These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
123Next pageLast page
 

The pointlessness of corps requesting full APIs

Author
Lacori
Doomheim
#1 - 2016-09-20 08:44:36 UTC
Not all of us have the ISK or RL money to plex ninety billion accounts, multiboxing with screens all over the place.

Some of us are quite happy running the one account. I have never felt the need to multibox. One character at a time is sufficient on all other games, so it seems normal to do the same on Eve. However, each to their own, and if you want to pay CCP ridiculous sums of money so you can mine an entire belt with just yourself, knock yourself out.

However it is nice to have three different toons on one account. Eve offers a lot of varied activities, so it's nice to have each toon specializing in different things.

Which brings me to my point:

Full account APIs, and corps demanding them... If you can explain to me the logic in this, please do. Even more so when Alphas are out. If I am going to AWOX you, I'd probably use a toon on a trial account, slightly skilled up. All that happens when you ask for full APIs is another account gets created, and BAM you're AWOXed again.

Any toon can be a spy, I fail to see what you accomplish if you find out my main is in PL, Gewns or CODE. Which they're not of course ;)

Stop asking for full APIs. You're only doing it because you want to come across as oh-so-businesslike and look at us, we're all corporate, etc. You're a tiny 5 man corp ffs. If I wanted to kill you all I wouldn't even be having this convo. Just let my highsec carebear toon join you, and don't ask questions about what I do when I bid you all fly safe. Is it so important that you know my every move on every toon? It's best if you don't, anyway, as it would only make you jealous. Imagine. We're running level 3s and doing a spot of mining, then I log off. Do you really want to know that I'll be in sov, dropping cynos and flying dreads? You'll never be at the top like that anyway, so why not live in ignorance? When we split our ore haul and you give me 5m ISK, do you really want to know the last contract I created was over 200 billion? Really?

I think what it comes down to is you just want to look powerful and picky. And that's why you have 50 man corps, only 3 of which logged in within the last month, and who dock up and pretend you're still having fun every time Marmite has a go (which is probably every week).

TL;DR. Just stop it already.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
#2 - 2016-09-20 09:05:25 UTC
It's because it puts in a minimum level of effort to awox a corp. Like you say, if you're going to to it you'd probably just make another account and skill up an alt. Without an API key you just join with whatever old character and go awox crazy, but with API checks you have to create a new character, fund him without trading or transferring isk, then use him to awox. It's not a magic bullet, but used with other forms of security it means that someone who decides to awox you has to really want to do it.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Anthar Thebess
#3 - 2016-09-20 09:09:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Anthar Thebess
Simple : If you don't have nothing to hide - why are you not willing to give full api ?
Api itself don't show much if you care about hiding something.

How you can play this game on 1 account, even in higsec it is hard.
Valkin Mordirc
#4 - 2016-09-20 09:13:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Valkin Mordirc
Lucas Kell wrote:
It's because it puts in a minimum level of effort to awox a corp. Like you say, if you're going to to it you'd probably just make another account and skill up an alt. Without an API key you just join with whatever old character and go awox crazy, but with API checks you have to create a new character, fund him without trading or transferring isk, then use him to awox. It's not a magic bullet, but used with other forms of security it means that someone who decides to awox you has to really want to do it.



This sorta.


Not just Awoxing though.


It puts a barrier of effort for doing anything you may want to keep secret or the corp your joinin may not like you doing.


In smaller corps it could be use to help newbies out, or maybe developing a small fleet doctrine.


Edit: Also it puts up a psychological barrier as well. Sorta like warning signs that your on CC-TV even the thought of someone watching will make people behave.
#DeleteTheWeak
Geronimo McVain
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2016-09-20 09:28:50 UTC
I'm fine with 99,5% of the api but I have huge problems with access to the email. If you keep your tracks hidden on the money how high are the chances that you will slip with the emails? On the other side scrutiny of the email is IMHO very invasive to the privacy. There are for very good reasons very strict rules even for firms which emails they can access on an account with shared business and private mail. And for entering a corp we just strip naked. I can't really believe that the NSA was a big scandal while people are opening their email to permanent!!! scrutiny to join corp. This may be not a big thing for noobs but for older players with lots of contacts it is.
IMHO the email has to go out of the api because the usage by clans at the moment is an abuse.
Anthar Thebess
#6 - 2016-09-20 09:40:38 UTC
This is simple, as long as CCP will give you ability to create full api, as long corporations and alliances will require them.
Because ... why not?
Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
End of Life
#7 - 2016-09-20 09:41:30 UTC
No need for full access api for recruiting.

For someone who needs roles in a Corp, sure. But no need at all for recruiting.
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat
Hell's Kitchen.
#8 - 2016-09-20 09:49:49 UTC
op complains about people requesting full api's, yet he makes a forum posting toon to hide himself.

