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The negative reviews of EVE on steam

First post
Author
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#61 - 2015-12-23 12:48:13 UTC
Temporary Amnesia wrote:
Memphis Baas wrote:
Actually, I'd recommend reading the Steam reviews for other MMO's, WoW, SWTOR, and Guild Wars for example. See if they're any different. Then you can form an opinion about Steam reviews... and the people who write those reviews.



or make an an opinion of current state of mmo's out there - just saying


Dude, your face...
Crumplecorn
Eve Cluster Explorations
#62 - 2015-12-23 13:06:45 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
But the game is what it is. If a player is lucky, he will find the right people to do the right thing in the right way. Otherwise, he's 90% certain to hit a brick wall sooner or later. He will do the wrong thing, or will meet the wrong people, or will play the wrong way. And then there's no "This is EVE" coolness for him, but a essentially unfun game.
An excellent articulation of why missions etc should be removed from the game.

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Not Liking this post hurts my RL feelings and will be considered harassment

Jenn aSide
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#63 - 2015-12-23 13:17:23 UTC
Gregor Parud wrote:
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
so what do you suggest then? that doesnt involve turning the game into a 100% single player pve joke of a game which you clearly want the it to become.

have tutorials been redone? do new characters get more sp? have they talked about reworking the whole pve system? skill packets, new frigates and destroyers, you market something on what you can achieve not what you start with and they have been marketing pretty well imo


I would suggest judging players on what they say and do, not what you imagine. One of the nice things of being a prolific critic of the game is that I don't need to hide my agenda...

As for attracting new players with the existing content, that's exaclty what CCP has been doing since 2011, with the current result of dwindling population stats. The problem is more with the product than with marketing, though.

The current eveonline page is awesome (hint: visit it!) and I wish I could show it to some potential new player. I would even bite my tongue on his chances to become a long term player or do anything portrayed in the "This is EVE" video with only his skill and dedication.

But the game is what it is. If a player is lucky, he will find the right people to do the right thing in the right way. Otherwise, he's 90% certain to hit a brick wall sooner or later. He will do the wrong thing, or will meet the wrong people, or will play the wrong way. And then there's no "This is EVE" for him, but a essentially unfun game.


Feel free to leave to a more fun game.


Fazmarai did leave...and come right back , like they always do lol. Isn't it amazing how a game can be so rotten and filled with unsavory people and yet at the same time so irresistible? Twisted
sero Hita
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#64 - 2015-12-23 13:24:43 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
[quote=Lan Wang] One of the nice things of being a prolific critic of the game is that I don't need to hide my agenda...



You never stated anything specific in that thread other than PVE should affect others. You also talk about some diffuse PVE tools you want introduced. But you always stay unclear, and never state any specifics of what you want implemented. Why don´t you answer Lan Wang´s question "so what do you suggest then"? Make it specific, what do you want added to the game, instead of just saying that CCPs methods for attracting new players are wrong.

"I'm all for pvp, don't get me wrong. I've ganked in Empire, blobed in low sec. Got T-shirts from every which-where.. But to be forced into a pvp confrontation that I didn't want is wrong ccp." RealFlisker

embrel
BamBam Inc.
#65 - 2015-12-23 13:39:59 UTC
Filthy Infidel wrote:
stuff


so?

if CCP is smart they completely ignore random interwebs feedback in their development work, but focus on it in their marketing efforts.

Indahmawar Fazmarai
#66 - 2015-12-23 14:37:54 UTC
sero Hita wrote:
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
[quote=Lan Wang] One of the nice things of being a prolific critic of the game is that I don't need to hide my agenda...



You never stated anything specific in that thread other than PVE should affect others. You also talk about some diffuse PVE tools you want introduced. But you always stay unclear, and never state any specifics of what you want implemented. Why don´t you answer Lan Wang´s question "so what do you suggest then"? Make it specific, what do you want added to the game, instead of just saying that CCPs methods for attracting new players are wrong.


2 1/2 years ago:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3762623#post3762623

2 years ago:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4011805#post4011805

After being unsubbed for a year...

8 months ago:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5642967#post5642967

7 months ago:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5760066#post5760066

And even before that I didn't knew the English name for "collectible cards" and was talking about the same concept in other ways, so those messages are harder to search. Probably I started writing about the concept in late 2012, when it was obvious that CCP had given up on avatars and I began shifting focus to salvaging PvE.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#67 - 2015-12-23 14:41:49 UTC
So.... your ideas for attracting more players to this PVP game is overhauling PVE content with collectible card game mechanics? Please go back to dev school and try again.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

Taunrich Kaufmann
Hykkota-Kaufmann Foundaries LLC
#68 - 2015-12-23 14:47:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Taunrich Kaufmann
Regarding the Steam reviews, how can you even review EVE after only a month or two? Shocked

I hate to be 'that guy' but mainstream gamer kiddies' opinions of EVE are pure cancer and you should never subject yourself to that kind of torment.
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat
#69 - 2015-12-23 15:00:59 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
sero Hita wrote:
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
[quote=Lan Wang] One of the nice things of being a prolific critic of the game is that I don't need to hide my agenda...



