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Plex Prices

First post
Author
James Zealot
Foxholers
Outfoxed
#621 - 2015-09-15 19:40:36 UTC
Sizeof Void wrote:
u3pog wrote:
I made an experiment yesterday - grind missions for few hours, I made about 300 million. In one day. If someone wants to play this game, but can't afford it with real money, then they should put some effort in it. PLEX has been near a billion for quite some time, I don't think ±200 mil are that much of an issue. Even if you don't grind few hours per day, 1 week should be absolutely enough to earn that PLEX, so you can do whatever you do till the end of the month.

Also, as Bad Bobby said earlier, each character can have up to 305 market orders, 11 manufacture and science jobs, 21 contracts, 21 R&D agents and so on, and you have 3 characters per account, so if you can't make enough ISK to buy a PLEX, then you are doing it wrong.

Many, if not most, adults simply do not have that much time available to play a game. RL activities - such as work, family, church, social obligations, taking care of a house, et cetera - take higher precedence. And, it is particularly difficult for lower income players, who may even need to work a second job - they are also the ones with the least amount of free time available to play a game.

So, maybe you get a couple of hours per week, to spend playing games, such as EVE Online - if so, you want to spend those hours enjoying yourself, and not doing stuff in-game which is not particularly fun for you. And, for PVP players, grinding ISK - via mission running, market trading, mining, or other PVE activity - has never been fun.



This! Just this.
u3pog
Ministerstvo na otbranata
#622 - 2015-09-15 19:43:45 UTC  |  Edited by: u3pog
This is the current situation with EVE. Eve doesn't care about people's real life, EVE cares for your money or your ISK. What are you going to do is your problem. As harsh as it may sound, that's the truth.

It's the same in real life. I like BMW, I can go to Munchen and say "Could you please do something about the price, because I have many things to do, my job sucks and can't afford one?" Well, that's my problem. If I can't afford one, I don't drive BMW. Simple as that.

That being said, CCP won't and shouldn't interfere too much with the market and particulary with PLEX, after all it's player driven one. They do it only when things go out of hand too quickly.

Survival of the fittest.
Brometheus Down
Doomheim
#623 - 2015-09-15 23:16:35 UTC
Is PLEX going to continue to rise? :[

If so, why?!
u3pog
Ministerstvo na otbranata
#624 - 2015-09-15 23:19:41 UTC
Just gave away one...for 233 ISK! Gratz to the winner Big smile I usually type numbers with the numpad, however this time my little finger just had the urge to click enter, no warning message, no nothing...weird. As a friend suggested - remove it. Cool

...I'll do it - here goes away...the enter key Twisted
Sizeof Void
Ninja Suicide Squadron
#625 - 2015-09-15 23:49:54 UTC
Brometheus Down wrote:
Is PLEX going to continue to rise? :[

If so, why?!

For the near future, I would guess, yes.

In addition to the market speculators, who want to actively push the price up, in order to eventually better profit on their stockpiles of PLEX, purchased at sub-billion ISK prices, there are the many folks who just have too much ISK in wallet.

If you don't fly supercaps, nor laughable bling ships, then there isn't much else on which to spend ISK, for those players who earn billions of ISK per month. Most of them are realizing that they should just convert the excess ISK in wallet to PLEX. As a group, they are buying up an increasing number of PLEX per month. I have a bit over 4 years worth of PLEX myself, and I'm not a particularly space-rich player.

Eventually, though, there will be a tipping point, at which everyone decides that EVE Online isn't going to last 10 or 20 more years, and that they should sell off all of those PLEX which they will never be able to use up. Then, you'll see a massive sell off, and prices should fall rather dramatically. However, at that point, there will also probably be fewer people playing the game, and thus fewer people looking to buy PLEX (essentially, everyone who pays for their subs with PLEX will already have years worth of PLEX stocked up). There are simply not enough new players joining EVE to use up the excess PLEX.

Can CCP do anything to control it?

