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Worries about the skill injectors, and the future of the game.

First post
Author
W33b3l
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#481 - 2016-03-14 16:36:18 UTC  |  Edited by: W33b3l
raknor bile wrote:
W33b3l wrote:


The fact they can only be brought into existence by buying aurum means that CCP cares more about making RW money off it then it benefiting the game itself.


You do know CCP is a company and that they exist to make money right?



You know we pay a 15 dollar a month subscription fee right?

Also a company has to produce a product worth buying at a fair price.

So let's say they came out with a specific class of ship that only can be bought with a real world money transaction in EVE. Would that cross the line for you? At what point is "give us extra money and we give you this" in a subscription based mmo too much for you?

You know who does this? Warcraft. You want to play space Warcraft? I can live with injectors existing but if they keep adding stuff in game like this I'll be done. Since EVE is my favorite game of all time and ive been playing it forever with several accounts. That says something.
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#482 - 2016-03-14 16:37:55 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:


It is already in place and it can get worse.
APIs + Injectors, you can make sure your members inject certain skills to train a doctrine and have perfect skills for it.


People are free to leave corp who have requirement higher than what they are willing to deal with. If a corp\alliance think it will keep it's member base after forcing it to burn isk or $$$ on injectors, they are free to proceed with that but I doubt it would really be common.
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#483 - 2016-03-14 16:40:33 UTC
W33b3l wrote:

You know who does this? Warcraft. You want to play space Warcraft? I can live with injectors existing but if they keep adding stuff in game like this I'll be done. Since EVE is my favorite game of all time and ive been playing it forever with several accounts. That says something.


Mounts and pet sure are overpowered and offering them for real money is breaking WoW...

Oh wait...
Jenshae Chiroptera
#484 - 2016-03-15 03:44:08 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
... keep it's member base after forcing it to burn ISK or $$$ on injectors, ...
Being in a top down ISK alliance, I think you should understand that this won't be necessary.
"We need you to have XYZ skills to fly these doctrine ships. I am going to trade you a skill injector at a time and make sure via API that you inject them correctly."

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.

Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#485 - 2016-03-15 03:59:49 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
... keep it's member base after forcing it to burn ISK or $$$ on injectors, ...
Being in a top down ISK alliance, I think you should understand that this won't be necessary.
"We need you to have XYZ skills to fly these doctrine ships. I am going to trade you a skill injector at a time and make sure via API that you inject them correctly."


Holy **** the thinfoil on your head is much thicker than I though.
Jenshae Chiroptera
#486 - 2016-03-15 04:02:36 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
... Holy **** the thinfoil on your head is much thicker than I though.
You've never just given someone in your alliance that you like 500M to help them with something?

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.

Nat Silverguard
Aideron Robotics
#487 - 2016-03-15 04:06:15 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
... Holy **** the thinfoil on your head is much thicker than I though.
You've never just given someone in your alliance that you like 500M to help them with something?


i still can't see/find anybody/corp/alliance slaughtering anybody ingame because of suddenly having high SPs. Roll

Just Add Water

Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#488 - 2016-03-15 04:20:39 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
... keep it's member base after forcing it to burn ISK or $$$ on injectors, ...
Being in a top down ISK alliance, I think you should understand that this won't be necessary.
"We need you to have XYZ skills to fly these doctrine ships. I am going to trade you a skill injector at a time and make sure via API that you inject them correctly."
Still not seeing the actual issue here. Are you trying to paint a mutually beneficial exchange of SP as a bad thing? I'd assume line members of an alliance would gladly except free SP for the fleets they'd already be flying anyways while still having their normal training to take in other directions as they saw fit.
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#489 - 2016-03-15 04:35:13 UTC
W33b3l wrote:
You know we pay a 15 dollar a month subscription fee right?

Also a company has to produce a product worth buying at a fair price.
And? That only entitles you to as much as CCP should decide. If you find that undesirable it's certainly your decision to make, but there isn't a universal consensus of fair obviously since there are plenty of extractors at the current price point.

