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Please reduce the number of SOV timers

First post
Author
Eli Apol
Definitely a nullsec alt
#401 - 2016-04-04 00:57:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Eli Apol
I'm happy fighting in ceptors as long as you guys are happy dying in them - personally I don't even fly a super because it looks boring as hell.

But sure, you're denying my content....and the MBC player numbers are suffering as a result

~koolaid~

fwiw a quote from a corpmate earlier today

"300 man ceptor gang with no tidi is the most fun I ever had in eve"

but what would I know, I'm just a salvager

Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#402 - 2016-04-04 00:58:30 UTC
Eli Apol
Definitely a nullsec alt
#403 - 2016-04-04 01:00:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Eli Apol
Rain6637 wrote:
I never said anything about numbers except let it climb.

Yeah playerbase is climbing...but goons player count is dropping...and somehow via mittani-esq spin, this is a good thing for you?


lmao

http://evemaps.dotlan.net/corp/movements

but what would I know, I'm just a salvager

Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#404 - 2016-04-04 01:01:17 UTC
Eli Apol
Definitely a nullsec alt
#405 - 2016-04-04 01:02:19 UTC
I mean if you drag this out for another 23 days...then that's another 1333 ceptor pilots that Horde has :)

but what would I know, I'm just a salvager

Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#406 - 2016-04-04 01:02:54 UTC
Sister MaryElephant
Stellar Conundrum
#407 - 2016-04-04 03:48:57 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
lol


Apparently CCP is unwilling to consult Kim Jong....errrr....lolmittens....about the name of the war.

You think your one-man crusade to change game mechanics will draw more attention?

I see your "lol" and raise you a Lol

FYI....sorry for interrupting NED's attempt at mini evac via WH space two nights ago. And HIC's on a WH in losec don't do much either.....

Actually....you guys are not very good at this game.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#408 - 2016-04-04 04:25:55 UTC
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#409 - 2016-04-04 04:31:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Zappity
Lucas Kell wrote:
Aiwha wrote:
You've abandoned more than half your space...
Certainly not more than half. The only space SMA has abandoned is space we had no intention of living in.

Probably time to update that statement after your SOTA.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#410 - 2016-04-04 06:47:10 UTC
Xeno Szenn wrote:
The sov mechanic system can only really be used ageist you if you care about sov. A lot of people seem to care about sov while others don’t if people dint care about sov and the defenders do it will always be in the attacker’s favor.
And you don't see the problem with this? The sov system is supposed to be about people who want sov deciding who gets it. Since it best used by simply not wanting sov there's no point in sov existing.

Xeno Szenn wrote:
The question will always come down to what is the greater power. The power to create and build or the power to destroy. What do people want to do in this game and how do they want to play.
Except it clearly doesn't, since like you've just said the attacker has the advantage by not caring about sov, thus they don't actually need to be more powerful.

Xeno Szenn wrote:
Fozzie sov seemed to desire to make a city state type of null sec where lots of groups owned and held sov. The old system meant only a few powerful groups could hold sov. What will happen when everything settles who knows. Will it go back to the way it was before with the Imperium owning half of sov null. Will Anyone hold sov, or will lots of groups hold sov? I don’t have an answer to that.
But that's not going to happen, what it's going to create is a place where it's irrelevant who holds sov since anyone can just roll in trigger all your timers, waste your time and inevitably destroy your space. It's a sov system that gives and overwhelming advantage to non-sov holders, which is probably the dumbest way for the mechanic to be. The only reason you like that is that you are the non-sov holder lol. As usual, players benefiting from the broken mechanic think it's fine.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#411 - 2016-04-04 06:53:20 UTC
Zappity wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Aiwha wrote:
You've abandoned more than half your space...
Certainly not more than half. The only space SMA has abandoned is space we had no intention of living in.
Probably time to update that statement after your SOTA.
Wait, so you're telling me situations change? Honestly I'm surprised!