Hmm.... short of dumping massive numbers of PLEX on the market (enough to absorb all of the outstanding buy orders for a couple of months), selling PLEX at huge RL discounts in order to get players to push massive amounts of PLEX in game (again, enough to absorb the buy orders for a couple of months), eliminating a lot of the large ISK faucets to reduce player income and increasing ISK sinks to remove the trillions upon trillions of idle ISK in wallet from the game ... I'd say "probably not much".
Katja Andrard
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#626 - 2015-09-16 00:43:42 UTC
Sizeof Void wrote:
Brometheus Down wrote:
Is PLEX going to continue to rise? :[

If so, why?!

For the near future, I would guess, yes.

In addition to the market speculators, who want to actively push the price up, in order to eventually better profit on their stockpiles of PLEX, purchased at sub-billion ISK prices, there are the many folks who just have too much ISK in wallet.

If you don't fly supercaps, nor laughable bling ships, then there isn't much else on which to spend ISK, for those players who earn billions of ISK per month. Most of them are realizing that they should just convert the excess ISK in wallet to PLEX. As a group, they are buying up an increasing number of PLEX per month. I have a bit over 4 years worth of PLEX myself, and I'm not a particularly space-rich player.

Eventually, though, there will be a tipping point, at which everyone decides that EVE Online isn't going to last 10 or 20 more years, and that they should sell off all of those PLEX which they will never be able to use up. Then, you'll see a massive sell off, and prices should fall rather dramatically. However, at that point, there will also probably be fewer people playing the game, and thus fewer people looking to buy PLEX (essentially, everyone who pays for their subs with PLEX will already have years worth of PLEX stocked up). There are simply not enough new players joining EVE to use up the excess PLEX.

Can CCP do anything to control it?

Hmm.... short of dumping massive numbers of PLEX on the market (enough to absorb all of the outstanding buy orders for a couple of months), selling PLEX at huge RL discounts in order to get players to push massive amounts of PLEX in game (again, enough to absorb the buy orders for a couple of months), eliminating a lot of the large ISK faucets to reduce player income and increasing ISK sinks to remove the trillions upon trillions of idle ISK in wallet from the game ... I'd say "probably not much".


Two things for y'all to think about.

First, you underestimate the power of an interventionist market regime. Believe me, there are plenty of options besides pure market inflation/deflation.

Second, has anyone thought about the case in which the rise of prices were by design in the first place ?
Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#627 - 2015-09-16 00:48:46 UTC
Katja Andrard wrote:
Sizeof Void wrote:
Brometheus Down wrote:
Is PLEX going to continue to rise? :[

If so, why?!

For the near future, I would guess, yes.

In addition to the market speculators, who want to actively push the price up, in order to eventually better profit on their stockpiles of PLEX, purchased at sub-billion ISK prices, there are the many folks who just have too much ISK in wallet.

If you don't fly supercaps, nor laughable bling ships, then there isn't much else on which to spend ISK, for those players who earn billions of ISK per month. Most of them are realizing that they should just convert the excess ISK in wallet to PLEX. As a group, they are buying up an increasing number of PLEX per month. I have a bit over 4 years worth of PLEX myself, and I'm not a particularly space-rich player.

Eventually, though, there will be a tipping point, at which everyone decides that EVE Online isn't going to last 10 or 20 more years, and that they should sell off all of those PLEX which they will never be able to use up. Then, you'll see a massive sell off, and prices should fall rather dramatically. However, at that point, there will also probably be fewer people playing the game, and thus fewer people looking to buy PLEX (essentially, everyone who pays for their subs with PLEX will already have years worth of PLEX stocked up). There are simply not enough new players joining EVE to use up the excess PLEX.

Can CCP do anything to control it?

Hmm.... short of dumping massive numbers of PLEX on the market (enough to absorb all of the outstanding buy orders for a couple of months), selling PLEX at huge RL discounts in order to get players to push massive amounts of PLEX in game (again, enough to absorb the buy orders for a couple of months), eliminating a lot of the large ISK faucets to reduce player income and increasing ISK sinks to remove the trillions upon trillions of idle ISK in wallet from the game ... I'd say "probably not much".


Two things for y'all to think about.

First, you underestimate the power of an interventionist market regime. Believe me, there are plenty of options besides pure market inflation/deflation.

