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Kill rights are totally broken

First post
Author
eVRiAL
Origin.
Fraternity.
#1 - 2016-07-26 15:21:17 UTC  |  Edited by: eVRiAL
So I had a kill right, after the activation immediately my opponent docks and undocks in a shuttle, warps off to planet and his alt destroys his shuttle, I receive notification my kill right was used, that's over.

My initial impression was kills were private to owner or his corp, but wrong, they are public.

In current situation KR are broken because of immediate nullification and no punishment, some examples following
https://zkillboard.com/character/96144142/
https://zkillboard.com/character/96259933/
Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
Coalition of the Unfortunate
#2 - 2016-07-26 15:59:31 UTC
eVRiAL wrote:
So I had a kill right, after the activation immediately my opponent docks and undocks in a shuttle, warps off to planet and his alt destroys his shuttle, I receive notification my kill right was used, that's over.

My initial impression was kills were private to owner or his corp, but wrong, they are public.

In current situation KR are broken because of immediate nullification and no punishment, some examples following
https://zkillboard.com/character/96144142/
https://zkillboard.com/character/96259933/


Killrights were broken from the get go.

They're almost exclusively used for scamming.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#3 - 2016-07-26 16:03:55 UTC
They used to be exclusive to the owner and they were completely under utilised. It's not as easy as you think to create a justice system that people will use without exploitation.

Since this is a feature and idea forum rather than a rant forum, do you have a suggestion?

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

eVRiAL
Origin.
Fraternity.
#4 - 2016-07-26 16:24:02 UTC
Previous mechanic was at least working, 30 day exclusive right to wreck a ship, and it was enough to prevent camping undock.
Selling for isk and suspect flag is complete fail.
Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight
The Devil's Warrior Alliance
#5 - 2016-07-26 16:33:02 UTC
You have to be a little clever about how you use these, wait till they have an agression timer , or on a gate and ping pong them back and fourth.

Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#6 - 2016-07-26 16:57:57 UTC
I am very certain that kill rights are private until you make them available to all, a player, corp, alliance.

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.

Paranoid Loyd
#7 - 2016-07-26 16:58:42 UTC
They are only broken to those that don't know how to use them properly.

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!

Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight
The Devil's Warrior Alliance
#8 - 2016-07-26 17:02:27 UTC
Rivr Luzade wrote:
I am very certain that kill rights are private until you make them available to all, a player, corp, alliance.

They are, hes complaining about tjeir function though, he was expecting a limited engagement rather than the target going suspect.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#9 - 2016-07-26 21:42:27 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Rivr Luzade wrote:
I am very certain that kill rights are private until you make them available to all, a player, corp, alliance.

They are, hes complaining about tjeir function though, he was expecting a limited engagement rather than the target going suspect.


He'll complain when his target docks up for 5 mins.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight
The Devil's Warrior Alliance
#10 - 2016-07-26 21:53:23 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Rivr Luzade wrote:
I am very certain that kill rights are private until you make them available to all, a player, corp, alliance.

They are, hes complaining about tjeir function though, he was expecting a limited engagement rather than the target going suspect.


He'll complain when his target docks up for 5 mins.

His fault for dancing on the undock
eVRiAL
Origin.
Fraternity.
#11 - 2016-07-27 05:58:30 UTC
I made this topic for dev response, go chitchat somewhere else.
Swiftstrike1
Swiftstrike Incorporated
#12 - 2016-07-27 06:06:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Swiftstrike1
I reckon kill rights should not expire after 1 kill. They should expire only after the "criminal" has had the same ISK value destroyed as the "crime" that created the kill right in the first place. Or after the standard 30 day time limit, whatever comes first.

e.g. If someone ganks a PLEX Ibis, the kill right would be live for 30 days or until the perpetrator loses an equivalent amount of ISK to kill right activations. It should not be possible to get rid of it by getting an empty shuttle blown up.

Casual Incursion runner & Faction Warfare grunt, ex-Wormholer, ex-Nullbear.

eVRiAL
Origin.
Fraternity.
#13 - 2016-07-27 09:35:53 UTC  |  Edited by: eVRiAL
Swiftstrike1 wrote:
I reckon kill rights should not expire after 1 kill. They should expire only after the "criminal" has had the same ISK value destroyed as the "crime" that created the kill right in the first place. Or after the standard 30 day time limit, whatever comes first.

e.g. If someone ganks a PLEX Ibis, the kill right would be live for 30 days or until the perpetrator loses an equivalent amount of ISK to kill right activations. It should not be possible to get rid of it by getting an empty shuttle blown up.