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

radkid10
Universal Exos
#9 - 2016-09-20 09:56:07 UTC  |  Edited by: radkid10
Eve online API is a double-edged sword I'm starting to hate it

I don't like people knowing how much money I have or the history of my transactions

it's one of the reasons why I'm kind of avoiding joining a corporation right now

I seriously think wasn't meant to be used like this in the first place

here's the first part of it it sucks if you kill somebody you don't want anybody to know about it other than that person you can't make it private the same thing goes if you don't want people to know you've been killed by somebody there's no way to keep this information Secret

you give these applications information you do not know if somebody else is reading that information at the other side for their own benefit as well you just have to pray to God they're not using it to **** you over

I'm sure there's programs are designed to hack into these other API programs and basically do some sniffing and their server database not ccp database

Community design programs are not always super secure most of them are not secure at all
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
#10 - 2016-09-20 10:05:10 UTC
Geronimo McVain wrote:
I'm fine with 99,5% of the api but I have huge problems with access to the email. If you keep your tracks hidden on the money how high are the chances that you will slip with the emails? On the other side scrutiny of the email is IMHO very invasive to the privacy. There are for very good reasons very strict rules even for firms which emails they can access on an account with shared business and private mail. And for entering a corp we just strip naked. I can't really believe that the NSA was a big scandal while people are opening their email to permanent!!! scrutiny to join corp. This may be not a big thing for noobs but for older players with lots of contacts it is.
IMHO the email has to go out of the api because the usage by clans at the moment is an abuse.
CCP offer absolutely no guarantee that your in-game evemail is private. It's not designed to be use for sending private information, it's an in-game tool, so it being included in the API is not relevant. Removing it would also mean you would not be able to have any out of game tools that allow you to view your evemail. If it's something you don't want to provide to a corp, you don;t have to, but you'll have to accept that for some corps that means the application is rejected.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Elenahina
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2016-09-20 10:18:06 UTC
It's not rocket science

If a corporation asks for information you don't wish to give them, then don't give it to them. You're in no way required to give them a single shred of information.

By the same token, if you refuse to provide that information, they are under no obligation to let you into their super sekrit club.

I really don't understand why this continues to be a problem - don't want to give it? don't give it. It really is that simple.

Eve is like an addiction; you can't quit it until it quits you. Also, iderno

Gneeznow
Ship spinners inc
#12 - 2016-09-20 10:45:16 UTC
I've always flat out refused to give anyone my API and as a result I've been a pariah for about 6 years, only managing to find 2 decent corps in that time that would take me 'as is'. I'm happy enough with my choice tbh, I usually stick around for 3 months per year and leave it at that.
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat
Hell's Kitchen.
#13 - 2016-09-20 10:52:33 UTC
Elenahina wrote:
It's not rocket science

If a corporation asks for information you don't wish to give them, then don't give it to them. You're in no way required to give them a single shred of information.

By the same token, if you refuse to provide that information, they are under no obligation to let you into their super sekrit club.

I really don't understand why this continues to be a problem - don't want to give it? don't give it. It really is that simple.


this.

people in these big corps who have no problems handing over api's who probably have more isk, assets etc etc than most people, yet new players seem to think its some sort of NSA technique to uncover your secret stash of free rookie ships and steal your niche isk doubling business model

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

Erebus Vain
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#14 - 2016-09-20 10:56:31 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
Elenahina wrote:
It's not rocket science

If a corporation asks for information you don't wish to give them, then don't give it to them. You're in no way required to give them a single shred of information.

By the same token, if you refuse to provide that information, they are under no obligation to let you into their super sekrit club.

I really don't understand why this continues to be a problem - don't want to give it? don't give it. It really is that simple.


this.

people in these big corps who have no problems handing over api's who probably have more isk, assets etc etc than most people, yet new players seem to think its some sort of NSA technique to uncover your secret stash of free rookie ships and steal your niche isk doubling business model



You no nothing of the Ibis legion!



;)
Harry Forever
SpaceJunkys
#15 - 2016-09-20 11:03:26 UTC
Lacori wrote:
Not all of us have the ISK or RL money to plex ninety billion accounts, multiboxing with screens all over the place.

Some of us are quite happy running the one account. I have never felt the need to multibox. One character at a time is sufficient on all other games, so it seems normal to do the same on Eve. However, each to their own, and if you want to pay CCP ridiculous sums of money so you can mine an entire belt with just yourself, knock yourself out.

However it is nice to have three different toons on one account. Eve offers a lot of varied activities, so it's nice to have each toon specializing in different things.

Which brings me to my point:

Full account APIs, and corps demanding them... If you can explain to me the logic in this, please do. Even more so when Alphas are out. If I am going to AWOX you, I'd probably use a toon on a trial account, slightly skilled up. All that happens when you ask for full APIs is another account gets created, and BAM you're AWOXed again.