Second, has anyone thought about the case in which the rise of prices were by design in the first place ?


Well it has been said before. One Eve Player wins the lottery or gets a big inheritance from a rich uncle and they could collapse the game's economy in a matter of minutes.

Think about the effect of a sudden 2000 plex influx direct to buy orders on the market, the rest to cheap sell orders.

Now that person has a trillion isk to screw with any market they want.

CCP would have to intervene. I am surprised it hasn't happened yet.

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.

Katja Andrard
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#628 - 2015-09-16 00:53:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Katja Andrard
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Katja Andrard wrote:
Sizeof Void wrote:
Brometheus Down wrote:
Is PLEX going to continue to rise? :[

If so, why?!

For the near future, I would guess, yes.

In addition to the market speculators, who want to actively push the price up, in order to eventually better profit on their stockpiles of PLEX, purchased at sub-billion ISK prices, there are the many folks who just have too much ISK in wallet.

If you don't fly supercaps, nor laughable bling ships, then there isn't much else on which to spend ISK, for those players who earn billions of ISK per month. Most of them are realizing that they should just convert the excess ISK in wallet to PLEX. As a group, they are buying up an increasing number of PLEX per month. I have a bit over 4 years worth of PLEX myself, and I'm not a particularly space-rich player.

Eventually, though, there will be a tipping point, at which everyone decides that EVE Online isn't going to last 10 or 20 more years, and that they should sell off all of those PLEX which they will never be able to use up. Then, you'll see a massive sell off, and prices should fall rather dramatically. However, at that point, there will also probably be fewer people playing the game, and thus fewer people looking to buy PLEX (essentially, everyone who pays for their subs with PLEX will already have years worth of PLEX stocked up). There are simply not enough new players joining EVE to use up the excess PLEX.

Can CCP do anything to control it?

Hmm.... short of dumping massive numbers of PLEX on the market (enough to absorb all of the outstanding buy orders for a couple of months), selling PLEX at huge RL discounts in order to get players to push massive amounts of PLEX in game (again, enough to absorb the buy orders for a couple of months), eliminating a lot of the large ISK faucets to reduce player income and increasing ISK sinks to remove the trillions upon trillions of idle ISK in wallet from the game ... I'd say "probably not much".


Two things for y'all to think about.

First, you underestimate the power of an interventionist market regime. Believe me, there are plenty of options besides pure market inflation/deflation.

Second, has anyone thought about the case in which the rise of prices were by design in the first place ?


Well it has been said before. One Eve Player wins the lottery or gets a big inheritance from a rich uncle and they could collapse the game's economy in a matter of minutes.

Think about the effect of a sudden 2000 plex influx direct to buy orders on the market, the rest to cheap sell orders.

Now that person has a trillion isk to screw with any market they want.

CCP would have to intervene. I am surprised it hasn't happened yet.


Take a look at the market history graph, the correlation between the green bars at the bottom, the mean price line and the size of the dark red area. You can see everytime CCP does.
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#629 - 2015-09-16 02:19:33 UTC
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Katja Andrard wrote:
Sizeof Void wrote:
Brometheus Down wrote:
Is PLEX going to continue to rise? :[

If so, why?!

For the near future, I would guess, yes.

In addition to the market speculators, who want to actively push the price up, in order to eventually better profit on their stockpiles of PLEX, purchased at sub-billion ISK prices, there are the many folks who just have too much ISK in wallet.

If you don't fly supercaps, nor laughable bling ships, then there isn't much else on which to spend ISK, for those players who earn billions of ISK per month. Most of them are realizing that they should just convert the excess ISK in wallet to PLEX. As a group, they are buying up an increasing number of PLEX per month. I have a bit over 4 years worth of PLEX myself, and I'm not a particularly space-rich player.

Eventually, though, there will be a tipping point, at which everyone decides that EVE Online isn't going to last 10 or 20 more years, and that they should sell off all of those PLEX which they will never be able to use up. Then, you'll see a massive sell off, and prices should fall rather dramatically. However, at that point, there will also probably be fewer people playing the game, and thus fewer people looking to buy PLEX (essentially, everyone who pays for their subs with PLEX will already have years worth of PLEX stocked up). There are simply not enough new players joining EVE to use up the excess PLEX.

