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Eve Online 4 years later

First post
Author
Zappity
Kurved Trading
#21 - 2016-02-12 09:31:40 UTC
Pay to Win refers to in-game advantages which can only be purchased with RL cash.

EVE does not have pay to win.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.

Sobaan Tali
Caldari Quick Reaction Force
#22 - 2016-02-12 09:58:27 UTC
^ Bingo. In MWO for instance, Hero Mechs and Mechbays can only be purchased with MC, which is an in game currency that can only be bought with real-world currency. That's P2W. Nothing in Eve so far beyond vanity items falls into this category.

In contrast, there are also other Mechs, modules, pilot skills, etc. that have both an MC option and a C-bill (normal in game currency, same as ISK is to us) option to buy, making them available to all players, whether you buy it by playing the game or paying out of pocket for more immediate access. That's not really the same thing as P2W, though you can once more pay for more immediate access for many of those said items.

"Tomahawks?"

"----in' A, right?"

"Trouble is, those things cost like a million and a half each."

"----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."

Gully Alex Foyle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2016-02-12 10:32:11 UTC
Trolling aside, anyone can have their own view on what constitues p2w.


However, at least three features set EVE apart from other games:

. Any item or service (like PLEX and SP injectors) is freely tradeable on the in-game market, which I bet is the best, most complex and realistic market of any game. If you know how to make ISK, you can have anything for free.

. In the core PVP activity (spaceship combat), numbers are a very effective counter to 'gear' and SP. There are no organized 1v1s or 5v5s where better equipment will almost guarantee you a win. Your opponent spent RL$ for faction modules and all LVL Vs? Just bring a friend and laugh while he dies.

. In-game scamming is allowed and encouraged. Rich kid bought fancy stuff with RL$? Just steal it! I bet someone will find a way to scam people for their SP, too.


TL;DR: Yes RL$ will buy you certain advantages in EVE, but you can't deny that the game is designed to allow skillful and clever players to nullify these advantages.

I would add that laughing at WOW-like players' reactions when this happens is one of the EVE community's favorite pastimes. Twisted

Make space glamorous! Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!

Ibutho Inkosi
Doomheim
#24 - 2016-02-12 10:51:43 UTC
Methinks there is a crowd that likes to exaggerate the importance and extent of their "skill" in actual game play. They, of course, have to claim Skill Points (for instance) aren't as important as "knowing how to play". So, switching on a web/scram combo then blobbing a passerby requires such extraordinary skill - it can even be done in a T1 dessie, so who needs skill points?

It's patently obvious this hot shot pilot doesn't have a clue as to the depth of this game's functionality, and if you limit yourself to one or two things, and say everything else is a waste of time, and not cool, well....yeah, they can be all kinds of uber skilled!

Conversely, when they do gang **** someone, they chalk that person's loss as lack of skill on their part. The only way to truly elevate oneself is to denigrate another...naturally.

Where these people get off claiming they've played this game I have no idea. I keep coming to this board looking for the sorts of posts from old discussing the game in great depth and detail, and I see it's now permanently filled with ... this.

Sad, really, if anything in EVE's history can be called "sad."

As long as the tale of the hunt is told by the hunter, and not the lion, it will favor the hunter.

Gully Alex Foyle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2016-02-12 11:04:27 UTC
Ibutho Inkosi wrote:
I keep coming to this board looking for the sorts of posts from old discussing the game in great depth and detail, and I see it's now permanently filled with ... this.
Try posting an interesting topic or question in the proper subforum (W&T, S&M, Market, Wormholes, even New Player Q&A) and you'll easily get deep and detailed discussions.

Happened to me 100% of the time.

If you just want to whine, then yes GD is the right place.

Make space glamorous! Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!

Josef Djugashvilis
#26 - 2016-02-12 11:35:15 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
soo many threads and soo many people preaching pay2win in all these threads but yet when asked whats pay2win they revert you to some other thread, seems legit


You know as well as I do that the term pay2win in Eve is shorthand for being able to pay real life cash to gain an advantage in terms of acquiring skill points.

By the logic that there is no 'win' in Eve, then 'gold ammo' would not be pay2win.

This is not a signature.

Sneaky Little Bastard
Doomheim
#27 - 2016-02-12 11:40:39 UTC
Zappity wrote:
Pay to Win refers to in-game advantages which can only be purchased with RL cash.

EVE does not have pay to win.


Like Skill Extractors you mean ? Roll
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat
#28 - 2016-02-12 11:41:46 UTC
Sneaky Little Bastard wrote:
Zappity wrote:
Pay to Win refers to in-game advantages which can only be purchased with RL cash.

EVE does not have pay to win.


Like Skill Extractors you mean ? Roll


no that would be a disadvantage

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

Nat Silverguard
Aideron Robotics
#29 - 2016-02-12 11:46:30 UTC
LordInvisible wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
soo many threads and soo many people preaching pay2win in all these threads but yet when asked whats pay2win they revert you to some other thread, seems legit


P2W in EvE means that you can buy all your shinies that give you an edge in a fight against same leved and skilled player.

With other words: you cannot win EvE, but every killmail you get is a win over a player in EvE. With P2W stuff, you can get this killmails easier, thus winning easier.

To further develop analogy: imagine two boxers in a ring: one paid extra bucks for having a bit better gloves which results in better hits to opponent. He did not cheat, he did not improve his stamina or tactics, just a tool to use his skills, stamina and tactics is better then opponents. That doesnt mean he won LIFE. Also opponent can come back in next fight.

