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Question on laser ships
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Jace Varus
Lemur Appreciation Society
#1 - 2016-01-12 23:04:34 UTC
If laser ships can only do EM and thermal damage, aren't they at a disadvantage if they're fighting against a ship with low explosive or kinetic resists? Are laser ships still viable for PVP and PVE?
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#2 - 2016-01-12 23:08:00 UTC
Lazor application often mitigates this quite well.

ships are generally omi tanked in pvp any way so the resist thing is often negligible.

yes , they are very much viable.

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

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Leila Meurtrier
Why Am I Not Surprised
#3 - 2016-01-12 23:28:52 UTC
Yes, lasers are locked into EM/Thermal. Still, the only case when it'll be a problem is Armor tanked minmatar HAC. Then again, they'll have problems with their barrage shenanigans and you WILL be armortanked on amarr ships.
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#4 - 2016-01-13 00:00:14 UTC
Hybrid ships are kin/therm locked as well. It isn't as big as issue as you might think.
Jace Varus
Lemur Appreciation Society
#5 - 2016-01-13 21:55:18 UTC
Zhilia Mann wrote:
Hybrid ships are kin/therm locked as well. It isn't as big as issue as you might think.



But lasers won't do any good against Gurista or Serpentis rats?
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#6 - 2016-01-13 22:07:38 UTC
Just fly what you want, don't worry about what isk/hr guys say about guristas

Oh god.
Jace Varus
Lemur Appreciation Society
#7 - 2016-01-13 22:22:12 UTC
Riot Girl wrote:
Just fly what you want, don't worry about what isk/hr guys say about guristas


Yeah, I know. I'm just wondering if their damage type is completely horrible against Gurista/Serpentis rats or what.
Dalts
Out of Focus
Odin's Call
#8 - 2016-01-13 23:28:34 UTC
Jace Varus wrote:
Riot Girl wrote:
Just fly what you want, don't worry about what isk/hr guys say about guristas


Yeah, I know. I'm just wondering if their damage type is completely horrible against Gurista/Serpentis rats or what.


Yes lasers are horrible for ratting Guristas, less so for Serp.
Kosetzu
The Black Crow Bandits
Northern Coalition.
#9 - 2016-01-14 00:16:51 UTC
Angels are the only ones where you really notice much in terms of resistances screwing over lasers. Aside from that I can't say lasers are at much of a disadvantange, except against neuts.
Hochopepa
Creative Research and Production Services
#10 - 2016-01-14 14:44:35 UTC
Jace Varus wrote:
Zhilia Mann wrote:
Hybrid ships are kin/therm locked as well. It isn't as big as issue as you might think.



But lasers won't do any good against Gurista or Serpentis rats?


My alt's 1200 dps Absolution says otherwise. Guristas and Serpentis melt rather quickly. Keep in mind, for both of those rats, their secondary weakness is thermal. fit the right crystals and it's not an issue.
Abby Silverwind
Demonic Retribution
The Initiative.
#11 - 2016-01-15 01:06:48 UTC
Jace Varus wrote:
If laser ships can only do EM and thermal damage, aren't they at a disadvantage if they're fighting against a ship with low explosive or kinetic resists? Are laser ships still viable for PVP and PVE?



Yep

But you gewt the Rock paper sisoor feel of Eve right?

If you want to do Explosive damage take a....... (insert cancer tier ship here)

Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil, for you are with me;

Your rod and your staff, they comfort me.

Drunk Posting Best Posting
Abby Silverwind
Demonic Retribution
The Initiative.
#12 - 2016-01-15 01:07:35 UTC
Abby Silverwind wrote:
Jace Varus wrote:
If laser ships can only do EM and thermal damage, aren't they at a disadvantage if they're fighting against a ship with low explosive or kinetic resists? Are laser ships still viable for PVP and PVE?



Yep

But you gewt the Rock paper sisoor feel of Eve right?

If you want to do Explosive damage take a....... (insert cancer tier ship here)



Oh yeah NOmen OP <3

Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil, for you are with me;

Your rod and your staff, they comfort me.

Drunk Posting Best Posting
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#13 - 2016-01-15 03:20:34 UTC
Abby Silverwind wrote:
Jace Varus wrote:
If laser ships can only do EM and thermal damage, aren't they at a disadvantage if they're fighting against a ship with low explosive or kinetic resists? Are laser ships still viable for PVP and PVE?



