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Intergalactic Summit

 
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Samira Kernher
Cail Avetatu
#61 - 2015-12-01 14:47:43 UTC
Ria Nieyli wrote:
You are a Sebiestor. Do you not realise the irony of your own words?


I don't defend the faithlessness or treachery of my race.
Ria Nieyli
Nieyli Enterprises
SL33PERS
#62 - 2015-12-01 16:13:21 UTC
Then what are you doing in PIE?
Utari Onzo
Escalated.
OnlyFleets.
#63 - 2015-12-01 16:38:09 UTC
Ria Nieyli wrote:
Then what are you doing in PIE?


Because she's one of the faith and wishes to serve the Empire by flying with one of the oldest still active, and Amarr loyal, corporations?

What kind of a question is that?

"Face the enemy as a solid wall For faith is your armor And through it, the enemy will find no breach Wrap your arms around the enemy For faith is your fire And with it, burn away his evil"

Ria Nieyli
Nieyli Enterprises
SL33PERS
#64 - 2015-12-01 16:50:04 UTC
It's the kind of question that gets asked after she calls herself a faithless traitor.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#65 - 2015-12-01 16:53:54 UTC
Ria Nieyli wrote:
It's the kind of question that gets asked after she calls herself a faithless traitor.


Lieutenant Kernher is Sebiestor by blood, yes. She is a life-long resident of the Empire, however, and an adherant to the Amarr faith. She is also a decent and honorable person of deep and sincere beliefs. Among those beliefs is one that says that the Matari, like all humanity other than the 'True Amarr', were once faithful to the Amarr God, but turned away from him - an act of faithlessness and treachery, and one she believes pollutes our entire bloodline. It is a sin she strives to atone for, despite having not actually committed it herself.

So, if a decent, honorable person who deeply and sincerely believes in the Amarr faith and has lived within the Empire since birth should not be fighting for the Empire, where should they be fighting?
Elmund Egivand
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#66 - 2015-12-01 16:55:37 UTC
Tamiroth wrote:
Elmund Egivand wrote:
How about the capacitor-boosted dual armour reppers?
Oh well. I was trying not to give Naups ideas about what I might be flying next time! :P

Yes, either that, or some sort of kiter that'll stay out of scram and neut range, or I might invent something totally ridiculous, like a Crucifier made into a neuting droneboat. He experiments on slaves, and I'll experiment on him!


If you are gonna be kiting Naup, I really suggest against Tormentors by the sole reason that they aren't exactly fast.

I had battled against Executioners with beam lasers before and they are pretty decent if they manage to pull range. Maybe try that out?

A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.

Ria Nieyli
Nieyli Enterprises
SL33PERS
#67 - 2015-12-01 17:05:12 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
Ria Nieyli wrote:
It's the kind of question that gets asked after she calls herself a faithless traitor.


Lieutenant Kernher is Sebiestor by blood, yes. She is a life-long resident of the Empire, however, and an adherant to the Amarr faith. She is also a decent and honorable person of deep and sincere beliefs. Among those beliefs is one that says that the Matari, like all humanity other than the 'True Amarr', were once faithful to the Amarr God, but turned away from him - an act of faithlessness and treachery, and one she believes pollutes our entire bloodline. It is a sin she strives to atone for, despite having not actually committed it herself.

So, if a decent, honorable person who deeply and sincerely believes in the Amarr faith and has lived within the Empire since birth should not be fighting for the Empire, where should they be fighting?


A person that would condemn an entire bloodline like that is neither honourable nor decent. Being self-indignant makes it even worse.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#68 - 2015-12-01 17:40:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Arrendis
Ria Nieyli wrote:
A person that would condemn an entire bloodline like that is neither honourable nor decent. Being self-indignant makes it even worse.


Congratulations, you've just declared every single member of the Amarr faith to be neither honourable nor decent, because that 'original sin' - the idea that the taint of ancient forebears who turned from God - is apparently one of the core tenets of the faith, and the reason why the True Amarr stand above even other ethnic groups from their own homeworld as the pinnacle of the Imperial social ladder.

Seriously, they're raised to believe that as strongly as they believe '1+1=2'.