Any toon can be a spy, I fail to see what you accomplish if you find out my main is in PL, Gewns or CODE. Which they're not of course ;)

Stop asking for full APIs. You're only doing it because you want to come across as oh-so-businesslike and look at us, we're all corporate, etc. You're a tiny 5 man corp ffs. If I wanted to kill you all I wouldn't even be having this convo. Just let my highsec carebear toon join you, and don't ask questions about what I do when I bid you all fly safe. Is it so important that you know my every move on every toon? It's best if you don't, anyway, as it would only make you jealous. Imagine. We're running level 3s and doing a spot of mining, then I log off. Do you really want to know that I'll be in sov, dropping cynos and flying dreads? You'll never be at the top like that anyway, so why not live in ignorance? When we split our ore haul and you give me 5m ISK, do you really want to know the last contract I created was over 200 billion? Really?

I think what it comes down to is you just want to look powerful and picky. And that's why you have 50 man corps, only 3 of which logged in within the last month, and who dock up and pretend you're still having fun every time Marmite has a go (which is probably every week).

TL;DR. Just stop it already.


totally agree, it just gives those scared kids the fake feeling to be safe.. maybe they need it to sleep better at night who knows, API checks are total bullshit
voetius
Grundrisse
#16 - 2016-09-20 11:17:35 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
Elenahina wrote:
It's not rocket science

If a corporation asks for information you don't wish to give them, then don't give it to them. You're in no way required to give them a single shred of information.

By the same token, if you refuse to provide that information, they are under no obligation to let you into their super sekrit club.

I really don't understand why this continues to be a problem - don't want to give it? don't give it. It really is that simple.


this.

people in these big corps who have no problems handing over api's who probably have more isk, assets etc etc than most people, yet new players seem to think its some sort of NSA technique to uncover your secret stash of free rookie ships and steal your niche isk doubling business model


pretty much this. I've handed over my full api before and not really been fussed that people will learn all my super secret trading techniques. Mostly because there aren't any (or probably not), as most stuff that traders / builders / inventors / speculators etc do is well known to anyone that takes the trouble to do some research. It's also not fun to people unless they like doing that sort of thing (same as anything else in the game) so that is another reason to not worry about it.

As people have said above there are ways of covering your tracks for many things the api covers, even trading history, which is actually one of the easiest things to obfuscate once you know that there Is quite low limit to the number of entries in wallet history.
Piugattuk
Lone Star Warriors
Evictus.
#17 - 2016-09-20 11:30:09 UTC
API requirements are big turn offs IMO, as with eve always assume people are out to mess you over, never trust anyone, and absolutely never ever give access to your possessions or your Corp assets, as with the RL if they want to "borrow" something you can contract something with collateral, if they can't meet the requirements then just like the housing bubble at some point they will default on their subprime loans.
Jenn aSide
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#18 - 2016-09-20 12:10:44 UTC
I've seen this topic before , and it still makes no sense.

If you don't like giving your full api key to a corp, don't join a corp that asks for it. Make your own corp/alliance and make it a rule to not ask for API keys. Yes it's really that simple.

No one owes you entry into their corp (just like you wouldn't owe anyone entry into yours). I have 4 accounts and I don't mind giving out full api keys, if it somehow bothered me in an "oh, mah pixel privacy rights!" kind of way I wouldn't, but it doesn't because that would be stupid.
Lulu Lunette
Savage Moon Society
#19 - 2016-09-20 12:32:31 UTC
No API checks is a good content generator Cool

@lunettelulu7

Serene Repose
#20 - 2016-09-20 12:42:13 UTC
Anthar Thebess wrote:
Simple : If you don't have nothing to hide - why are you not willing to give full api ?
Api itself don't show much if you care about hiding something. How you can play this game on 1 account, even in higsec it is hard.
Hard? You don't like hard games? When does multiple accounts become "we" play EVE? 2? 12? 32??

I once (with my little brother) watched a barn full of lambs running in this massive group of mini-wool around in a continuous oval - there were so many lambs there was no break in their numbers on the floor - one continuous oval of lambs running counter clockwise on this barn floor.

Every now and then, one would jump. As there was nothing on the floor but...them....there was nothing to jump OVER, but be that as it may every now and then one WOULD jump. Immediately, the lamb behind that one jumped at the same spot, then all that followed jumped at the same spot creating a little wave at this spot where this one lamp jumped.

That wave persisted till the original lamb that jumped ran back over the same spot and didn't jump. Then the wave would flatten out ... until another lamb, a little later, jumped over another spot...where there was nothing to jump over. As long as you wanted to stand there, you could watch them do this. . . one jumps, the rest have to jump because the one did . . . just in case there MIGHT be something there . . . even though there never was.

Damndest thing about it was, it reminded me of people. API huh? Right.


We must accommodate the idiocracy.

123Next pageLast page