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Beta Map Feedback Thread

First post
CCP Goliath
C C P Alliance
#1 - 2015-12-10 15:46:29 UTC
Hi capsuleers,

Team Psycho Sisters are gearing up to get this Beta Map feature complete and formalize its replacement of the current map. To do this, we need to make sure that we’re hitting our goals:

- Make aesthetic improvements to the map
- Retains existing functionality of old map (feature parity)
- Contains QoL (Quality of Life) improvements where possible

Please read the full post before commenting, even though it’s long!

We feel like the aesthetic qualities of the Beta map are in a pretty good place. What we are mostly looking to focus on right now is bringing the functionality up to par with the old map. The area we have identified as needing the most work is statistic visualization, but there are of course other areas, so we turn to you for guidance!

To keep the feedback structured and workable, I am going to request that you respond to this post in a certain format. If you elect not to use this format, I can give no guarantee that your post will be read or fully understood. If this seems harsh, know that we have very little time at the moment to comb through feedback and so being able to identify, at a glance, the key areas we need to work on is vital to continue our development velocity.

We are primarily focused on the missing functionality, but also are accepting Quality of Life improvement suggestions for now. Nothing that would require a whole new feature, just small tweaks we can make to make your lives easier. Please try to keep requests for toggling features to a minimum though, as these add testing complexity to crazy levels sometimes.

The format is thus:

Missing Functionality

  • Bullet pointed list
  • One piece of missing functionality per bullet point
  • For bonus points, include use case(s), preferably italicized, especially for niche areas of functionality that might not be immediately obvious
  • Extra bonus points for relevant annotated screenshots!

Quality of Life Improvement Requests

  • Bullet pointed list
  • One improvement per bullet point
  • Must contain (preferably italicized) use cases or will likely not be actioned on

Example Post

Missing Functionality

Quality of Life

  • Planetary Interaction resource scanning style slider to set your min and max of a scale
  • As a player, I can use this to filter out noise of trade and transit hubs when looking at Average Pilots in Space, Pilots docked, etc.

CCP Goliath | QA Director | EVE Illuminati | @CCP_Goliath

CCP Goliath
C C P Alliance
#2 - 2015-12-10 15:46:38 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Goliath
One important point of note - unlike previous threads where we've courted feedback, it is unlikely that every response made in this thread will get a reply. That being said, please trust that we are reading all of the posts presented as we asked, and that feedback will be taken on board and discussed internally, it's just a time constraint thing.

CCP Goliath | QA Director | EVE Illuminati | @CCP_Goliath

The Knights of Spamalot
#3 - 2015-12-10 15:56:09 UTC  |  Edited by: monkfish2345
as much as i really like how it works and what an advance it should be, Currently it's pretty unusable for me. opening the map beta basically stops the entire client dead, so i don't.

edit: I'd love to give you more valuable feedback, but while it performs so poorly, that really isn't something that is possible, becasue no amount of new features or refinements will make it usable.
Amak Boma
Dragon Factory
#4 - 2015-12-10 16:23:55 UTC
my eveclient freezes and hangs for few minutes whe using beta map. i dont like this idea perhaps if would be possible to merge probe scanning window with map window this could work but otherwise no

my negative feedback
- functionality of new map is terrible. i want keep the flattened map and 3d map makes evrything complicated
- probe window cannot be merged with beta map window so i cant control probes effectively . have to switch window evrytime i reposition probes
- lags lags lags the new map makes sort of disruption which cause my client to freeze and makes game unplayable for minute or two

- trash beta map . apply the functions of beta map to old map. keep it functionality but throw in the fixed features. currently map is more complicating probing especially in wormhole
Verse Askold
Bedtime Stories
#5 - 2015-12-10 16:28:41 UTC
Quality of Life
  • visibility of partly scanned signatures
  • i miss the feature that the red dot of a partly scanned signature gets highlightet when inside the probe bubbles, this made adjusting the probes in the right position a lot easier than it is currently(its almost impossible to see them behind not scanned signature red bubbles)

  • Kopaka Newton
    Sanctuary of Shadows
    Dock Workers
    #6 - 2015-12-10 16:33:56 UTC
    monkfish2345 wrote:
    as much as i really like how it works and what an advance it should be, Currently it's pretty unusable for me. opening the map beta basically stops the entire client dead, so i don't.

    edit: I'd love to give you more valuable feedback, but while it performs so poorly, that really isn't something that is possible, becasue no amount of new features or refinements will make it usable.