You never stated anything specific in that thread other than PVE should affect others. You also talk about some diffuse PVE tools you want introduced. But you always stay unclear, and never state any specifics of what you want implemented. Why don´t you answer Lan Wang´s question "so what do you suggest then"? Make it specific, what do you want added to the game, instead of just saying that CCPs methods for attracting new players are wrong.


2 1/2 years ago:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3762623#post3762623

2 years ago:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4011805#post4011805

After being unsubbed for a year...

8 months ago:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5642967#post5642967

7 months ago:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5760066#post5760066

And even before that I didn't knew the English name for "collectible cards" and was talking about the same concept in other ways, so those messages are harder to search. Probably I started writing about the concept in late 2012, when it was obvious that CCP had given up on avatars and I began shifting focus to salvaging PvE.


how does this in any way attract new players to the game? it sounds fckin boring

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

Crumplecorn
Eve Cluster Explorations
#70 - 2015-12-23 15:02:17 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
So.... your ideas for attracting more players to this PVP game is overhauling PVE content with collectible card game mechanics? Please go back to dev school and try again.
No, no, you're forgetting compelling mechanics such as "you must fight NPCs to assemble a defense deck or someone might randomly delete 1 million of your skillpoints".

Nothing says compelling content like "do this content or we will punish you".

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Not Liking this post hurts my RL feelings and will be considered harassment

Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#71 - 2015-12-23 15:03:15 UTC
Taunrich Kaufmann wrote:
Regarding the Steam reviews, how can you even review EVE after only a month or two? Shocked

I hate to be 'that guy' but mainstream gamer kiddies' opinions of EVE are pure cancer and you should never subject yourself to that kind of torment.


It's the curse of the PC crowd, the "no child left behind" mentality. Funny thing is that they don't mean "you're not supposed to offend people", what they actually means is "don't offend me". And they don't mean "no child left behind" but actually "don't leave me behind". It's dumbing down to mediocrity, an idiocracy in the making.

Relevant.
Amber Starview
Doomheim
#72 - 2015-12-23 15:04:42 UTC
Eve is marmite ....

I like marmite

I bet marmite gets bad reviews on the peanut butter forums sometimes

Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
#73 - 2015-12-23 15:48:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Nana Skalski
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:

It is easy to read the patches and be like "woahh!!! Look at all these exciting new toys!", and be blindfolded to how those novelties mean absolutely nothing to new players.

EVE development since Incarnageddon has become a mix of fixes and fanservice for nerds. The forecast is that this unhealthy development phase will last for as long as we know CCP's plans, all of next year and up to 2017.

And that's not good.


For new player Everything in new game is new, so no need to bring new toys for him for a moment. For established players new toys are mandatory, but there is difference between legos and dolls, nonetheless, people play with both. I say you should be able to choose which legos you want for your doll and build a house in station from those legos, together with functionalities. Modularity was expected from WIS, so people didnt really got what they wanted.
Indahmawar Fazmarai
#74 - 2015-12-23 15:52:05 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
So.... your ideas for attracting more players to this PVP game is overhauling PVE content with collectible card game new PvP mechanics? Please go back to dev school and try again.


FYP.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#75 - 2015-12-23 15:54:22 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
So.... your ideas for attracting more players to this PVP game is overhauling PVE content with collectible card game new PvP mechanics? Please go back to dev school and try again.


FYP.


Well I mean, if lying to yourself is THAT important to you, go right ahead. Don't expect to pull one over my eyes though.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

Indahmawar Fazmarai
#76 - 2015-12-23 15:57:15 UTC
Crumplecorn wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
So.... your ideas for attracting more players to this PVP game is overhauling PVE content with collectible card game mechanics? Please go back to dev school and try again.
No, no, you're forgetting compelling mechanics such as "you must fight NPCs to assemble a defense deck or someone might randomly delete 1 million of your skillpoints".

Nothing says compelling content like "do this content or we will punish you".


It's PvP. Fit a tank or risk to suffer a permanent but replaceable loss after you inflict a permanent but replaceable loss to another player.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#77 - 2015-12-23 16:00:28 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Crumplecorn wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
So.... your ideas for attracting more players to this PVP game is overhauling PVE content with collectible card game mechanics? Please go back to dev school and try again.
No, no, you're forgetting compelling mechanics such as "you must fight NPCs to assemble a defense deck or someone might randomly delete 1 million of your skillpoints".

Nothing says compelling content like "do this content or we will punish you".


It's PvP. Fit a tank or risk to suffer a permanent but replaceable loss after you inflict a permanent but replaceable loss to another player.