Because let me be clear here, the statement she made is a subset of the statement 'Everyone but the True Amarr is a product of faithlessness and treachery'. It's just a degree of how recently some of those bloodlines began their atonement.
Ria Nieyli
Nieyli Enterprises
SL33PERS
#69 - 2015-12-01 17:48:06 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
Ria Nieyli wrote:
A person that would condemn an entire bloodline like that is neither honourable nor decent. Being self-indignant makes it even worse.


Congratulations, you've just declared every single member of the Amarr faith to be neither honourable nor decent, because that 'original sin' - the idea that the taint of ancient forebears who turned from God - is apparently one of the core tenets of the faith, and the reason why the True Amarr stand above even other ethnic groups from their own homeworld as the pinnacle of the Imperial social ladder.

Seriously, they're raised to believe that as strongly as they believe '1+1=2'.

Because let me be clear here, the statement she made is a subset of the statement 'Everyone but the True Amarr is a product of faithlessness and treachery'. It's just a degree of how recently some of those bloodlines began their atonement.


Apparently it upset her. Which isn't my problem really. I mean, if she can slander Amarr's allies publically, a little more of the same should be ok.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#70 - 2015-12-01 18:01:40 UTC
Ria Nieyli wrote:
Apparently it upset her. Which isn't my problem really. I mean, if she can slander Amarr's allies publically, a little more of the same should be ok.


I assume you're not claiming the Sebiestor are Amarr's allies. Do you, perchance, refer instead to her statements regarding the blood-cults of Delve and Khanid space?
Ria Nieyli
Nieyli Enterprises
SL33PERS
#71 - 2015-12-01 18:03:52 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
Ria Nieyli wrote:
Apparently it upset her. Which isn't my problem really. I mean, if she can slander Amarr's allies publically, a little more of the same should be ok.


I assume you're not claiming the Sebiestor are Amarr's allies. Do you, perchance, refer instead to her statements regarding the blood-cults of Delve and Khanid space?


Well, considering that she thinks that every Khanid is a blooder.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#72 - 2015-12-01 18:12:27 UTC
Ria Nieyli wrote:
Well, considering that she thinks that every Khanid is a blooder.


Not what she said.

What she said was that the folks claiming that blood raiders are welcome in Khanid are basically claiming Khanid is no longer living up to their obligations vis-a-vis heresy. She also stated - accurately, as near as I can tell - that the Kingdom was considered heretical for other reasons prior to Empress Jamyl I's rapprochement. That heresy, btw, would have been Khanid II's refusal to commit ritual suicide last time he was an Heir to the Imperial Throne, and his subsequent declaration of independence from the Empire.
Ria Nieyli
Nieyli Enterprises
SL33PERS
#73 - 2015-12-01 18:19:51 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
Ria Nieyli wrote:
Well, considering that she thinks that every Khanid is a blooder.


Not what she said.

What she said was that the folks claiming that blood raiders are welcome in Khanid are basically claiming Khanid is no longer living up to their obligations vis-a-vis heresy. She also stated - accurately, as near as I can tell - that the Kingdom was considered heretical for other reasons prior to Empress Jamyl I's rapprochement. That heresy, btw, would have been Khanid II's refusal to commit ritual suicide last time he was an Heir to the Imperial Throne, and his subsequent declaration of independence from the Empire.


No, that's exactly what she said.

By the way, the Kingdom is still considered a separate entity from the Empire. Don't believe me? Ask your nearest Concord official.
Tamiroth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#74 - 2015-12-01 18:23:16 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
She also stated - accurately, as near as I can tell - that the Kingdom was considered heretical for other reasons prior to Empress Jamyl I's rapprochement. That heresy, btw, would have been Khanid II's refusal to commit ritual suicide last time he was an Heir to the Imperial Throne, and his subsequent declaration of independence from the Empire.

Please let's set this dangerous subject aside.

I can only pray for a peaceful transition to the new Emperor's reign.

Elmund Egivand wrote:
If you are gonna be kiting Naup, I really suggest against Tormentors by the sole reason that they aren't exactly fast.

