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Suggestion for Factional Warfare Complex Mechanics
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Benjamin Audanie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2016-08-04 18:06:37 UTC
First off im a relatively new Eve player having played since 2016-03-17 and in FW since around one week after that (not with this char though)

Basically i have really enjoyed FW its a great way to come in to PvP, it however has some downsides, two of these downsides i see can be easily fixed:

  1. Capturing a complex is far too easy, and boring, the problem i see with this is that its an integral part of FW and its plain boring and simple, its also so easy so that one player can multibox multiple accounts (nothing wrong with that, its just an indication of how easy it is)
  2. Complexes are these days only limited by ship size despite the confusing name "Novice" that suggests the plex is for novice players when it is not


Therefore i suggest adding a new feature and adjusting the existing feature of complex limitation:


  • Add a minigame to the capture mechanics of the complex something a long the way of the hacking minigame.

    • I was thinking of approaching the outpost and unloading Marines to the outpost and have a very simple strategy game go on, if a rat spawns or if an opposing milita member (or pirate) warps in and you warp out/gets blown up, the minigame will stay at a stale mate (unless the opposing milita member finishes the game and de-plexes it). The game should be somewhat easy but it should be able to afflect the capture speed somewhat, someone who plays it badly will take longer time completing and vice versa. There should be a delay timer between moves (animations etc.) so that it cant be rushed say below 10 minutes for a novice, but a really crappy player should not need more than 15 minutes.

  • Adjust the novice plex so that it has an SP-limit as well as shipsize limit, as the name suggests it should be for novice players, yet i keep seeing people who have been active for 6-7 years or more in pimped out Pirate Faction ships (why are those even considered T1 Frigates?) The SP limit does not have to be a flat out 4 million SP limit or so but maybe the sum of the combat oriented skillpoints


ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#2 - 2016-08-04 19:20:10 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Your first idea is interesting.
It will certainly add tedium and cause issues for solo players trying to earn some income in the warzone... but then again, there needs to be something that helps curb farming a bit. And tedium is generally the thing that does it.

Your second idea... yeah. I never liked the naming conventions of those complexes. Hell... there are a few misnomers in EVE that generally make first timers scratch the heads (example: the insurance system is not really an insurance system... it is a partial ship reimbursement system designed to get people to PvP more without completely removing the pain of ship loss).

On the subject of SP limits for certain complexes... no.
Combat ability is not decided strictly by skill points (implants, Warfare links, drug boosters, friends, and Intel all play a part as well).
Pirate frigates CAN be killed by the right Tech 1 ship using the right tactic (see above).
And... most importantly... it sets a bad precedent. Do it for one thing, people will howl for it to be used on other things.

How did you Veterans start?
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#3 - 2016-08-04 19:21:56 UTC
Citadel style DPS mechanics where it then encourages combat ships rather than stabbed ships may be a way to help reduce that boredom for attacking plexes without making them finishable in 5 seconds by a large gang.
Defending plexes could use a similar capped rep mechanic.

And no, Novice Plexes should not have a SP limit. Because only a very limited sum of combat SP are ever relevant to a particular frigate, the 'Novice' is referring to the ship, though they could have named it better. If there is a problem with pirate frigates then get CCP to code them differently so they can't enter the novice, rather than ban 99% of players from ever engaging someone and making them the cheesy go to immunity plex.
Benjamin Audanie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2016-08-05 13:54:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Benjamin Audanie
Quote:

Your first idea is interesting.
It will certainly add tedium and cause issues for solo players trying to earn some income in the warzone... but then again, there needs to be something that helps curb farming a bit. And tedium is generally the thing that does it.


Well i whould like to say that almost anything is better than nothing (i.e. more tedius just waiting than doing something) which it is right now, and issues for solo players trying to earn some income is justified, in my oppinion earning money should take some gameplay otherwise its just sitting there to earn LP...

Quote:

On the subject of SP limits for certain complexes... no.
Combat ability is not decided strictly by skill points (implants, Warfare links, drug boosters, friends, and Intel all play a part as well).
Pirate frigates CAN be killed by the right Tech 1 ship using the right tactic (see above).
And... most importantly... it sets a bad precedent. Do it for one thing, people will howl for it to be used on other things.


