EVE General Discussion

The skill system was good the way it was for this reason:
You set a skill to train, then go off and do whatever you want. You could be a good little grind monkey and mine or mission all day, or you could just wander around this universe and meet people. Or it could be taking a week or two off, which this game's "XP bar" doesn't care about one bit.
This is a concept which seems to be lost on a lot of people. For a lot of people, "do what you want" is "print ISK all day." If that's the game you want to play, fine. If that's the game you want to make us play, expect to get buried in rotten tomatoes. This is a game many of us come to and stayed in to get away from that kind of thing. There are many many MMOs out there where everyone who wants to grind XP all day can do that all the XP grinding they want, so go play those instead. Or make an EVE-like with an XP grind. I've played one of those, so... won't see you there.

For these people, there's a reason for the general hostility toward this idea, and any time a grind-for-faster-skills "option" is presented: this kind of mechanism discourages anything any activity which doesn't get you SP, or anything to trade for it.

If we want to keep newbies, show them the true nature of the game. Show them that they're not safe, and they will get blown away if someone decides it's worth it (or is drunk/tired), and this includes hisec. Show them that scams are OK, that backstabbing is a legitimate strategy. Show them that taking smart risks will get them more rewards. And show them that outcomes are not guaranteed: things can, in fact, go bad and worse. The sooner they find out those little details, the sooner they know if they belong here.

You clearly sleep alone.

Let us see how it develops and give developers opportunities (word game!) to try things and see how they act in real environment.
Theorycrafting is a nice thing but in the end we have to see how the ecosystem react on the changes and if it goes wrong, well disable it again.

But until then "stay calm Lathael" is my chant.

I did the same with skill extractors. It was a bit bitter to see some people to be maxed out just by throwing enough money to CCP (bad memories about greed is good); but in the end I have the feeling that I like the extractors.

And to stay in that theme: My character gets 50K skillpoints from a booster which is okay but not awesome.
With 10K each day I can get the effect of a skill extractor all 5 days without spending money. I like that.

We will see the effect on the ecosystem soon.

Finally

Logging in is content?

I am also against the creation of SP through any means but training and feel that CCP was deceptive when they claimed that training would remain the only source of new SP.

If you just HAVE to implement this nonsense, then I must ask:

Why does it have to be an npc kill? Why not just a kill?

What SP injecting mechanic are you implementing that would benefit real pla-- I mean, pvpers?

I don't do carebear things.

You're asking me to do a carebear thing.

That's gross.

Also, I don't think the people suggesting: "lol just hop out of your C6 and blap a sleeper XD" have ever even scanned a wormhole in their lives.

is the reward for logging in? did you even read anything?

A lot of the time, whenever someone wants a game or other franchise to get (or stay) big, they try to appeal to a broader audience, usually the least common denominator. In doing this, they have this habit of losing what made them different and special. And re-opening the market for that somewhere else, if that someone is smart enough to not try to go crazy huge.
Look what they did to the new Star Trek movies: action action action. Lots of fun visuals, but none of the philosophical-type questions which made the older ones Star Trek and unique. They're like re-skinned Star Wars movies.
Or Star Wars:Knights of the Old Republic 3. Instead of making an immersive solo-mode KOTOR3, they made SWTOR: WoW in Space With Lots of Expensive Voice Acted Cutscenes. And all the other immersion-breaking MMO things, like other players and respawning mobs. That game failed, so now they harpoon whales instead. That's possible to overdo as well: there were several threads "I went through three hypercrates [about $150] worth of stuff and didn't get super-rare item!" How many of those do you think are going to come back to the cash shop?

The solution is to put a stupid fear-of-missing-out mechanism in? If they're having trouble with people farming SP, extracting it, and selling it, maybe they need to stop selling extractors?

I'd expect most of the bittervets know better than to let it run their game, because it's how they got to be vets. They also know how to draw a line between two points and guess where it's heading.

The "rested XP" system in WoW was designed to slow down the people who had all day to play. The original presentation of it was "You will get less XP if you play too long." The community didn't take it too well. All they changed was the presentation: you get bonus XP if you stay in a rest area, and aside from a few who were paying attention, nobody said anything.
A lot of us are ex- WoW players.

Those don't belong here. Learning how to EVE will have you getting your ship getting exploded a lot. If they got all their wealth shot down in one go, they got a cardinal rule of EVE wrong: don't fly what you can't afford to lose. If they don't learn that lesson early, they're going to have a very hard time with the rest of the game.

If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross. But it's not for the timid. -Q

And the other fundamental truth of this game: if you don't go places, meet people, and make friends and enemies, you're probably not going to last very long either, because that rule is even more important than "Don't fly what you can't afford to lose."

Right. This thing wasn't and still isn't about newbies.