I had battled against Executioners with beam lasers before and they are pretty decent if they manage to pull range. Maybe try that out?
This is also an option, though it'd be really squishy.
Ashlar Vellum
Esquire Armaments
#75 - 2015-12-01 18:25:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Ashlar Vellum
Ria Nieyli wrote:
It's the kind of question that gets asked after she calls herself a faithless traitor.

Shouldn't that question be asked by people who actually serve their own and don't have the history of being buddy-buddy with pirates and terrorists.
Ria Nieyli
Nieyli Enterprises
SL33PERS
#76 - 2015-12-01 19:03:24 UTC
Ashlar Vellum wrote:
Ria Nieyli wrote:
It's the kind of question that gets asked after she calls herself a faithless traitor.

Shouldn't that question be asked by people who actually serve their own and don't have the history of being buddy-buddy with pirates and terrorists.


How do you know that I'm not serving my own, pray tell?
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#77 - 2015-12-01 19:37:49 UTC
Ashlar Vellum wrote:
Ria Nieyli wrote:
It's the kind of question that gets asked after she calls herself a faithless traitor.

Shouldn't that question be asked by people who actually serve their own and don't have the history of being buddy-buddy with pirates and terrorists.


Ria used to be a pilot in the State Protectorate - when did that change?

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.

Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#78 - 2015-12-01 19:42:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Lyn Farel
Ria Nieyli wrote:
Arrendis wrote:
Ria Nieyli wrote:
It's the kind of question that gets asked after she calls herself a faithless traitor.


Lieutenant Kernher is Sebiestor by blood, yes. She is a life-long resident of the Empire, however, and an adherant to the Amarr faith. She is also a decent and honorable person of deep and sincere beliefs. Among those beliefs is one that says that the Matari, like all humanity other than the 'True Amarr', were once faithful to the Amarr God, but turned away from him - an act of faithlessness and treachery, and one she believes pollutes our entire bloodline. It is a sin she strives to atone for, despite having not actually committed it herself.

So, if a decent, honorable person who deeply and sincerely believes in the Amarr faith and has lived within the Empire since birth should not be fighting for the Empire, where should they be fighting?


A person that would condemn an entire bloodline like that is neither honourable nor decent. Being self-indignant makes it even worse.


Well then, you might have a problem with the Amarr, because that is the way Amarr works. The individual means nothing, compared to the family and the House.

This is why generational slavery is a thing, among other facts. Everyone is deemed to pay for the mistakes of their own kin, as everyone is deemed to profit for their successes.

Something not so dissimilar to the Matari social structure, or even the megacorp culture to some extent. The group transcends the individual, with all the excesses that arise from it, as well as the pros.

Of course then, it does not mean that blanket statements about whole bloodlines make a lot of sense either..
Ashlar Vellum
Esquire Armaments
#79 - 2015-12-01 19:48:47 UTC
Ria Nieyli wrote:
Ashlar Vellum wrote:
Ria Nieyli wrote:
It's the kind of question that gets asked after she calls herself a faithless traitor.

Shouldn't that question be asked by people who actually serve their own and don't have the history of being buddy-buddy with pirates and terrorists.


How do you know that I'm not serving my own, pray tell?

Are you saying you are still serving your old cartel friends or something while still being part of SPROT?
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
Ria used to be a pilot in the State Protectorate - when did that change?

She still is.
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#80 - 2015-12-01 19:53:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Lyn Farel
Also, these whole public discussions remind me that this constant witch hunt for heretics and finger pointing are really weird.

Are people so quick to call upon others for their sins and heresies in a way to hide their own? Or in the hope to show their over-the-top-zeal?

Is that a contest? Is that even becoming of Amarr Faithful?

Are people trying to get noticed by the MIO and receive a pat on the head?

Is that a way to prove oneself?

Half of the discussions involving Faithful systematically end in monkeys slinging scripture at each other without even showing a hint of understanding them.

Really. I may lack the moral fortitude to found my own opinions most of the time, but it sure is no wonder that the head Chamberlain and other figures reprimanded the Faithful most of the time for their display.

Obedience without a thought is to be cultivated, but so is the moral certitude to know how and when to disagree.