Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Currently, the only hauling skills that require significant investment are those for jump freighters which require Industry V, which is usable by multiple professions anyway. Also the jump drive skills are multi-role skills. There is no real hauling-specific training required. For example, for the Epithal and other common haulers it takes only 7 minutes to train them or something like that. Even an Obelisk has a low training requirement and NONE of the requirements for the Obelisk are hauling-specific. They are all skills that are useful in other professions, except Gallente Industrial III, which takes just a few hours to train. The only haulers that require any advanced training are the things like the "blockade" runners that require a level V racial industrial skill, several weeks of training. But these ships are more specialized ships that are rarely used, not the meat and potatoes of hauling.

I think that hauling should be a profession which has significant skill requirements and that the skill system should have heavier, multi-month training requirements for haulers and those requirements should be hauling specific, not generic skills like "advanced spaceship command" that can be used for a lot of different professions.

I am being altruistic here. I am not a hauler. In fact, I am a trader, so the current system benefits me because anybody can be a hauler, so it makes it cheaper for me to get things hauled. So, the changes proposed here would actually make it more expensive for me to move my goods. Nevertheless, I think it would be good for the game to make hauling more specialized, even though it would cost me more money.

speaking as someone who can fly nomads and prowlers/mastodons i feel the training time for them is about right..

They are certainly comparable to other ships of equivalent size... A mastodon and a t2 cruiser have very comparable training times, as do nomads and carriers (although its been YEARS since i skilled for my carrier as a 25m sp nubbie)

Oh, yeah, having to train for 7 minutes, that is a very "healthy" level of skill required. Real tough. Train for 7 minutes to get an Epithal. Real big investment. Huge career decision there. Wow, what a profession, requires a whole 7 minutes to train. Real professional devotion required for that.

So how long do you think it should take a brand new character to be able to fly a basic industrial?

And a freighter?

How about a DST? Give us some numbers. And then explain WHY you think it should take that amount of time.

And can you also explain why you feel the creation of a basic 5 planet PI alt should take five weeks rather than one? And a basic miner should likewise take several months instead of one? And nobody should think about industry for a month minimum instead of building ammo on day one?


It never took a month to go over 10km3. You could do that in your seven minutes with a bestower pre patch.

You can't be sure in this game. Trolls and people of special mental capacity are almost indistinguishable at times.

So basically, "Make a low-skill, insurable DST that's better than a DST"?

Haulers are already in a pretty good place. A few more specialized-hold haulers to round out the non-gallente lines would be nice, perhaps.

DST would still be faster at warp than this new T1 battleship-indy.
I've trained 3 races of indy: I started with Amarr, took Gallente for special indies, Caldari for Badger.

The Kryos and Miasmos are nice special indies, but any DST is still going to be faster because of warp speed once you get DST V. Oh, and I wouldn't want to fly a loaded Epithal to Jita 4-4 unless I wanted to see my ship boom.

Guilty of only scanning the rest after reading the OP but here goes.

Being a "professional" hauler in this game has nothing to do with character skills and everything to do with the person behind the character so why change the skills training requirements?

Hauling and the attendant skill training isn't broken. Staph Beink a Bonehedd. No broken, don't fix.