Yep

But you gewt the Rock paper sisoor feel of Eve right?

If you want to do Explosive damage take a....... (insert cancer tier ship here)


You should see an oncologists for chemo therapy.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever
Dom Arkaral
Bannheim
Something Really Pretentious
#14 - 2016-01-20 15:13:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Dom Arkaral
Kosetzu wrote:
Angels are the only ones where you really notice much in terms of resistances screwing over lasers. Aside from that I can't say lasers are at much of a disadvantange, except against neuts.


I can't agree enough
That L4 mission with Angels and Blood raiders (I think) is hard if you go against the Angels

Edit: had too much negativity in my comment (does that make it positive? Lol)

Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester.

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CCL Loyalist
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#15 - 2016-01-20 15:54:50 UTC
Kosetzu wrote:
Angels are the only ones where you really notice much in terms of resistances screwing over lasers. Aside from that I can't say lasers are at much of a disadvantange, except against neuts.

To be honest, I tend to fall asleep when I use laser ships against Guristas. Serpentis less so, but still.
Even substantial cut of paper DPS is worth it if that means you are reshipping into something with different damage profile.

Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
Alaric Faelen
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#16 - 2016-01-21 06:41:59 UTC
Since most PvP fits are omni-tanked, you have just as much chance to find a resistance hole with EM/Therm as anything else. It's more important to be able to apply that damage.

If you had solid intel on an enemy fleet, you might be able to refit specifically for them- but in my experience this is pretty rare. Most of the time you undock whatever doctrine your FC decides on. There are many other factors an FC would consider over possible resist holes when choosing a counter fleet doctrine. For example if we had intel on a brawling fleet, we would undock a kiting fleet against it-- the type of weapon damage is really not much of a concern. More important is the various range and cap effects of what crystals to have loaded if using lasers.

It does come into play in PvE to a degree. But again, you tend to be so OP compared to NPC's that you are never at risk of losing to the rats- simply that you aren't perfectly efficient in killing them by not just shooting their known resist holes. I could do Gurista sites just fine in a laser boat, but it's just faster to use a missile tuned to their very specific resist hole of Kinetic.
Ginnie
Doomheim
#17 - 2016-01-21 17:00:08 UTC
I exclusively fly Amarr ships with Energy Turrets so I am limited to EM and Therm damage. In regards to running missions and NPCs, in general, I only "struggle" (and I use struggle there loosely) with Angels. I use Minmatar drones in those cases to supplement my damage type.

I play in systems with Blood Raiders so Amarr ships and Energy Turrets are well suited. Same is true for Sanshas.

Missions of course can be against any faction or type of NPCs, but I have never been given a mission against Guristas and only one against Serpentis, I believe. I run one to two missions per night almost every night. I get Blood Raiders, Sanshas and Mercenaries often with the occasional Angels, Rogue Drones, Gallente and Minmatar mixed in.

All of this, of course, depends highly on where you are and what NPC corps you intend to run missions for...

It sounds plausible enough tonight, but wait until tomorrow. Wait for the common sense of the morning.
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#18 - 2016-01-22 10:13:20 UTC
Alaric Faelen wrote:
...If you had solid intel on an enemy fleet, you might be able to refit specifically for them....


you would have just taken the one thing out of the game what would make pvp fun and exciting - the uncertainty


Alaric Faelen wrote:
Most of the time you undock whatever doctrine your FC decides on....


I never quite understood the meaning in "fly dat boat, times 90597820567248062086571546824 - is good fit!!!! i almost bright, your fc haz spokken"

Sure, honey, whatever makes you happy..

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever
Hochopepa
Creative Research and Production Services
#19 - 2016-01-22 18:52:42 UTC
elitatwo wrote:
Alaric Faelen wrote:
...If you had solid intel on an enemy fleet, you might be able to refit specifically for them....


you would have just taken the one thing out of the game what would make pvp fun and exciting - the uncertainty


Alaric Faelen wrote:
Most of the time you undock whatever doctrine your FC decides on....


I never quite understood the meaning in "fly dat boat, times 90597820567248062086571546824 - is good fit!!!! i almost bright, your fc haz spokken"

Sure, honey, whatever makes you happy..



For certain activities, doctrine fits work great. Bashing a POS, use this fit, it'll make it go faster. Or hey, we're about to do xyz activity, we've found this is the best fit to make that a success.

For general roams, it's 6 of 1 to me.