogan
Dear CCP,

please change the mining foreman fleet boost mod for capacitor efficiency to agility boost on mining barges/exumers

NO rorqual pilots bothers to use it cos any miner in a barge or exumer can be cap stable fit with little effort

the mod is useless

if there was a mod that made mining barges/exumer more agile then every orca / rorqual pilot would use it

Everytime you buy something that says "made in china" you are helping the rising unemployment in your own country unless you are from china, Buy locally produced goods and help create more jobs.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#63 - 2016-10-04 23:54:01 UTC
David Grogan wrote:
Dear CCP,

please change the mining foreman fleet boost mod for capacitor efficiency to agility boost on mining barges/exumers

NO rorqual pilots bothers to use it cos any miner in a barge or exumer can be cap stable fit with little effort

the mod is useless

if there was a mod that made mining barges/exumer more agile then every orca / rorqual pilot would use it

There is, and Rorqual can fit them.
It's just not part of the mining links.
Try looking at ALL the links.
Gou Litvyak
Doomheim
#64 - 2016-10-05 00:09:17 UTC
Soooo if a Rorqual outmines a hulk, and boosts itself....
Whyyy would anyone mine in anything other than Rorquals?
SurrenderMonkey
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#65 - 2016-10-05 00:27:16 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Mara Rinn wrote:
So with all these boosts to mining yield, I should probably hurry up about selling off my stockpiles of ore and minerals, before they're worth nothing?

Only if you want to be part of crashing the market in a panic sale.


Yeah, definitely don't do that.

You can always recoup the ISK, but that feeling of superiority you'll get from holding the line while all the sheep race for the bottom is basically priceless.

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#66 - 2016-10-05 00:54:30 UTC
Gou Litvyak wrote:
Soooo if a Rorqual outmines a hulk, and boosts itself....
Whyyy would anyone mine in anything other than Rorquals?

Per the blog boosts don't work on drones so it can't boost it's own yield.
Arcelian
0nus
#67 - 2016-10-05 01:21:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Arcelian
I was liking these changes til I saw "By themselves a set of ‘Excavator’ Superdrones make the Rorqual the most powerful mining ship in the game, and when boosted by an active Industrial Core module they each individually gain the yield of an Exhumer."

Shocked


So you are saying a Rorqual, with 5 super drones, is like having a fleet of 5 unboosted hulks, but you only need one account to run it? So if you still had say, 5 hulks in the belt (which would be boosted by the rorqual), it would be the equivalent of having 10 exhumers going, half of them super boosted? Sweet baby jesus, you would need at least 3 transports going non-stop just to haul that much ore.

I don't know how this is going to pan out. Maybe the goons will save me from mineral prices hitting rock bottom by blowing up every rorqual they see, but I doubt they can keep up... Sad

So massively increased mining yield, and it will be even more difficult to gank an exhumer.

The bots are creaming their pants right now.
Kenrailae
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#68 - 2016-10-05 01:26:29 UTC
Aaaaannnndddddd the cove and reti are getting two more mids, right?

The Law is a point of View

The NPE IS a big deal
Caldari 5
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. S.A.S
Affirmative.
#69 - 2016-10-05 02:07:22 UTC
Quote:
This new module requires a new rank 8 skill called Invulnerability Core Operation that requires Tactical Shield Manipulation level 5 and Capital Shield Emission Systems level 3 to train.

Can we us something other than Tactical Shield Manipulation 5? This is a skill that actually gets worse the higher you train it. If it wasn't required at 4 for T2 Invulns/hardeners I doubt that many people would have trained it that high.
Gou Litvyak
Doomheim
#70 - 2016-10-05 02:08:28 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:

Per the blog boosts don't work on drones so it can't boost it's own yield.


So the rorq outmines exhumers, without the bonuses, as long as its core is active?
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#71 - 2016-10-05 02:08:32 UTC
SurrenderMonkey wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Mara Rinn wrote:
So with all these boosts to mining yield, I should probably hurry up about selling off my stockpiles of ore and minerals, before they're worth nothing?

Only if you want to be part of crashing the market in a panic sale.


Yeah, definitely don't do that.

You can always recoup the ISK, but that feeling of superiority you'll get from holding the line while all the sheep race for the bottom is basically priceless.


Which are the sheep: the people seeing future mining yield for the same fleet with the same ores increasing by about 20%, or the people clinging to blind faith that the value of minerals will not shift much?

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#72 - 2016-10-05 02:40:28 UTC
Gou Litvyak wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:

Per the blog boosts don't work on drones so it can't boost it's own yield.


So the rorq outmines exhumers, without the bonuses, as long as its core is active?
Hadn't looked at that, just what the bonuses work on. But after looking at some numbers:

A max yield fit Rorq without an industrial core outmines an unboosted hulk.
A max yield fit Rorq without an industrial core is outmined by a max boosted hulk.

A max yield fit Rorq with an industrial core is outmines anything else.

