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Mutual Wars - can someone explain? Update - Explained
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MrsPotatoHead
Doomheim
#1 - 2015-12-09 10:52:16 UTC  |  Edited by: MrsPotatoHead
Hi all,


Ok I've been searching the internet for the mechanics and haven't been able to find a definitive answer.

We'll use Corp A and Corp B



Corp A wardecs Corp B
Corp B makes the wardec mutual
Corp A wants to end the war

How does corp A end the war? If corp B won't accept the surrender does that mean the war is permanent?




I have searched for an answer but can't find anything that makes it clear what happens.

Thanks.


When the defending corp makes a war mutual there is no way out for the aggressing corp unless the defending corp accepts the surrender.
Ynot Eyob
Nisroc Angels
The Obsidian Front - Reborn
#2 - 2015-12-09 11:25:33 UTC
If i rember right, Corp A can retract the WAR after 1 week, even though corp B made it mutual.

But dont hang me if it wrong, i know it got changed 2 years ago as one huge alliance who decced someone else ended in an ongoing WAR.

Nisroc - Angel of Freedom Nisroc is known as "The Great Eagle".
MrsPotatoHead
Doomheim
#3 - 2015-12-09 11:35:43 UTC
Ynot Eyob wrote:
If i rember right, Corp A can retract the WAR after 1 week, even though corp B made it mutual.

But dont hang me if it wrong, i know it got changed 2 years ago as one huge alliance who decced someone else ended in an ongoing WAR.




Yeah that's all the things I could find and it's been so long since I've been involved in any wars. 0.0 life and Faction warfare have kept me away from it.


Everything I was reading seems to go back to 2012/13 when Dec Shield were about.

Cheers for the reply.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#4 - 2015-12-09 14:19:21 UTC
In fact the only time you can ever retract a war is when someone makes it mutual.

Why is this the only time you can retract a war? Who knows.
MrsPotatoHead
Doomheim
#5 - 2015-12-09 15:23:09 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
In fact the only time you can ever retract a war is when someone makes it mutual.

Why is this the only time you can retract a war? Who knows.



Coming from you guys I would assume you know what you're on about :)

I understand you to be well versed in these areas.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#6 - 2015-12-09 16:54:14 UTC
Mutual wars presently are barely a thing. The only function they have is to allow the aggressor to maintain the war for free. The functionality of locking the aggressor into the war is removed entirely as onice the war is made mutual the aggressor can then retract at any point. Simeltaneously the ability to retract wars under any other circumstance is also removed, meaning unless one party surrenders the minimum duration of any war will be a week.

What this means in practice is that it's much less likely for a defender to cause a war to end early by fighting the aggressor, whereas previously beating the poo out of an aggressor early in a war would often prompt the aggressor to retract the war, now they can't do that, they have to surrender instead, which generally speaking they won't do.

Ultimately it's a mechanics change that lead to defenders no longer being able to actually achieve the objective of ending wars by fighting.
SurrenderMonkey
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#7 - 2015-12-09 17:18:57 UTC  |  Edited by: SurrenderMonkey
Quote:
Why is this the only time you can retract a war? Who knows.


My guess would be that they want the aggressor to be "invested" for at least a week, normally, but they also wanted to prevent, e.g.;

Corp A decs Corp B.
Corp B makes dec mutual.
All members of Corp B, save one alt, abandon the corp and form a new one.

Corp A now has a war on the books forever, or until they "surrender" to the empty corp.

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
Flyinghotpocket
Small Focused Memes
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#8 - 2015-12-09 20:09:58 UTC
if the war was made mutual. you cant surrender for 2 weeks.

Amarr Militia Representative - A jar of nitro
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#9 - 2015-12-10 15:40:28 UTC
SurrenderMonkey wrote:
My guess would be that they want the aggressor to be "invested" for at least a week, normally

I think that's what they were going for too, however there's a huge logical failure in that reasoning. If an aggressor wants to end a war, and the defender wants to cause the war to end who benefits by having the aggressor locked in for a week? Literally nobody benefits from the inability of the aggressor to retract a war.

It's just a little ill-conceived.
MrsPotatoHead
Doomheim
#10 - 2015-12-11 12:54:50 UTC  |  Edited by: MrsPotatoHead
Ok, so submitted a ticket to CCP to find out the exact mechanics.

Turns out basically that unless the Defender, corp B, accepts the Surrender then the war is permanent with no way out for Corp A.


The response is something along the lines of "Because most people in-game know about how it works then it's not really a broken system"

The solution is to create a corp for when you want to declare wars and when you're done, quit that corp.

A little bit bummed out by this response and the mechanic in general but hey-ho guess I'll just have to work with it for now.
Marius Labo
Licence To Kill
Mercenary Coalition
#11 - 2016-03-02 22:01:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Marius Labo
Obviously we don't know the content of your ticket to CCP so I'm not sure what the fail here is. I suspect the question and answer in the ticket was focused entirely on the surrender mechanic.

Surrenders have to be accepted by the other party or a war continues, however, if the war is mutual then the original aggressor can retract the war and the war will end after the 24 hour cool down.

Sources:
http://community.eveonline.com/news/patch-notes/patch-notes-for-retribution-1
Look under "War Changes"

Forums:
https://forums.testeveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2159028#post2159028

So, given your scenario:

Corp A wardecs Corp B
Corp B makes the wardec mutual
Corp A wants to end the war

Corp A simply retracts the war, and it will end. Keep in mind this is different than offering a surrender, which the other side must accept for the offered surrender to end the war.

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Mercenary Coalition Forums

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