    I had the same issue, getting 1 fps while zoomed in but this patch seems to have fixed it.
    CCP Goliath
    C C P
    C C P Alliance
    #7 - 2015-12-10 16:38:20 UTC
    Verse Askold wrote:
    Quality of Life
  • visibility of partly scanned signatures
  • i miss the feature that the red dot of a partly scanned signature gets highlightet when inside the probe bubbles, this made adjusting the probes in the right position a lot easier than it is currently(its almost impossible to see them behind not scanned signature red bubbles)

  • Thanks for following formatting rules! Unfortunately, this isn't the scanning/solar system map I'm talking about in this thread. It's the Beta star map

    CCP Goliath | QA Director | EVE Illuminati | @CCP_Goliath

    Oktura Ostus
    #8 - 2015-12-10 16:45:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Oktura Ostus
    Quality of Life:

    • Add 'Favorites' section before 'Recent' section in 'Color by' filters.
    • As pilot I have several favorites in those filters: my fleet members, systems with most kills, systems with most jumps, etc. I like to have quick access to them, but 'Recent' is not usable for this because firstly it's too short, and secondly it gets quickly garbaged when I have to do specific search with more rare filters. Sometimes I have to do this. So separate list of 'favorites' and ability to 'star' any filter could be helpful.
    • Not very helpful picture just to get bonus points:
    Lyra Stone
    #9 - 2015-12-10 16:48:46 UTC

      Missing Functionality:

    • On the old solar system map, when you warp away from a wormhole without bookmarking it, it marks where the wormhole was. Now it doesn't mark the wormhole, so if I forget to bookmark I have to scan down an extra sig.
    • The map lags like hell with personal and corporate locations enabled
    • There's an issue where the selected item window did not work while the scanning interface was open (this may have been fixed since yesterday, haven't checked)
    • Does this thread cover dscan? The new dscan window doesn't show which overview preset I have selected. It also changes the preset every time I type a number to try and change the dscan range.

    • QoL:

    • Region names are not visible on the map while fully zoomed out
    • There's no easy-to-use flatten mode - you can still rotate it and mess up the orientation
    • When I open the world map it defaults to my home system or my last viewed location, rather than my present location

    Blueprint Haus
    Blades of Grass
    #10 - 2015-12-10 16:57:09 UTC
    Missing functionality:

    * Jump range in capital ships does not show up.

    Karash Amerius
    The Seven Shadows
    #11 - 2015-12-10 17:08:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Karash Amerius
    Quality of Life Improvement Requests:

    • Have a way to narrow your field of view to "7 jumps out" as a slider or numerical input to create filtered "localized" maps centered around your current location. Additional filters such as jumps per hour, kills and pods, or service data can be more relevant. These localized filtered maps can help with intel and FC'ing

    Karash Amerius Operative, Sutoka

    Kimimaro Yoga
    Paragon Trust
    #12 - 2015-12-10 17:21:20 UTC
    Quality of Life

    • Increase how close the zoom-in works at the solar system level, to a range where individual moons around a planet can be readily distinguished.
    • Being able to verify the location of POSes, or set off grid bookmarks between moons (now that simply flying off grid is non-trivial) is far easier when full zoom allows you to see the geometry of moons/stations at the same planet relative to each other. New map does not zoom as close as the old.
    • Move the text (name) popups farther away from the object to avoid covering up nearby objects, or allow them to be turned off/modified with settings.
    • This is actually tied into the previous problem. Mouseover a station at full zoom and the name popup probably blocks off half the moons at that planet, even worse if you get 3+ name popups at once. (I will note that this is currently a problem with the UI in many places, multiple objects close together end up unable to be seen because of the popup's close proximity).