On a related note to your prior post: AUR/PLEX have player driven isk prices and as such while the price for extractors may be effectively fixed to that price relative to their AUR cost, the in game cost is still player driven as a consequence.

W33b3l wrote:
So let's say they came out with a specific class of ship that only can be bought with a real world money transaction in EVE. Would that cross the line for you? At what point is "give us extra money and we give you this" in a subscription based mmo too much for you?
Yes, provided it was actually useful in some respect (they've already gone the "hangar trinket for PLEX route" several times so it's a bit late to be outraged about that), but that's not even remotely what's happening here so you're slippery sloping a bit. Thing is, and it's worth repeating, CCP isn't selling SP in any new way since MCTCs. Other players are selling their SP and their deciding it's worthwhile at the price point presented.

W33b3l wrote:
You know who does this? Warcraft. You want to play space Warcraft? I can live with injectors existing but if they keep adding stuff in game like this I'll be done. Since EVE is my favorite game of all time and ive been playing it forever with several accounts. That says something.
All it says is that you have an opinion and the capacity to leave the game. Same as everyone else. That doesn't elevate you to being an arbiter of what's ultimately good or bad here.
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#490 - 2016-03-15 05:10:09 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
... Holy **** the thinfoil on your head is much thicker than I though.
You've never just given someone in your alliance that you like 500M to help them with something?


Well 500m no because I am perpetually poor but I doubt the alliance management will fiance my "powerleveling" into T3 cruisers or anything like that...
Jenshae Chiroptera
#491 - 2016-03-16 13:11:07 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
... Holy **** the thinfoil on your head is much thicker than I though.
You've never just given someone in your alliance that you like 500M to help them with something?
Well 500m no because I am perpetually poor but I doubt the alliance management will fiance my "powerleveling" into T3 cruisers or anything like that...
If you have proven loyal, would not a better pilot prove less costly to SRP and the rest of the fleet in the long term?

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.

Kamahl Daikun
Perkone
Caldari State
#492 - 2016-03-16 18:16:17 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
W33b3l wrote:
You know we pay a 15 dollar a month subscription fee right?

Also a company has to produce a product worth buying at a fair price.
And? That only entitles you to as much as CCP should decide. If you find that undesirable it's certainly your decision to make, but there isn't a universal consensus of fair obviously since there are plenty of extractors at the current price point.

On a related note to your prior post: AUR/PLEX have player driven isk prices and as such while the price for extractors may be effectively fixed to that price relative to their AUR cost, the in game cost is still player driven as a consequence.


I'm not involved in this debate but this part is factually false.
By offering a product for a price, the company is asserting that the product is actually worth that price. For example, buying a soda for $1 is fine but buying the same product for $5 (500% increase) is ridiculous. This assertion is proven by the consumers buying the product for that price.

Perspective: People are fine with a $15 monthly sub for Eve

However, this also puts a requirement on the company to continue to deliver a product that is worth that price. If Eve were to become a horrible game, it wouldn't be worth $15. Sales would dwindle, as would active players and thereby the reputation of the game. It's a straight slope down at this point.
The recovery would be to either lower the sub, eliminate the sub, or retract whatever it is they did to cause this in the first place (while adding in some compensation for good measure).

tl;dr we're not "entitled" to "as much as CCP decides". Consumers (us) ultimately decide what does and doesn't work. The problem is most consumers won't go that far.
Dregalis DeGraiden
Doomheim
#493 - 2016-03-17 11:15:02 UTC
Only complete incompetents can't see that skill injectors is pay2win. Seriously it's like the people in Eve have stop using their brain and just does whatever CCP tells them too.

CCP says " it's the same as Char Bazaar but only better". Players go "duuhh okay it's not pay2win", like a bunch of brainwash little children.

For those who continuously spout "you can't buy PVP skills". Let me ask, since when did Eve become a PVP Only game?