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Mission Agents and Citadels
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Rek Seven
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#21 - 2016-06-16 19:44:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Rek Seven
I don't know if i agree with the specific mechanics outlined in the OP but i am for the idea in principle.

Realistically, why wouldn't capsuleers be able to invite agents to live and operate out of their citadels? Citadels are supposed to be about "building your dreams" and as long as the owner is paying for the service and other players can destroy your citadel, i don't see a problem.

However, i believe that CCP should create new missions for citadels to get around some of the issues people have raised in this thread. This could be the start of the long overdue and much needed revamp of PVE.

The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Sephiroth Clone VII
Brothers of Tyr
Goonswarm Federation
#22 - 2016-06-16 22:25:03 UTC
Would be great and add variety to nullsec pve or just about anywhere, to be honest anoms are boring and combat sigs olny marginaly better in terms of unique story, which is very, very small, and redundant.

Only qualms would have are.

Who would be the NPC? Would they be randomly generated or some kind of tv screen terminal. Could it be any number of factions not limited to empire ones, or just the old pirate factions like could it be ore or sisters of eve?

And.... what NPC faction or level or missions? Does it have to be the NPC faction space you are living in, lets say cva are all about amar and just as alogic standpoint like most nullsec residents we spend all ratting shooting sansha who are the home rats in our region. Considering we regulaly blow any standing with them just shooting sansha and...... well we are ammar loyalists it would aid us most to have ammar empire agents.

One idea just thought of, to keep pirate NPC space unique, that the faction for missions are kept generic and or empire related ones.
Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
#23 - 2016-06-17 14:58:22 UTC
Xaros IX wrote:
No its no hypocrisy, there will be substantial limitations and penalties to it, but it will open new options. More people will be active in space == more combat probing == more goodness!!!.

Yes it is hypocrisy at it finest. As a group low, nul and worm hole players are united in shouting down any request for additional content in high sec, and in telling them if they want something they do not have then they need to move to a location where that activity is available. And yet here you are asking for something to be added to your area of space, something that does not currently exist and justifying it because you are low, nul or worm hole players it is different. This is in fact the dictionary definition of hypocrisy, I can have something because I want it, but you cannot have something you want.

No I do not think high sec should get the things they do not have, if the players there want those activities they should move to where those activities are located. And the same goes for you, if you want something that does not exist in your area of space then move to where it does exist.


Rek Seven wrote:
I don't know if i agree with the specific mechanics outlined in the OP but i am for the idea in principle.

Realistically, why wouldn't capsuleers be able to invite agents to live and operate out of their citadels? Citadels are supposed to be about "building your dreams" and as long as the owner is paying for the service and other players can destroy your citadel, i don't see a problem.

However, i believe that CCP should create new missions for citadels to get around some of the issues people have raised in this thread. This could be the start of the long overdue and much needed revamp of PVE.

Going to ask you the same questions you have been refusing to answer in your topic about agents in worm holes.

Why would the NPC care about what happens in an area of space you control?

Why would they waste their resources putting an agent in an area of space they do not control an have no vested interest in?

How is this going to serve to add content to anyone other than the owner of the citadel?

Why do you deserve to have CCP add content to your area when you deny that same request to others simply because you live in a worm hole and they live in high sec?

We have been around this, each area of space has certain content available and that content is decided by CCP. When those in high sec want the higher end anoms etc they are told to move to where those things are available and that is how it should be. For whatever reason CCP has decided that mission are not going to be available in worm holes and in some areas of nul sec, if you live in these areas and you want to run missions then follow your own advice and go to where the missions are.
Jones Beach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#24 - 2016-06-17 20:03:19 UTC
Donnachadh wrote:


No I do not think high sec should get the things they do not have, if the players there want those activities they should move to where those activities are located. And the same goes for you, if you want something that does not exist in your area of space then move to where it does exist.




I dont propose that anybody get something that they dont already have. I actually suggest that lore restrictions on where agents can exist remain in place. Instead I propose a rebalancing of npc stations and citadels. Players should be able to have stationary agents in their citadels which would become the new hubs for agent pve in their systems (these agents would mirror the agents already in their systems) in nature the ones that already exist in their areas), while agents in npc stations would roam - creating the potential for conflict as they move from place to place and players follow them.

Whether players should be allowed to place agents in regions where they dont already exist - in wh, npc sov - or moving lvl 5 agents to places regions where they do not currently reside - is beyond the scope of my original proposal - i'm not opposed to allowing that flexibility - but clearly there is a balance question which ccp would have to resolve.
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#25 - 2016-06-17 21:06:40 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
do nullsec ratting systems really need something like this? you want to do missions then you should have to move around instead of having everything at your fingertips in a backwater nullsec system.

leave missions to npc stations which encourage people to move around to different regions of eve.


Do people move around that much with standings?

In NS, it would force people to move, not regions, but 2-3 systems. This would make it easier to catch and kill people running missions in NS as going through gates is when one is often most vulnerable.

As for loot drops there is a potential issue there. Either just have ISK rewards in NS or change the exchange rate.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Lan Wang
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#26 - 2016-06-17 21:20:47 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
do nullsec ratting systems really need something like this? you want to do missions then you should have to move around instead of having everything at your fingertips in a backwater nullsec system.

leave missions to npc stations which encourage people to move around to different regions of eve.


Do people move around that much with standings?

In NS, it would force people to move, not regions, but 2-3 systems. This would make it easier to catch and kill people running missions in NS as going through gates is when one is often most vulnerable.

As for loot drops there is a potential issue there. Either just have ISK rewards in NS or change the exchange rate.


an example, when i lived in curse doing angel missions, test lived near in the nullsec sov systems, test would travel to the angel mission systems to do missions, this wouldnt happen if citadels could have agents because they could just bang them in a citadel and farm them in pretty much safety of there intel chanels etc

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Jones Beach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2016-06-18 00:22:02 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
do nullsec ratting systems really need something like this? you want to do missions then you should have to move around instead of having everything at your fingertips in a backwater nullsec system.

leave missions to npc stations which encourage people to move around to different regions of eve.


Do people move around that much with standings?

In NS, it would force people to move, not regions, but 2-3 systems. This would make it easier to catch and kill people running missions in NS as going through gates is when one is often most vulnerable.

As for loot drops there is a potential issue there. Either just have ISK rewards in NS or change the exchange rate.


an example, when i lived in curse doing angel missions, test lived near in the nullsec sov systems, test would travel to the angel mission systems to do missions, this wouldnt happen if citadels could have agents because they could just bang them in a citadel and farm them in pretty much safety of there intel chanels etc


And just for the record - that is not what i proposed - in your example my system would allow citadel agents in the areas where the angel missions were not allowed but not in the areas where test lived in their nearby sov. Thus test would have to still come to the npc sov systems to do the missions and maybe make use of any public citadels in those systems or perhaps setup their own,
Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
#28 - 2016-06-18 14:05:56 UTC
Jones Beach wrote:
I dont propose that anybody get something that they dont already have. I actually suggest that lore restrictions on where agents can exist remain in place. Instead I propose a rebalancing of npc stations and citadels. Players should be able to have stationary agents in their citadels which would become the new hubs for agent pve in their systems (these agents would mirror the agents already in their systems) in nature the ones that already exist in their areas), while agents in npc stations would roam - creating the potential for conflict as they move from place to place and players follow them.

If there is already an agent in the system then who benefits from the ability to have an agent in your citadel?

Using Jaschercis as an example why would Fed Mart want to put an agent in your citadel when they already have multiple agents in that system?

Why would someone risk losing their stuff when your citadel is destroyed when they can simply go to the agent located in an NPC station in the same system knowing that their stuff is completely safe?

I have not really looked at the citadels because neither I nor my corp can afford one and we have no use for one at this point in time. Keeping that in mind if what follows is not really the problem that it appears it could be then please let me know.

If you allow me to dock today so I can run missions, what happens to my stuff if you change the profiles or access list and I can no longer dock at your citadel?
Do I simply loose it all because I can no longer get to it?
I was docked at your citadel when I logged off and when I log in I no longer have access rights to dock at your citadel what happens to my clone, and in fact can I even log in? If I can log in am I stuck in your citadel? When the profiles or access list is changed does my stuff and my clone get kicked into space even if I am not logged in?

Now we get to the moving agents around and the supposed creation of more chances for conflict.
Whether I un-dock to go run a mission several systems away, or simply un-dock to move my stuff several systems away because the agent moved I am still just one character in space flying one ship, so please explain to me how moving the agents around from place to place will increase the chances for conflict.
Jones Beach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2016-06-18 14:08:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Jones Beach
Donnachadh wrote:
Jones Beach wrote:
I dont propose that anybody get something that they dont already have. I actually suggest that lore restrictions on where agents can exist remain in place. Instead I propose a rebalancing of npc stations and citadels. Players should be able to have stationary agents in their citadels which would become the new hubs for agent pve in their systems (these agents would mirror the agents already in their systems) in nature the ones that already exist in their areas), while agents in npc stations would roam - creating the potential for conflict as they move from place to place and players follow them.

If there is already an agent in the system then who benefits from the ability to have an agent in your citadel?

Using Jaschercis as an example why would Fed Mart want to put an agent in your citadel when they already have multiple agents in that system?

Why would someone risk losing their stuff when your citadel is destroyed when they can simply go to the agent located in an NPC station in the same system knowing that their stuff is completely safe?

I have not really looked at the citadels because neither I nor my corp can afford one and we have no use for one at this point in time. Keeping that in mind if what follows is not really the problem that it appears it could be then please let me know.

If you allow me to dock today so I can run missions, what happens to my stuff if you change the profiles or access list and I can no longer dock at your citadel?
Do I simply loose it all because I can no longer get to it?
I was docked at your citadel when I logged off and when I log in I no longer have access rights to dock at your citadel what happens to my clone, and in fact can I even log in? If I can log in am I stuck in your citadel? When the profiles or access list is changed does my stuff and my clone get kicked into space even if I am not logged in?

Now we get to the moving agents around and the supposed creation of more chances for conflict.
Whether I un-dock to go run a mission several systems away, or simply un-dock to move my stuff several systems away because the agent moved I am still just one character in space flying one ship, so please explain to me how moving the agents around from place to place will increase the chances for conflict.


This isnt a question of lore. This is a question of putting more of station functions in a players hands. Hell if we want to play the lore game - why cant stations fit better reprocessing? They are pretty big - im sure if they wanted to they could upgrade and squeeze out that last 4 percent.

As for losing all your stuff -look up citadel mechanics - you cant be denied access to your stuff as you can always tigger the safety protocols.
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