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d scan cycler module/rigs

Author
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2015-11-02 13:32:30 UTC
so from my experience when ur plexing u should keep an eye on dscan for a few seconds after something lands in the plex so that you can tell if ur about to get blobbed.

but u have little time and this adds to the list of things u need to be doing.

so why not add a module or rig that cycles ur d scanner for u?
Cidanel Afuran
Grant Village
#2 - 2015-11-02 17:40:55 UTC
no, if you can't bother to actively d-scan, you don't deserve the intel it gives you. We need less free intel in the game, not more. Keeping an eye on local and using pirate's little helper with a decent overview, you should get caught by a blob zero percent of the time as it is.
Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2015-11-02 17:46:01 UTC
I don't see why not, since you need to be actively watching the d-scan readout anyway. Seems like a reasonable and fair module.


Cidanel Afuran wrote:
no, if you can't bother to actively d-scan, you don't deserve the intel it gives you. We need less free intel in the game, not more. Keeping an eye on local and using pirate's little helper with a decent overview, you should get caught by a blob zero percent of the time as it is.

It's not exactly free intel if you have to fit a module to get something someone else could have gotten without fitting the module, and you still have to stay alert anyway.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."

Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#4 - 2015-11-02 17:53:13 UTC
Cidanel Afuran wrote:
no, if you can't bother to actively d-scan, you don't deserve the intel it gives you. We need less free intel in the game, not more. Keeping an eye on local and using pirate's little helper with a decent overview, you should get caught by a blob zero percent of the time as it is.


The guy is willing to sacrifice a slot for it and it could also have a negative effect on the ship while fitted. That's not my definition of free tbh.
Cidanel Afuran
Grant Village
#5 - 2015-11-02 18:03:00 UTC
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:
It's not exactly free intel if you have to fit a module to get something someone else could have gotten without fitting the module, and you still have to stay alert anyway.


Frostys Virpio wrote:
The guy is willing to sacrifice a slot for it and it could also have a negative effect on the ship while fitted. That's not my definition of free tbh.


I understand what you're saying, but I would still argue that it's free intel. I think people should have to work to get intel, and not have the game (even if it is through a module) give it to you automatically.

I'm also in favor of nerfs to watchlists, killboards and local as forms of free intel, but those are completely different conversations
Wolf Lafisques
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2015-11-02 18:03:27 UTC
This sounds like it would take away from the possibility of user error. Fit this module and no more "oops, I forgot to check d-scan". Eve doesn't need lazy pilots, it needs good pilots. This would take away from the players' need to develop skill and awareness, therefore I have to oppose it.

-1
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#7 - 2015-11-02 18:07:10 UTC
Cidanel Afuran wrote:
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:
It's not exactly free intel if you have to fit a module to get something someone else could have gotten without fitting the module, and you still have to stay alert anyway.


Frostys Virpio wrote:
The guy is willing to sacrifice a slot for it and it could also have a negative effect on the ship while fitted. That's not my definition of free tbh.


I understand what you're saying, but I would still argue that it's free intel. I think people should have to work to get intel, and not have the game (even if it is through a module) give it to you automatically.

I'm also in favor of nerfs to watchlists, killboards and local as forms of free intel, but those are completely different conversations


Nerf overview then since it's gives a lot of intel on the ship without having to do anything beside being on grid with it.

Where is the real limit on "free intel" to you?
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#8 - 2015-11-02 18:09:15 UTC
Wolf Lafisques wrote:
This sounds like it would take away from the possibility of user error. Fit this module and no more "oops, I forgot to check d-scan". Eve doesn't need lazy pilots, it needs good pilots. This would take away from the players' need to develop skill and awareness, therefore I have to oppose it.

-1


All it does according to the OP is click the scan button for you. You still need to have it open, look at it and react upon info being shown to you. Still place for human error while removing as repetitive task of clicking the same button over and over.
Cidanel Afuran
Grant Village
#9 - 2015-11-02 18:23:32 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Nerf overview then since it's gives a lot of intel on the ship without having to do anything beside being on grid with it.

Where is the real limit on "free intel" to you?


The limit is free intel if you're on grid (ie, vulnerable), and if you are off grid, you need to *do something* actively to get the information.
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#10 - 2015-11-02 18:36:54 UTC
No. This is one of those skills you cannot buy.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever

Wolf Lafisques
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2015-11-02 23:29:00 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
All it does according to the OP is click the scan button for you.


Wolf Lafisques wrote:
Eve doesn't need lazy pilots, it needs good pilots.


Drivers are either too lazy or too stupid to shift their transmissions manually. Drivers are either too lazy or too stupid to maintain a constant speed over long distances. Drivers are either too lazy or too stupid to maintain positive traction on the road. So let's implement these cool new features (I use the term "new" relatively) that will allow the car to perform these functions FOR the drivers.

Now that we have drivers who are no longer occupied by actually having to pay attention to their vehicles as they drive, we have a bunch of drivers who like to text, talk on the phone, and even surf the internet WHILE they're driving. These features are handy, to be sure. They are excellent for people who have legitimate disabilities. But ultimately, these features remove the need (seemingly) for drivers to be responsible for their vehicles. Having a module that "presses a button for you" at regular intervals removes the need for the pilots to be responsible for that aspect of flying their ships.

I know that comparing internet spaceships to vehicles in real life is a bit on the extreme side and they don't exactly align perfectly with each other, but they are comparable issues. Just as newer drivers develop bad habits because they aren't required to pay attention to their vehicles, so too will there be a decrease in pilot skill if they are given the option to fit a mod that presses a damn button.

Sorry, I still heavily disagree with this feature. The UI isn't as customizable as it is in other games, but it's customizable enough. Adjust your window placement so that d-scan is in a convenient place for you. Bear in mind that if screen space is an issue, you can scale down your UI to free up a little bit of extra space. I have mine scaled to 90% and everything fits and works just fine.

I don't want to log into Eve, press a button, and have the game do everything for me. That's the direction this would eventually go. Idk about anyone else, but I enjoy actually having to DO THINGS.
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2015-11-03 00:56:51 UTC
I'm not trying to automate eve.

As said earlier you would have to give up a module slot on ur ship to enable this function. Meaning essentially on most ships u would have to gimp ur fit.

It's hard to stay on d scan as the fight goes on. This module would allow u to do that.

But let's think about this if ur in a brawler and ur fighting in scram range, chances are ur not escaping anyway. Even when u see the blob coming. It's too late.

So that leaves he kiters. Thier ships have to fit long range weapons that usually demanding on fitting space as it is. And to fit this module would put even more pressure on their fitting space. Giving up a module slot either a low of a mid in particular reduces the ships combat ability significantly imo.

I think its a fair idea
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#13 - 2015-11-03 00:59:50 UTC
Wolf Lafisques wrote:
This sounds like it would take away from the possibility of user error. Fit this module and no more "oops, I forgot to check d-scan". Eve doesn't need lazy pilots, it needs good pilots. This would take away from the players' need to develop skill and awareness, therefore I have to oppose it.

-1


Unaware pilots would also forget to set d scan to short 360 if they were doing 5 degree scans when the fight kicks off
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2015-11-03 01:01:11 UTC
Cidanel Afuran wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Nerf overview then since it's gives a lot of intel on the ship without having to do anything beside being on grid with it.

Where is the real limit on "free intel" to you?


The limit is free intel if you're on grid (ie, vulnerable), and if you are off grid, you need to *do something* actively to get the information.


As above they would still have to set the d scan variables
Cidanel Afuran
Grant Village
#15 - 2015-11-03 01:42:20 UTC
Bastion Arzi wrote:
As above they would still have to set the d scan variables


so you take 30 minutes to set your 5-6 overview settings for d-scan one time and then never have to worry about d-scanning again? again, no.
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#16 - 2015-11-03 07:59:49 UTC
its more like 5 seconds, dunno where u getting 30 mins from. Does it seriously take you 30 mins to select a direction a distance and press a button?
Rayzilla Zaraki
Yin Jian Enterprises
#17 - 2015-11-03 13:28:05 UTC
I don't not like this idea.

Beyond the user interface being worked on now, D-Scan needs some fine tuning, this is something that could be included.

To make it "not free", D-Scan, like active SONAR on a submarine should temporarily give up the pinger's position. Each ping has you show up on overview for a few seconds.

Gate campers are just Carebears with anger issues.

Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
#18 - 2015-11-03 15:20:28 UTC
Rayzilla Zaraki wrote:
I don't not like this idea.

Beyond the user interface being worked on now, D-Scan needs some fine tuning, this is something that could be included.

To make it "not free", D-Scan, like active SONAR on a submarine should temporarily give up the pinger's position. Each ping has you show up on overview for a few seconds.

Terrible idea because cloaked is cloaked, please do not turn this into yet another anti-cloak topic AFK or otherwise.
Since this cannot and should not be applied to cloaked ships, and given that anyone who is on grid with you will already be on your overview what would this change?

To the OP and other comments.
In game that is flooded with free intel from kill boards to automatic local in low and nul it seems silly to be complaining about free intel. I have never been a fan of the automated D-Scan ideas before because there was no negative balance factor to go with the positive benefits, this idea however adds a very real negative because of fitting choices.

My real concern considering that the various slots / rigs are more or less important depending on the ship so what do we make them high, mid, low or rig?
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#19 - 2015-11-03 15:23:42 UTC
Would suggest mid or low for balance
xttz
GSF Logistics and Posting Reserves
Goonswarm Federation
#20 - 2015-11-03 15:31:41 UTC
Apparently as of today's patch it's now possible to bind d-scan to a hotkey like the spacebar...
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