    Now recruiting:

    Johnny Riko
    The Scope
    Gallente Federation
    #13 - 2015-12-10 17:22:23 UTC
    Missing functionality
    If you use the beta map in full screen, the search bar doesn't take priority over other windows, so my overview obscures it. Would be much nicer if it was floating, or if it was directly under the other map options at the top.

    I wanna join up. I think I got what it takes to be a Citizen.

    Samuel Crowfeather
    Dropbears Anonymous
    Brave Collective
    #14 - 2015-12-10 17:23:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Samuel Crowfeather
    Quality of Life Improvement Requests:

    in abstract view, the size of the solar system is too big compared to distances between stars, which can be very confusing when waypoint-pathing, especially for newer players, because the path doesn't end at the star but at the stargate. For larger or more populated systems this creates a lot of clutter as there may be 4-5 other stars inside the depiction of the solar system. Also this can make "current location" seem closer to some other system than the solar system you're actually in. Not to mention this makes the "current location" shift around in relation to the universe as you zoom in.
    I love how you can zoom from universe view into the solar system, but that functionality would still be there and as useful (which is rarely) if one had to zoom in more for the solar system depiction to become evident. Best would be if at a lower zoom level (e.g. seeing more than current constellation) the solar system view would disappear and your current system would be only the star with pathing starting from the center
    Garoun Investment Bank
    Gallente Federation
    #15 - 2015-12-10 17:38:06 UTC  |  Edited by: xartin
    Conjaqq wrote:
    Missing functionality:

    * Jump range in capital ships does not show up.

    Ha this is the one singular reason i will never use the beta map and the first client config setting i disable when i login to eve.

    Until it's capable of showing jump ranges and Not mouse scrolling between solar system and star map mode the "new" map is of no use to me whatsoever.

    Don't fix what isn't broken. the current in game eve map accomplishes all the purposes it needs to and 80% of the eve playerbase just need to disable the "beta map" to have a functional map that only serves to appeal to the vanity of those trying to replace it.

    CCP Goliath your a cool dude but lets do everyone playing eve a favor this time? just remove these "beta" features from eve and allow everyone to use what works instead of what has been a year or more long failed science experiment.
    Trajan Unknown
    #16 - 2015-12-10 17:40:03 UTC
    The format is thus:

    Missing Functionality
  • Statistics are harder to read like currently active players/jumps/so on example in the screenshot.
  • Average_Pilots_in_Space
  • When zoomed out the map is hard to read in 3d and flat. Screenshot shows the example. This is with highest settings possible. Non the less, it´s hard to see the connections between systems. Security status seems to be the best way to actually see something on the map.
  • Beta_Map

    Quality of Life Improvement Requests
  • Create a filter that allows players to combine several things. Up to 3 would be ideal to make the map data really useful. Until now I put my data into a separate matrix to combine the stuff for useful data. For example
  • Average pilots in space+security status+jumps. This allows me to find roaming gangs easier. Because one piece of the data wont tell me anything useful.
    Another example would be: Jumps/hour+ships destroyed+pods destroyed. Combine these in a pipe system and look on two connecting gates and you will be able to figure out potential gatecamps. This is all possible right now but you need to combine all the data by yourself, put up a matrix and slowly work through space. When I could create filters the whole switching filter things becomes obsolete leading into a huge QoL. The above examples are just two of many and everyone who is slightly familiar with database stuff will agree I guess. There are so many lovely combinations one can use and there are some third party tools or in my case a collection of self made matrix sheets that will do the job but everytime I think "WHY OH WHY I have to switch between filters all the time to get a single useful data out of the sheer mass of data available to me?

    Last but not least, thanks for the thread. :)
    Nova Financial
    #17 - 2015-12-10 18:06:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Luchius
    Quality of Life

    -Jumps lines between star systems are too faint unless zoomed in to the constellation.