Point taken, i might have written my second suggestion in affect since i had recently been killed by a worm in my precious merlin, but i do feel that there needs to be some more incentive for me to actually stay and fight in the plex when i see something on close scan, right now i stay and fight for the sake of fighting, i should stay and fight because i want to take a risk to earn something.(besides a killmark)
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#5 - 2016-08-09 02:20:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Cearain
CCP said they were going to make plexing more pvp focused by giving us better intel tools, and timer rollbacks for when people flee plexes. If tou had to actually fight for plexes we wouldn't need minigames.

But that was a few years ago and they never did it.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#6 - 2016-08-09 03:47:25 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Benjamin Audanie wrote:

ShahFluffers wrote:

On the subject of SP limits for certain complexes... no.
Combat ability is not decided strictly by skill points (implants, Warfare links, drug boosters, friends, and Intel all play a part as well).
Pirate frigates CAN be killed by the right Tech 1 ship using the right tactic (see above).
And... most importantly... it sets a bad precedent. Do it for one thing, people will howl for it to be used on other things.


Point taken, i might have written my second suggestion in affect since i had recently been killed by a worm in my precious merlin, but i do feel that there needs to be some more incentive for me to actually stay and fight in the plex when i see something on close scan, right now i stay and fight for the sake of fighting, i should stay and fight because i want to take a risk to earn something.(besides a killmark)

A Merlin does have a chance against a Worm. A slim one... but still a chance.

I would recommend a gank-fit Merlin with two Stasis Webifiers. They can throw off an opponent that is expecting a more... traditional fit.

Alternatively... having a friend or two can increase your combat power and cover your weaknesses.
Some examples:
- A friend in a Griffin and stay out 30km from the warp in point of the plex... while you sit and grab anything that comes in. He jams, you lay on the hurt.

- Two fast locking artillery frigates can nuke most other frigates as they come in.

- You hard-tackle and attack any ship that comes into a plex. Meanwhile, a friend in a logi frigate can stay out at 20km and keep repping you throughout the fight.


As for needing more incentive to fight.... uhhhhhhhhhh... why do you need more?
If you win...

- the plex timer will continue and you will eventually get LP... which you can use to buy stuff exclusive to FW... which you can sell on the open market

- you get loot. And sometimes there is something "shiny" in that loot (people who fly Faction frigates sometime fit a "bling" mod or two)

- you get a killmail that can be posted on a public board like https://zkillboard.com/
And those killmarks can help you build a reputation. And that reputation can help you get in to the right crowds of people... which can get you into private intel channels, better corporations, and the perks that go with both.


edit: also... why join a global war declaration if you are only interested in fighting for a justified reason and/or profit? Fight for the sake of fighting... to crush your enemies... see them driven before you... and to sip the tears of the Role Players!

How did you Veterans start?
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
#7 - 2016-08-09 05:26:51 UTC
the npcs in plexes are not there to entertain you. They are basically just a dps test so that you can't offensively plex large plexes in a slasher - you have to pick size appropriate ships (at least that is the theory, and yes there was a time when you could do med plexes in a vigil without firing a shot).

it is comparable to a domination game mode of other games - you have to hold an area of space and someone else is trying to prevent you from doing that. You see, it is only fun if someone else is there otherwise its completely pointless.

And thats why the FW mechanics only properly work in home systems with many players in space. The whole rest is controlled by farmers which run from every fight since the timers in plexes do not reset (running away is more LP efficient than fighting for the grid). You can easily multibox multiple systems at once in stabbed (or unstabbed, doesn't really matter since you can run in any case) ships and run from every engagement - come back later to get the LP.


and yeah ccp is not working on FW so good luck pushing for a change. (i think we are pushing for timer rollbacks for 5 years already or so loll)

hope that helps, welcome to eve btw

how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value
Lugh Crow-Slave
#8 - 2016-09-23 12:14:39 UTC
I don't like the second idea

the point of these plexs is not only as an introduction to new players getting into pvp but also a way for all players to get the fights they are looking for.

basically it's nice that i can fight T1 frigs in T1 frigs no matter how long i have been playing

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#9 - 2016-09-23 14:21:16 UTC
Damage mitigation and repair timers may be a good alternative to the plex rats.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs