Market Discussions

You do realise that when I click on the corp it shows me there are 20,000,000 shares in your corp.
After that all your maths falls apart.

NAV of 607,900 per share times 20 million shares = 12,158,000,000,000 = 12.1 Trillion ISK

or in reverse

801 billion divided by 20 million shares = NAV per share of 40,050 per share

When did you start selling shares? Can you link to any original info?

How many shareholders do you have? Have any names of shareholders been made public?

We have 1318125 shares owed by few people. 10k isk * os= 13,181,250,000 Billiob ISK, your liquidity is covering that as you got 67 billion.

Now the thing is I would like to invest 2 T ISK. I want shares on that amount, around 607,900 ps. It will be around 3,3 million shares.

Lets us say the money I invested will stimulate the company and we will get 20k increase, thus for all our shares of 3.3+1.318 we will have returns of 92 billion roughly. Will you be able to guarantee liquidity of that amount considering the market forecast? Knowing that EVE has reduction in player base and that I would like to sell off my shares to someone, but there is literally nobody to buy as there is no market positiv dynamics, there is no people who want to invest that in project that due to market shrincage becomes more of a pyramide, the last to get in are the worse off. Let us say, I waited two years will you be able to guarantee liquidity of that amount as for dividens. Will markets you are in, be able to guarantee that? What if I want to invest 3.1 trillion isk? I want cash, I don't need assets. Can you guarantee liquidity for dividends payout? I am not ready to risk it all for so long term and on so small capacities. If eve player base shows positive convergence, I might think about it, but for now DEVs are living eve spreadsheet dream of the past, something new must be added or it will go down. Just check the charts.

I wouldn't suggest anybody to invest as the market player base is unstable in long term and the only forecast is the presumtive once from DEV blogs and expansions that can or cannot bring in more players. Sadly, you don't know until it happens. There are better ways of making money and ther are no less stable and returns can be superior. Classic company is appealing however market ops are more reliable. Those with small amount, I advise not to invest as it will be hardly any considerable increase. If market plummets you will see no dividends what so ever. Believe me or not, when you are doing market ops, you can plummet the market and therefore making such corps as this one, worth of a penny, after which you can buy them and enjoy those magic numbers... the rest is no secret, but requires some knowledge. This much I suggest you look into my several posts and whether you woud like o join trading guild.

It is all about market, what matters is if you can quit it when situation goes bad, and in this situation, you can't. If eve shows no growth in player base this will stagnate, at best, and the money could be used somewhere else bringing more satisfaction to the player.

A couple of good questions regarding liquidity; I’ll respond in reverse order.


Great follow up question, Virm, and you’ve hit upon one of the quirks of current corporation game mechanics. We do use the game mechanics to pay dividends and it does require us to have 200 billion ISK in the corp wallet to make the quarterly payment of 10,000 ISK per share. M-Spec is unlikely to have that much cash on hand as its mission is to invest its resources in industrial materials. My main character (Towaoc), on the other hand, usually has at least 200 billion liquid. A five minute loan to M-Spec is all it takes to get the dividend paid. This quarter was an exception, as Towaoc currently has most of his liquid assets invested in unrelated opportunities. We were able to scrape together 50 billion in loans from him and the alliance to lift the M-Spec wallet to 100b, then make two back-to-back dividend payments of 5,000 ISK per share each.

As an aside for anyone who has ever wondered, this is a prime example of why I use Jay Aaron to run and represent M-Spec. It is vital to maintain clear and distinct separation of all assets and transactions related to M-Spec from those of my main character.


A pretty good question, actually, until it drifted off into a discussion of trading guilds and the long-range prospects for the success of the game. I’ll preface the reply by saying that there are no guarantees. An investment in M-Spec is an equity investment in a business concern and that involves risk. That said, there are a variety of measures that we take to ensure a reasonable level of liquidity to maintain a market for both buyers and sellers of our shares.

First, we would not issue shares anywhere near the magnitude of your example to a single shareholder in a single transaction. We’re getting pretty big, but 2T is far too much capital to take on and invest all at once, and far too many shares to make a market for in the event of a desired sale. We’re more likely to cap buy orders for new shares at 1-2% of your figure.

Second, we always keep some cash on hand and available for share repurchases, purchase of materials on short-term dips in price, or other corporate needs. Cash on hand is typically 25 to 50 billion.

Third, by design, we invest M-Spec’s resources in a wide range of high-volume industrial materials. We typically hold less than a single day’s trading volume in the Forge region in any single commodity. Take Mexallon, for example. We currently hold about 450 million units at a value of around 32b, or roughly 4% of our portfolio. The Forge market for Mex is a billion units and 70b per day. If the need arouse, we’re able to liquidate substantial portions of our Mex position, or any combination of dozens of other holdings just like it, literally within hours in order to raise liquidity without materially impacting market prices.

And last, our largest shareholders have a long-term vested interest in M-Spec’s success. It is extremely unlikely that any of them would wish to sell a significant portion of their shares quickly. The more typical shareholder holds between 1,000 and 50,000 shares.

We're good with respectable. We've had a few "sensational" quarters over the years, but sensational is very difficult to repeat or sustain over the long term.

The June quarter came in a little light, but we're pleased with the results in light of overall performance within the industrial materials sector during the period. For comparison, our average monthly rates of return (compounded) over the last 12 months and inception to date are 2.35% and 2.51%, respectively. Consistent results, to say the least. We believe we can sustain monthly rates of return in the range of 2.0 to 2.5 % over the next 12 to 24 months given the current and foreseeable industrial materials environment.

Thanks, Virm.

Good thoughts on protecting a corp that wants to issue public shares from shareholder vote manipulation. A shell corp set up to handle the tradable shares with a single trusted employee is immune from this type of manipulation because you must be an employee of a corp to propose a vote. M-Spec is set up similarly, though it also holds the industrial material assets. It is not vulnerable to a hostile takeover vote because only I could initiate such a vote.


Thisis ultimately where the risk resides.

If you don't trust the guy running the corp, don't invest.
If you're not sure if you can trust the guy running the corp, only invest what you can afford to lose.
If you trust the guy running the corp, add shares to your portfolio without hesitation.