Can CCP do anything to control it?

Hmm.... short of dumping massive numbers of PLEX on the market (enough to absorb all of the outstanding buy orders for a couple of months), selling PLEX at huge RL discounts in order to get players to push massive amounts of PLEX in game (again, enough to absorb the buy orders for a couple of months), eliminating a lot of the large ISK faucets to reduce player income and increasing ISK sinks to remove the trillions upon trillions of idle ISK in wallet from the game ... I'd say "probably not much".


Two things for y'all to think about.

First, you underestimate the power of an interventionist market regime. Believe me, there are plenty of options besides pure market inflation/deflation.

Second, has anyone thought about the case in which the rise of prices were by design in the first place ?


Well it has been said before. One Eve Player wins the lottery or gets a big inheritance from a rich uncle and they could collapse the game's economy in a matter of minutes.

Think about the effect of a sudden 2000 plex influx direct to buy orders on the market, the rest to cheap sell orders.

Now that person has a trillion isk to screw with any market they want.

CCP would have to intervene. I am surprised it hasn't happened yet.




They'd want to get more than a single trillion ISK for that sum of money.

Let's see what happens the next time CCP offers a sale on 28 packs of PLEX.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com

Lieu Thiesant
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#630 - 2015-09-16 07:18:40 UTC
Speaking of lotion...

1,212,100,001 EVE Online ISK 10 min ago.
Loki Yamaguchi
Level 42 Industries
#631 - 2015-09-16 17:02:12 UTC
Lieu Thiesant wrote:
Speaking of lotion...

1,212,100,001 EVE Online ISK 10 min ago.


I just did a quick run though Forge, Lonetrek, Citadel, Domain and Tash...all at or close to being above 1.3B (or already above).

Crazy...

EVE Central is so slow now it worthless with such a volatile item.


Guess I need to find a street-corner soon...Sad
Gadolf Agalder
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#632 - 2015-09-16 17:34:55 UTC
From EVE-Marketdata.com
BUYERS
0.5 Metropolis - Hek -1 unit- 1,299,000,000 ISK (20 Jumps Range) < 30 minutes ago
0.9 The Forge - Jita -5 units- 1,245,000,000 ISK (Station Range) < 5 minutes ago
Loki Yamaguchi
Level 42 Industries
#633 - 2015-09-16 18:02:21 UTC
Gadolf Agalder wrote:
From EVE-Marketdata.com
BUYERS
0.5 Metropolis - Hek -1 unit- 1,299,000,000 ISK (20 Jumps Range) < 30 minutes ago
0.9 The Forge - Jita -5 units- 1,245,000,000 ISK (Station Range) < 5 minutes ago



It's hyper volatile and quickly trending-up.

I'm looking at Jita as I type and 1.329B is the cheapest right now...
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#634 - 2015-09-16 18:49:34 UTC
Loki Yamaguchi wrote:
Gadolf Agalder wrote:
From EVE-Marketdata.com
BUYERS
0.5 Metropolis - Hek -1 unit- 1,299,000,000 ISK (20 Jumps Range) < 30 minutes ago
0.9 The Forge - Jita -5 units- 1,245,000,000 ISK (Station Range) < 5 minutes ago



It's hyper volatile and quickly trending-up.

I'm looking at Jita as I type and 1.329B is the cheapest right now...


Are people buying at that price? This question is unconnected with me just having banked my tax refund.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Elizabeth Norn
Nornir Research
Nornir Empire
#635 - 2015-09-16 18:51:38 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
[quote=Loki Yamaguchi]

Are people buying at that price? This question is unconnected with me just having banked my tax refund.


People have been paying 1.35b today, but the competition is intense at the moment. There are lots of 1.25b+ buy orders though, don't sell below that.
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine
In Tea We Trust
#636 - 2015-09-16 18:52:05 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Are people buying at that price?

Yes, they most certainly are.
Leetmcfeet
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#637 - 2015-09-16 18:54:52 UTC
This date last month; Plex were under 1 Billion isk each. Right now they are at about 1.25B isk.