Good idea, but that may completely nerf empire suicide ganks :D
30 catalysts gank freighter value 5B ISK and each of them has 5B value of punishment. Split 5b for percentage of the dealt damage I guess appropriate.
What if the attacker can't wreck the victim? Simply 30 day one kill for any ISK?
Ellendras Silver
CrashCat Corporation
#14 - 2016-07-27 10:11:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Ellendras Silver
so when people post things you don't want to hear you post:
eVRiAL wrote:
I made this topic for dev response, go chitchat somewhere else.


and then you like an idea and you post this:
eVRiAL wrote:
Swiftstrike1 wrote:
I reckon kill rights should not expire after 1 kill. They should expire only after the "criminal" has had the same ISK value destroyed as the "crime" that created the kill right in the first place. Or after the standard 30 day time limit, whatever comes first.

e.g. If someone ganks a PLEX Ibis, the kill right would be live for 30 days or until the perpetrator loses an equivalent amount of ISK to kill right activations. It should not be possible to get rid of it by getting an empty shuttle blown up.

Good idea, but that may completely nerf empire suicide ganks :D
30 catalysts gank freighter value 5B ISK and each of them has 5B value of punishment. Split 5b for percentage of the dealt damage I guess appropriate.
What if the attacker can't wreck the victim? Simply 30 day one kill for any ISK?


this is not how the world works mate, if you post something on the forum you can get posts that disagree with you or they can agree with you. either way anyone has the same rights to post in a thread.

[u]Carpe noctem[/u]

Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#15 - 2016-07-27 11:10:02 UTC
eVRiAL wrote:
I made this topic for dev response, go chitchat somewhere else.


Read your op again. No question or ideas, just whining. What exactly is a dev supposed to respond to?

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Arya Regnar
Darwins Right Hand
#16 - 2016-07-27 13:04:52 UTC
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
They are only broken to those that don't know how to use them properly.

This, if you can't kill the guy in the ship at the time you activate it then you are the only one to blame for your pathetic miserable failure.

EvE-Mail me if you need anything.

Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#17 - 2016-07-27 18:20:00 UTC
eVRiAL wrote:
I made this topic for dev response, go chitchat somewhere else.




You'll be waiting a while, you pie-eyed charlatan. Take note of the name of this forum: 'Player Features and Ideas Discussion', not 'eVRiAL's Features and Ideas Monologue'.



What?

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log

Eli Stan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2016-07-27 18:40:54 UTC
They seem to be working for me. My fleet was out for a LOL roam in Ventures one day (on 2016-01-09 18:49:31 if you want to search for the kill) and we wrecked a Separatists Rattlesnake in highsec due to activating a killright.

Making activating a killright trigger only a limited engagement would have meant only the single person activating the killright would have been able to shoot the Rattlesnake, rather than the 63 people who killed it, meaning it would have survived without issue.

Making activating a killright trigger only a limited engagement in your particular situation would have meant you'd get an empty shuttle kill, while your opponent gets a shuttle loss exactly as before. BFD.

Sell your killright for ISK and move on.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#19 - 2016-07-27 19:20:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
eVRiAL wrote:
I made this topic for dev response, go chitchat somewhere else.
You are aware of the concept of discussion? Discussion being a conversation where participants exchange points of view, opinions and ideas.

This forum is for the discussion of features and ideas, your OP contained neither an idea or feature, just a rant about something you clearly don't understand.

If you want a dev response, without players discussing the beef you have with the current mechanics, you file a support ticket.

I wouldn't hold your breath though, as your understanding of the kill rights mechanic is obviously lacking.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

eVRiAL
Origin.
Fraternity.
#20 - 2016-07-27 20:47:59 UTC
I already made a support ticket and from discussion with Senior GM resulted this topic, so please follow forum rules and be constructive on the subject. I will not tolerate offensive posting, ranting, or saying how bad I'm at game, such posts will be reported.
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