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New Bank on EVE Concept: Feedback required
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Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#21 - 2015-11-26 21:24:20 UTC
CJ-8602 wrote:
snip




Hello, am I correct in assuming you are the OP's partner in the bank enterprise?

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
Jerry T Pepridge
Meta Game Analysis and Investment INC.
#22 - 2015-11-26 22:37:36 UTC
If you have a plan execute it, discussion phase it over, put it work.

@JerryTPepridge
CJ-8602
2548376
#23 - 2015-11-27 01:38:41 UTC
Bumblefck wrote:
CJ-8602 wrote:
snip


Hello, am I correct in assuming you are the OP's partner in the bank enterprise?


I am not officialy a partner, just thought is project was interesting and decided to help him out.

snip ?
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#24 - 2015-11-27 11:34:56 UTC
'Snip', just to remove the words :)


I wonder if you shouldn't be the 'spokesperson' for this project, as I understood and followed your explanations on the previous page much easier than the OP's. I don't know if it's just writing style or whatever, but I thought I should just put it out there.


Good luck - both of you!

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#25 - 2015-11-27 21:31:44 UTC
Werner Ross wrote:
Hi everyone,

My character is Werner Ross, I am quite new to EVE but I have been good at the business games during the past few years (mostly because of RL interest in the subjects.)

I have posted 1 topic before regarding loans. But I want to post this topic to make it clear to everyone that I am still in the concept phase of the plan. I am brainstorming with a newfound friend that has a few years more experience in EVE then myself.

For now it is all fun and games with me and my friend thinking over the options we have, but I just wanted to let everyone that keeps these kinds of things on their monitor: The bank will be mostly focused on helping the new pilots getting kickstarted in their careers. At the moment we are thinking about ore as collateral (since new pilots mostly don't have anything else to put up as collateral.) The idea would be creating a relationship between the bank and the client over time and several loans (we start out with small loans and the client can earn bigger loans by paying them back, like real life really.)

Savings accounts will be a part of the future, but first if we make it beyond the concept phase we will be focusing on getting clients for loans first because savings accounts require alot of trust. Trust is hard to come by in EVE (I have noticed and even found out myself with a billion scammed from me), which is why we start out with loans and we will work our way towards the savings accounts section as we go along with our clients and they gain our trust and vice versa. This all is considering us getting past the conceptional phase of the idea.

One important thing can be pledged right here and now: If we make it beyond the conceptional phase and we start the actual bank and people entrust savings accounts with us they will in any and every case get their money back. Also the money will be accessable only through me. Since this raises scam flags in everyone's mind(or so I would imagine), we are at the moment looking for a viable monitoring system that can keep ''me'' in check so we do not repeat the disaster of the last major bank.

Among the steps we are taking to not becoming the major frauding bank are:

1. Small loans at first (lower risk for both sides)
2. We are thinking of a outside monitoring system (like a commity or something where we would need volunteers for to start one that would get access to video's I will make every week of all transactions done by the Alt account that will manage the bank's money.)
3. Only 1 person will be able to access the money (me), this way(for the sceptics/paranoids among us) if there is even a trace of fraud there is no need for investigation because there is only 1 possibility. So no blaming other people or factors in case of fraud because only 1 person would have been able to access the funds.
4. Still thinking of it
5. still thinking of it (but the magic number is 5)


Updates will appear here, and please let your thoughts loose on this topic. Im still adament in seeing this through. But it will take some time to get it up and running and have a viable plan ready (im treating this as I would my own business plan for my own store which I am also planning to start somewhere in the next 10 years), so rest assured knowing that I am not doing this as a quick moneymaker (the opposite is true since the margins we are at right now in the concept are low considering the amounts we make available to the clients).

Have a good day on EVE and all fly safe!

Kind regards,

Werner,

P.s. for the people that actually are interested in helping me complete the concept you are free to contact me for details. But since the details keep changing in this stage I will not post about them alot anymore.



Scam.

Maybe it wont start out that way, but that is how it will end.

There is no legal structure in game to support a banking/financial sector. You'd basically need an arbitrator to review loan contracts and a mechanism to enforce any decisions such as seizing ISK from one player and giving to another, following the ISK if transferred to alts or even other players, etc. And possible penalties as well for fraud and deception--i.e. scamming made essentially illegal.

So in the end the bank will collapse and chances are very high that at least one person in the bank will abscond with a large chunk, if not all, of the deposits.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#26 - 2015-11-27 21:47:49 UTC
CJ-8602 wrote:

Now we do understand that some players might vanish and keep the ISKs but there will be incentives for the players to honor their debts as well as security measures to minimize the risks we take.



What incentives?

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#27 - 2015-11-27 22:03:50 UTC
I like the sound of this, mainly because it sounds like you are offering loans against 90% collateral, and those often end poorly for the lender.

The defaults will be funny.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com
Paul Pohl
blue media poetry
#28 - 2015-11-28 02:42:42 UTC
I've been thinking about his for a few days - and my feeling is that you guys are looking at things through the wrong end of the telescope

If you want to set up a bank you need to look at the deposit side of the business first and then look at the lending - as there are plenty of people with billions to ISK sitting around. If you can find a way of paying them 3-4% a month, you will have investors flocking at your door.

And then it's a case of using that investment to fund the lending side.

Rather than look at ore as collateral (particularly since you propose to subsidize the purchase of the ore) I would advise shares - since you are looking at new players - get them to start a corp and in return for the loan. they deposit shares in your bank - and pay out a daily dividend (the advantage to them is they stop paying dead money to the NPC, and will start learning about how to make money in the game)

You can tie them into an alliance if you want, which gives everyone involved a chance to bond and co-operate - since you state your goal is to move eventually into null-sec - it also gives the loanee an incentive to stay as a company and continue to pay off the loan, if they feel they are being supported by the alliance

But regardless, you are then not tied into the thinking of worrying about the default, but are more focused on using the investment to grow your own business

Failing that - you should look at the credit union model - but again with the focus being on shares as collateral.
Werner Ross
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2015-12-03 23:30:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Werner Ross
Hi all,

I have been convinced to keep going with the project even though I have some less hours to put into it. I hope to give a update with a actual file somewhere the coming week.

But since I am busy in real life (december especially) I will be less responsive. Im going to find out all there is I will need to know for banks on EVE. In the mean while if anyone has some good additions let one of us know.

Kind regards,

Werner Ross,
Jerry T Pepridge
Meta Game Analysis and Investment INC.
#30 - 2015-12-03 23:55:45 UTC
Werner Ross wrote:
Big smile


http://eve-search.com/thread/457769-1#29

#owned

@JerryTPepridge
Werner Ross
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#31 - 2015-12-08 20:35:58 UTC
Jerry T Pepridge wrote:
Werner Ross wrote:
Big smile


http://eve-search.com/thread/457769-1#29

#owned


Owned?XD

No idea what that implies but alright:P
Caleb Ayrania
TarNec
Invisible Exchequer
#32 - 2015-12-08 20:59:20 UTC
For all the talk, and good intentions.. You are more likely to fail or burn out.. Many have gone before you with a lot better prep for a banking project and fallen hard..

Without a huge goodwill granting branding and promotion etc, and months of rep grinding, I dont see this scaling beyond a few 100 small loans of sub 500m. Things a lot easier to achieve for new players making a few social connections ingame.


I commend you for ambition, but I think you should review other options regarding meta game markets..

Banks will not be a thing until there are npc or player ways to actively enforce a resemblance of justice. Even just player billing and ofc upcoming deals of black list and embargo using the Citadels, and affiliated player partners.. So I would stir the ideas a few times in the pot and plan for Citadel and Citadel owners, at least then there are more options.

As mentioned if a thing like this would scale and live through the scrutiny the investors would be all over it and fund you billions in a very short time, ofc that would also need some sort of collateral, unless you as a project holder have agreat reputation and proven motivation..


Good luck with your endeavors, I hope you prove us wrong.
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