Same is with EvE.


wow, killmail. poor logi bros will never win. good thing i prefer EWAR (specifically damping) for whoring, gg. o7

Just Add Water

Tokyo Drifter
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#30 - 2016-02-12 12:15:40 UTC
I am pretty sure the people crying about these new skill packets are hi-sec warriors and incursions runner who spent years doing level 4 before being able to hop in a pimp pirate BS. Now they no longer have anything to feel special beside being the laughing stock of the EvE community.
Amber Kurvora
#31 - 2016-02-12 12:27:48 UTC
Pay to win? Not really. Winning in Eve is far more about intelligence, experience, and people skills. There's a reason why all the really good stories that spawn from the game encompass the sort of social engineering that puts Niccolò Machiavelli to shame.

That nice faction fit Tengu someone put together can be torn apart by a bunch of newbie ships, fitted right and filled with people willing to listen to an FC who knows what he's doing. Sure, SP allow you to fly nicer ships, but those nicer ships also hurt more when you lose them.
MidnightWyvern
The Bosena Accords
#32 - 2016-02-12 13:54:19 UTC
Tokyo Drifter wrote:
I am pretty sure the people crying about these new skill packets are hi-sec warriors and incursions runner who spent years doing level 4 before being able to hop in a pimp pirate BS. Now they no longer have anything to feel special beside being the laughing stock of the EvE community.

This is cruel but I laughed a lot reading it.

+1 to you, sir.

Rattati Senpai noticed us! See you in the next FPS!

Alts: Saray Wyvern, Mobius Wyvern (Dust 514)

Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
#33 - 2016-02-12 14:03:33 UTC
Quote:
laughing stock of the EvE community

Arent we all by definition by taking our part in this show? Even the laughing public, they are good comic actors by themselves, unitentionally.
flakeys
Doomheim
#34 - 2016-02-12 14:12:37 UTC
Liz Arran wrote:
I remember watching fanfest back in the day .



Tsssk 2010 talking bout back in the day , you're not even half the eve-age needed to talk about back in the day son Lol.Hell we didn't even have fanfest back in the day.

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.

Lion Drome
Der Wehrmacht
#35 - 2016-02-12 14:17:43 UTC
Liz Arran wrote:

I remember watching fanfest back in the day and what ever happened to this idea? I assume that the project got scraped. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8k7oaz8mWug . Also I thought CCP would of released optional HD/4K texture packs by now cause I remember there was a 100+ page thread demanding for this.
track.


Quote from another thread post.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=6029558#post6029558

CCP Darwin wrote:
helana Tsero wrote:
FFS. Why do u guys consistantly announce stuff (during a keynote noless) and then 6 months later say ... 'Oh wait.. yeah this is not going to happen now..or its going to take a longer cause we have other priorities...(which is a polite way of saying its now never going to happen).

In this instance, it's because we got into doing it, then, looking at the images side-by-side, realized it didn't add much. All of us were surprised at how little a difference it made.

If we make this happen, it's going to be to check a box, not because it adds much to the look of the game. We have at least one other change coming not too far out that will do a lot more to make EVE look better when running at highest settings.

Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
#36 - 2016-02-12 14:30:39 UTC
They would rather remove old Orbit Camera soon. Because it doesnt add to the game, as we can all play new default Disorientation Camera now. It sure adds, or should I say adds in negative, as in subtracts.
Jean-Jaques Keikira
Perkone
Caldari State
#37 - 2016-02-12 15:11:14 UTC
This is one game where you would think that veteran players would just be salivating for a "P2W" model.

Wouldn't it be great for credit card warriors to PLEX and inject their way into battleships right away and then blunder around while having no idea how to actually fight in one?

Come on capsuleers, think.
embrel
BamBam Inc.
#38 - 2016-02-12 15:29:08 UTC
Daniela Doran wrote:

Why do people still call this game Eve?? It's now called World of Spaceships or WoSS.

If you're looking for a new experience I suggest farming SP for isk. Or you can whip out your credit card and charge your way to uberness in no time.


Reading you it should properly be called "Whiners in space"
Bad Messenger
Rehabilitation Clinic
#39 - 2016-02-13 01:49:31 UTC
Zappity wrote:
Wow, such bitter.

CCP has spent much of the last few years fixing bugs and improving gameplay. They are moving back into big features now.


sadly it took 5 years too long for them to move back to big features.
Pandora Carrollon
Provi Rapid Response
Apocalypse Now.
#40 - 2016-02-13 02:25:58 UTC
Look, I'm not afraid to wade into waters deeper than I should be swimming in, so here goes.

I'm ad admitted newbie. So I don't have all the personal stuff tied up into a sizeable chunk of time with the game. It's not a function of my operating ego yet, using the Freudian concept of ego there.

However, that doesn't mean that I don't understand the viewpoint of the grizzled vets that feel betrayed because the game now offers newcomers something that it took months to years to earn before. That also doesn't mean that it's not a smart move on CCP's part. All these posts over SP trading feel like I'm reading a hospice support blog. I can actually point out the stages of grief in a lot of them.

As to the game not changing for good or ill, I can't speak to that, I wasn't in it 4 years ago, but I can make a simple observation, if it truly has changed for the worse, then the playerbase will leave. I've seen this in EVER OTHER MMO out there. The company takes notice of the defections and works like mad to fix it. Usually they do and pass out player goodies as a mea culpa, or the game just dies.

Why are we here, posting in a forum that supports a game that we are mutually playing? Commiseration on the latest 'bad' changes? Trying to make the game better for whatever our playstyle is? Suggesting improvements and offer suggestions on game direction? I say, all of the above, but forums don't work if every thread turns into a grief fest of passive aggressive woe is me-isms. They work best when people stay positive and try to make changes for the better.

If you're here just to make everyone else miserable, there are far worse games out there that you can go find and you'll have a lot of company on their boards. I think helpful, positive posts get far more done with Dev's than gripe swipes.
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