    -Star System nodes are difficult to see unless some "balloon" stat (e.g. # of active pilots in space) is selected.

    -Would be nice if jump lines could be colorized according to jump type like the old map (i.e. blue: local constellation, red: new constellation, purple: new region). Currently, for example, if colorizing systems based on security status: when in nullsec the new map just looks like a bunch of red lines connecting red dots.

    -I would like the ability to toggle whether the solar system map is super-imposed over the current system I'm in.
    Anthar Thebess
    #18 - 2015-12-10 18:07:59 UTC
    Burn it, burn it with fire.
    Stuff must be fast, provide useful information and not full of colors.
    Perfect example -> Dotlan.
    Do it this way
    Bienator II
    madmen of the skies
    #19 - 2015-12-10 18:28:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Bienator II
    Missing Functionality
  • something what the old map had but the new map does not: if i have the map open and select something on the overview it is also marked/selected on the map. This used to allow me to quickly see which plex sizes are where in the system and whats around them for example.
  • [*] example: i mouse over on the overview and the text on the large outpost appears

    how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value

    Joan Andedare
    Roving Guns Inc.
    Pandemic Legion
    #20 - 2015-12-10 18:40:32 UTC
    Missing Functionality:

    -map: change the offset of the map center with the offset you can select in the display and graphics options ("Ship View Camera Settings) this is annoying for me because my EVE-Client is stretched over two screens when I do exploration. This splits the map in half with the new map, while in the old map it was movet to the side when an offset was chosen. also when zooming, it still uses the middle of the window, not the currently selected window or the position of the cursor

    - map: in fullscreen mode, it is easy for the map menu to be covered by windows. With the number of windows open in the client during exploration (local chat, second chat window, probe scanner, dscan, overview, hacking window, selected item, drone bay, it can be hard to change an existing layout. It would be nice if the menu could be detached form the map, since it isn't to hard to find some space on the screen for it, just not necessartily where it is by default.

    - probe scanner window: a star map button in the probe scanner window would make switching between the two maps easier.

    Quality of life:

    - map: the stars in the background are confusing, when the map in the foreground is relatively faint and fuzzy, removing them would make for a clearer picture, both in the star and system map.

    - map: it is hard to see the connections between systems at times, since the lines are faint and fuzzy.

    - map: in the abstract star map layout, it would be nice if the map was locked , and couldn't be rotated or angled. since that adds no functionality (zoom and move left, right, up, down still should be enabled)

    -probe scanner window: the thin line with their strong colors can be straining the eyes when looking at them for a while. the way this was solved in the old map, while not looking as good was easier to focus on and look at. also it is a bit hard to tell at a glance which line belongs to which siganture.

    -map: for some filters (like Average pilots in space in the last 30 minutes or Jumps in the last hour, etc.) it is hard (impossible) to tell the difference between for example 1 pilot and 10 pilots in system, or 100 jumps and 10. for exploration, this can make a big difference and with the different color scheme used in the old map it was much easier to see. Also in the new map, systems that don't have pilots in the or have no jump are almost invisible, while they are exactly where i want to go when i explore. IN these settings the connections between systems are very faint and the background is more prominent than they are. this desperately needs some fixing, because it severely hinders pilots fomr planning journeys in the in game map.

    - probe scanner window: switching between anomalies shown and hidden takes an extra klick now. IDK if this is something other pilots use a lot but for me it is annoying, since i turn them on and off during explo trips when i'm looking for ghost sites.

    - map: the dscan and scanner probe spheres have unnecessary fluff textures that are confusing, especially when combined with a large number of signatures.

    - dscan: the name of the selected preset should be shown, so you don't have to scroll through the list to check. also adding a no preset selectedv option would be great.

    all in all, due to some issues (like the visibility issues with some filters in the map, the background, the map not getting the offset...) I don't think the map is ready to fully replace the old one, but significant improvements have been made from the first iteration, so not all is lost :)

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