Let me ask you this. If you achieve what you want and we move to invulnerable NPC stations then continue to play exactly as we always have from the safety of NPC space, what are you going to do then? Because you won't have your inherent advantage and supposedly you don't want to be blue with 40,000 people forever, but this war won't end just because a few of us have to relocate. You guys are way ahead of yourselves patting yourselves on the back lol

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#412 - 2016-04-04 07:27:27 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Zappity wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Aiwha wrote:
You've abandoned more than half your space...
Certainly not more than half. The only space SMA has abandoned is space we had no intention of living in.
Probably time to update that statement after your SOTA.
Wait, so you're telling me situations change? Honestly I'm surprised!

Let me ask you this. If you achieve what you want and we move to invulnerable NPC stations then continue to play exactly as we always have from the safety of NPC space, what are you going to do then? Because you won't have your inherent advantage and supposedly you don't want to be blue with 40,000 people forever, but this war won't end just because a few of us have to relocate. You guys are way ahead of yourselves patting yourselves on the back lol

I'm not patting myself on the back at all with that statement. One of the key tenets of this thread has been that the entosis war is annoying but not actually achieving anything because the space is being successfully defended. I'm just commenting that such is not the case.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.

Xeno Szenn
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#413 - 2016-04-04 07:30:15 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Xeno Szenn wrote:
The sov mechanic system can only really be used ageist you if you care about sov. A lot of people seem to care about sov while others don’t if people dint care about sov and the defenders do it will always be in the attacker’s favor.
And you don't see the problem with this? The sov system is supposed to be about people who want sov deciding who gets it. Since it best used by simply not wanting sov there's no point in sov existing.

IF there's no point it it exsisting then let it die. And I disagree with you there sov is supposed to be about people creating a castle and defending it. I don;lt want to have it or need to have it to attack your castle.. SHould I have to fight and strugle for it sure but to lay sige to it I dont need to want it just have the desire to attack it.

Xeno Szenn wrote:
The question will always come down to what is the greater power. The power to create and build or the power to destroy. What do people want to do in this game and how do they want to play.
Except it clearly doesn't, since like you've just said the attacker has the advantage by not caring about sov, thus they don't actually need to be more powerful.

Strange if i don;t need to be more stronger or more orginized why didn't you leave sov until everyone joined the fight. you guys could have left when it was just Tshu, horde, and waffles but since we couldn't fight all of you at once you held on till a greater force was assembled.

Xeno Szenn wrote:
Fozzie sov seemed to desire to make a city state type of null sec where lots of groups owned and held sov. The old system meant only a few powerful groups could hold sov. What will happen when everything settles who knows. Will it go back to the way it was before with the Imperium owning half of sov null. Will Anyone hold sov, or will lots of groups hold sov? I don’t have an answer to that.
But that's not going to happen, what it's going to create is a place where it's irrelevant who holds sov since anyone can just roll in trigger all your timers, waste your time and inevitably destroy your space. It's a sov system that gives and overwhelming advantage to non-sov holders, which is probably the dumbest way for the mechanic to be. The only reason you like that is that you are the non-sov holder lol. As usual, players benefiting from the broken mechanic think it's fine.


You claim that the only reason I like this is because I’m not a sov holder. That fact is untrue I like the system because you need to occupy all your space and maintain high indexes or the small guy can take a bit of it for however long they can hold onto it. Can a few things be tweaked sure but if you want Rome then you should have to create the armies, the infrastructure, and population of Rome. I think the Russians are over extended as well but that is beside the point. As for wasting your time it's your home if I come to burn it down shouldn't you have to fight me off. If I attack with a single frigate a single frigate can kill me. If people are constantly using the space. If I attack in mass, then a group needs to defend it. IF other people start complaining about that then I fell they are mistaken as well. My opinions are from my knowledge of eve and what I have read about and experienced. I will link my comments to others that complain about sov as well because honestly I think if you live there then defending it should be easy. Horde can live ratting in just a few systems and still make decent isk.

As for mechanics that I do think are broken and are being changed is spider tanking slow cats, and supper caps in their current form. Members of my alliance probably will disagree with me but the idea of complete safety is something I don’t think should exist in eve and I'm happy there chaining it. Wormhole escalations and the amount of isk you can make in almost complete safety that should also be examined and changed because the isk can be amazing when I was doing it. T3 cruisers and t3 destroyers could potentially need to be rebalanced the Svipul in particular is one ship that seems overpowered in most situations. But of course I’m biased so take it with a grain of salt.

I understand your position and that you disagree with what I'm saying and we don’t have to agree to discuss an issue. I honestly want a discussion on the subject. However, when it all comes down to your biased because your attacking of course you like it your attacking it limits the conversation. We are on opposite sides of this conflict but we are both people who play this game as a hobby for fun. If I were to say I would like to only entosis a structure once to flip, it or destroy it that would be c0mpletly unbalanced and biased towards the attacker. If I wanted to say only entosis a tcu to flip the system and the I hub and station flipped with it that would be biased. An honest discussion about the amount of space needed to live, Vulnerability windows, Should the attackers need to commit more and how can that be made better we have discussed. I disagree with some of your points and agree with a few suggestions you made to make sov better.

To put it another perspective I got out played today and lost a cerb fleet to caracals because 1 I made mistakes and 2 I got outplayed. Should I go and ask for cerbs to be buffed because I lost that fleet or should I say I made mistakes and need to improve. I think I need to improve and not make those mistakes. I have enjoyed the discussion you Myself and Rain6637 have been having but lol you’re the attacker or lol your goons does limit the conversation a bit. As i'm sure my forum formatting does as well.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#414 - 2016-04-04 08:34:20 UTC
Xeno Szenn wrote:
You claim that the only reason I like this is because I’m not a sov holder. That fact is untrue I like the system because you need to occupy all your space and maintain high indexes or the small guy can take a bit of it for however long they can hold onto it.
Except this isn't true, since all it takes is flying in and triggering timers forcing the defender to respond until the windows get wide enough that they can't stop them all. For all intents and purposes it doesn't seem to matter how much you use your space, if a non-sov holder wants to grind it down, they eventually will, and a sov holder can do nothing in return. A sov holding alliance also can't go on offense as that would leave their space wide open. So the system looks like it's designed such that sov holders are forced to spend all their time defending while non-sov holders are designated attackers. It should be that alliances are fighting over holding the space, not that the best course of action is to not hold it but harass those that do.

I mean just look at how this war is starting to go. Everyone based out of NPC stations because basing anywhere else is suicide. The whole concept of living in a declared home is rapidly diminishing, and that's a damn shame. If they want proper occupancy sov they should just scrap entosis, scrap the structures and make it pure occupancy based, then the only way to take as well as hold a system is to actually live in it rather than this timer based crap.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#415 - 2016-04-04 10:05:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Barrogh Habalu
Lucas Kell wrote:
If they want proper occupancy sov they should just scrap entosis, scrap the structures and make it pure occupancy based, then the only way to take as well as hold a system is to actually live in it rather than this timer based crap.

Actually, structures are fine. One have to shoot them and tank them if they want to do something about it.

Complete sov removal as a means to actually achieve occupancy sov? I'm pretty sure people are finally started to see the sandboxey light.

Xeno Szenn wrote:
I think the Russians are over extended as well but that is beside the point.

Russians would fold as fast as Imperial fringe should they experience same pressure that people are putting on Imperium. But somehow their strategy works fine for them so far. Guess being mostly neutral, not trying to maintain high profile in EVE-related media while going out of their way to create an image of extremely obnoxious space dictators who own New Eden (and you too!) kinda helps with that. General playerbase being physically incapable to sh*tpost on public forums makes it more convenient to maintain such a policy in practice.
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#416 - 2016-04-04 10:06:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Barrogh Habalu
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#417 - 2016-04-04 10:40:11 UTC
Making sov organic somehow is a nice thought, but you wouldn't get the same satisfaction as long as players could contest sov ownership in forum threads with "yuh huh, nuh uh"
Dark Lord Trump
Infinite Point
Pandemic Horde
#418 - 2016-04-04 10:54:53 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Except this isn't true, since all it takes is flying in and triggering timers forcing the defender to respond until the windows get wide enough that they can't stop them all.

Lucas Kell wrote:
stop them all



Ah, there's your problem. You've overextended and can't defend all your space, so it gets taken from you.

I'm going to build a big wall that will keep the Gallente out, and they're going to pay for it!

Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#419 - 2016-04-04 10:58:49 UTC
Mr Mieyli
Doomheim
#420 - 2016-04-04 11:07:30 UTC
Lol = tears

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