You try really hard to duck the points people make don't you? I mean, I used to think things were just flying over your head, but I'm sure now that you're dodging them intentionally.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

Jenn aSide
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#78 - 2015-12-23 16:07:00 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
So.... your ideas for attracting more players to this PVP game is overhauling PVE content with collectible card game new PvP mechanics? Please go back to dev school and try again.


FYP.


Well I mean, if lying to yourself is THAT important to you, go right ahead. Don't expect to pull one over my eyes though.


And that's all you are going to get from that poster. Self serving ideas presented as "think of the children" goodness.

I think that's what irritates me about the kinds of posters that Fazmarai is the poster child of. They can't just say "hey, I want this for myself and think it would be cool" . No, it's always "this thing would be GREAT for new players!" I (and i would guess many others) can see right through it which is why we don't take the ideas seriously.

It's not unlike how politicians say "THE PEOPLE WANT THIS" when what they mean is "I, my party, and our special interests want this thing to happen" lol.

Fazmarai fits this bill perfectly with always talking about how CCP is neglecting "PVE players, who btw are the majority!". As if we in the PVE playing community elected Fazmarai to any office.. What's Ironic is that you can't hardly find any Indahmawar Fazmarai posts in the Missions and Complexes section which is pretty much PVE central.
sero Hita
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#79 - 2015-12-23 16:07:44 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
sero Hita wrote:
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
[quote=Lan Wang] One of the nice things of being a prolific critic of the game is that I don't need to hide my agenda...



You never stated anything specific in that thread other than PVE should affect others. You also talk about some diffuse PVE tools you want introduced. But you always stay unclear, and never state any specifics of what you want implemented. Why don´t you answer Lan Wang´s question "so what do you suggest then"? Make it specific, what do you want added to the game, instead of just saying that CCPs methods for attracting new players are wrong.


2 1/2 years ago:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3762623#post3762623

2 years ago:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4011805#post4011805

After being unsubbed for a year...

8 months ago:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5642967#post5642967

7 months ago:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5760066#post5760066

And even before that I didn't knew the English name for "collectible cards" and was talking about the same concept in other ways, so those messages are harder to search. Probably I started writing about the concept in late 2012, when it was obvious that CCP had given up on avatars and I began shifting focus to salvaging PvE.


Appreciate you took the time to find those links. IMO. it seems like a pretty complicated system. I have two points:
A) I don't see how this will bring in new players? You said yourself no new mechanics will make people join EVE. It is also too complicated to explain easily without people loosing interest.

B) If it is to make PVE feel more exciting, a more simple approach could be adapted. If one was to be "inspired" by the game(which may be vaporware or not) I mentioned in my PM to you some time ago, they found an interesting approach.

Radient missions. It would require a lot of reprograming but the system it self is simple. This would be my sugggestion how to apply radient missions to EVE, just from the top of my head:.

1) you remove the tiers of missions, and decouple it from agents. Also remove agents from the stations. Decouple it from standings as they have no purpose anymore.

2)You make a toogle in the menu "PVE mission- on/off". Couple this to adding a ship size toggle. So you can select what size ship you want to do the missions in.

3)When flying around in space, if the PVE missions is toogled on, you will be contacted by agents through the notification system(could make some npc corp (like concord etc.) responsible for hiring capsuleers to mission on behalf of everyone in new eden, and they are the ones contacting you), with missions that can be completed in the ship size you have selected in the menu. The reward is connected to ship size.

4) If you reject a mission, another one will pop up after x mins. of flying in space.

5) Specific themed missions could be coupled to certain areas to keep up with lore.

6) I would like to see them being spawned randomly when you are contacted, some times x destroyers, sometimes y. To make PVE less predictable.

7)when mission is completed, the isk is automatically transferred to you.


The advantage of this system would be:

-missions are less unpredictable.

-you don't have to return to station, so you are not bound to a certain area. Pick you ship size mission, fly around and you can go where ever space is taking you.

-People would have to fly around waiting for missions to pop up, exposing them to PVP.

-Having to fly around waiting not and not being bound to a station would perhaps create more nomads just flying around in low and null, increasing population in those areas (might also not)

-waiting x min. flying around will mess with the isk/hour mentality of a lot of people. This will IMO. make PVE more long time enjoyable, as you just taddle around in the universe pick a mission here and there. I think optimizing isk/hour and static missions are what make PVE unjoyable for me at least. This would fix all of that.

"I'm all for pvp, don't get me wrong. I've ganked in Empire, blobed in low sec. Got T-shirts from every which-where.. But to be forced into a pvp confrontation that I didn't want is wrong ccp." RealFlisker

Crumplecorn
Eve Cluster Explorations
#80 - 2015-12-23 16:10:13 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Crumplecorn wrote:
"you must fight NPCs to assemble a defense deck
It's PvP.
I thought the UI's new transparency effects were good, but you've got them beat.

Witty Image - Stream

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