So the question is is it worth risking 2.2bil + fitting per immobile ship for the top end yield.
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#73 - 2016-10-05 03:12:16 UTC
Are there any restrictions on entosis?

Can you use entosis and core at the same time?

Can you use entosis and Panic at the same time?
Klatus Doshu
Commando Guri
Guristas Pirates
#74 - 2016-10-05 05:29:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Klatus Doshu
Hi,
the changes are very interesting, but I have 2 questions:
Will the existing drone modules also apply on the mining drones? Especially the drone damage amplifier. Would be nice to get an extra mining boost from these.
And the second: can you huff gas with the mining drones or will you implement that? It is quite time consuming, so some support there would be nice.
But I like the upcoming changes...great work!
Montgomery Black
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#75 - 2016-10-05 07:00:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Montgomery Black
These changes could be good for wormhole space. but the problem is the lack of ore sites in wormholes. They currently just spawn randomly and a wormhole may go a week without one !

CCP change the spawn so all wormholes have at least one ore anom present in their system at all times.

Make wormholes great again. with mining !

preferably rorqual mining Twisted

WH Merc Services in AU TZ. Citadel defense / offense. More details see forum post - Link
Luscius Uta
#76 - 2016-10-05 07:23:53 UTC
I am not really happy with the PANIC module requiring Tactical Shield Manipulation V, as not many people have that skill trained all the way up (I hope the prerequisite isn't just a sneaky advert for Skill Injectors). If you want to give people a reason to train it to V, give it a secondary effect, for example reducing capacitor cost of shield hardeners - just don't use level V as a prerequisite for any other skills.
And it will screw up people who aren't on INT/MEM remap even more (which should just be another reason to remove remaps and attributes), so I don't think we'll see many PANIC modules being used in the first few months after these changes.

Workarounds are not bugfixes.
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#77 - 2016-10-05 07:27:05 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
A max yield fit Rorq with an industrial core outmines anything else.

So the question is is it worth risking 2.2bil + fitting per immobile ship for the top end yield.


Time is the enemy. If you can get your Rorqual into the belt, strip mine it, then get back to base before that caravan of reds/neuts trundles down to your system, yes it is worthwhile. Especially if the alternative is fielding the same players in exhumers with one Rorqual/Orca/Porpoise boosting/collecting, which increases the amount of faffing about with shifting ore from exhumers to cans and tractoring cans and emptying cans and loading haulers and … you get the idea.

10 miners in sieged rorqs stripping the belt in twenty minutes vs fleet of exhumers and boosting rorq stripping the belt in thirty minutes? The trade off only gets better as the fleet gets larger, since you can now have multiple warfare links such as shield harmonization, rapid deployment, etc.

Then start lobbying for warfare links to enhance drone navigation speed :D

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Caldari 5
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. S.A.S
Affirmative.
#78 - 2016-10-05 08:15:07 UTC
Luscius Uta wrote:
I am not really happy with the PANIC module requiring Tactical Shield Manipulation V, as not many people have that skill trained all the way up (I hope the prerequisite isn't just a sneaky advert for Skill Injectors). If you want to give people a reason to train it to V, give it a secondary effect, for example reducing capacitor cost of shield hardeners - just don't use level V as a prerequisite for any other skills.

The fix that Tactical Shield Manipulation needs is to offset the problem that is causes with Passive recharge, in the HP Bleed ranges. At the TSMV the Recharge from Shield HP 0 is not as good as at TSMIV from Shield HP 5%(cause it bled the other 5% into Armor). Basically helping to flatten out fhe Curve in the sub 25% Shield HP Range (example curve http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/Corvax/Capacitor04.gif although this is for Cap regen, iirc same/similar formula is used for Shield HP Regen).
Not sure how to implement the above, but I'm sure someone will work out the math on it.
Lando Tarsadan
Doomheim
#79 - 2016-10-05 08:15:30 UTC
Arcelian wrote:


So you are saying a Rorqual, with 5 super drones, is like having a fleet of 5 unboosted hulks, but you only need one account to run it? So if you still had say, 5 hulks in the belt (which would be boosted by the rorqual), it would be the equivalent of having 10 exhumers going, half of them super boosted? Sweet baby jesus, you would need at least 3 transports going non-stop just to haul that much ore.

.


Well the rorq can compress on the fly if its deployed. (unless they changed that have not notised it mentioned) So it will acually take a long time to just fill the hulls of the rorq. and one hauler should easily be able to keep up.
Geronimo McVain
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#80 - 2016-10-05 08:21:34 UTC
why does the Roq has to relay on others to help? At least I would propose to make a new one-shot module that buffs the combat damage of drones in the fleet to 300+% This will give a significant boost in offensive because the damage output of the Roq is insignificant when you are dealing with a gang which is targeting your fleet. A fleet of skiffs with drones would become a real danger.
IMHO there should be an option for people to choose which way they want to go: defense or offense.
If you use 2 Roq you can refit the Panic module while staggering the use. And given the new mining strength using more then one will be an option.