This is a 25% increase in price in a 1 Month period - Which makes PLEX currently one of the most valuable investments a player can make. Why loan out isk at 10% monthly when you can Invest plex at 25%? Why deal amazing investments when they only pay 20% ? No investment is as secure as plex as even if a dip were to occur it would shoot through the roof anyhow. The oppurtunity cost of investing in anything but plex is too great.

If CCP were to even attempt to manipulate this value it would be to no avail as people will buy the plex and the price would not even budge; as now more than ever we know the sky is the limit and plex always goes up. It won't be one entity or one person but hundreds of people who will pick up their plex that instant instead of the future.

If new skins are introduced more people redeem plex for aurum regardless of the exchange rate

If there are fewer players in eve; plex rises
If skins are released; plex rises

CCP noted when prices reached 1Billion and were temporarilly reset that they did not believe 1B was the right price of plex and infered it should cost more isk than that. Aside from making plex appear out of thin air as opposed to relying on a banned/reserve pile which is now nearly extinguished; there is little way to affect the prices. The reason being; any attempt would be thwarted by people stocking ahead of time knowing they'll save.

Plexes are nearing 15 billion per year per character if you buy your plex once a month. (If you buy it all TODAY) If you bought one a month for each character; the last few months would surely demand a higher price. Don't be suprised if you are paying 25 Billion plex per character if you intend to pay for your next years subscription 1 PLEX at a time. Look for alternate ways to pay.

Do you want 3 extra accounts this year or a Titan? 3 Super Carriers? 70 Carriers?

Because plex is destined to rise without the ability for CCP to intervene in any reasonable way it becomes more and more evident and valuable to pay for your subscription via credit card monthly for all accounts. Isk is not weighed against an item basket; deadspace mods; ships; everything can go down as players farm to make their monthly plex -> The more a player needs to farm the more prices drop ->

Its important to know ISK and its value is based solely on the existance of PLEX and is measured by the cost of plex. The value of isk has gone down down down and the severe inflation we see of ISK being worth 25% less in the last month. In 2 months time your hoarded isk can be worth HALF of what it is worth now and the only way to protect yourself from this volatility is to invest your isk in PLEX -> No other way can you assure your ISK will never lose value -> all the other items to invest in are a gamble; plex is not a gamble.

You can get a deadspace module for a little more; a little less or the same price you could last month in some cases; but you sure as heck can't buy plex at the same price. 1 Billion isk plex will never return. And I don't think 1.25B isk plex will return either

Don't expect CCP to bail out the plex economy this time; the reserves simply are not there. They made their magnificent move already; that hand was already played. Start paying by credit card for each account. As for general goods and items; look at these to determine the breaking point. Plex will go up indefinitely but general goods won't until the point where which the black market and playerbase shrinks.

At that breaking point though; you better buy because that means so many players quit; so many RMT operations moved out of EVE and its profitability is so low; that general goods will rise. Supply and Demand both going down is not ideal; less market competition is not good.

Keep an eye out on those deadspace boosters people; because when that line curves or angles upwards and continues to do so; we hit the breaking point.

One may think the only cure for our condition is injecting cold-hard players straight into the system -> Eve needs new players much like a ponzi schemist needs new investors; if EVE doesn't get the new players its markets implode. You may make the argument it will stabalize at some point; But don't expect to be able to afford goods or plex at the point.

I don't agree with this. i think the cure for our condition is to stop pretending the norms or prices of the past are at all indicative of what things should cost. Wake up people plex is worth a lot more than 1.3B isk. Isk is nothing and PLEX is water; is life; is gold is oil is everything. Plex is the lifeline. Enjoy the low prices while they last; because 1.3B for a plex is nothing compared to where its going.
Loki Yamaguchi
Level 42 Industries
#638 - 2015-09-16 18:57:17 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Are people buying at that price? This question is unconnected with me just having banked my tax refund.


That last price I mentioned was for a stack of 26 units...that's now gone and the price has "dropped" to 1.307B...safe to say people are buying but the volume seems low if the history chart can be trusted.

Also, there are 90 less PLEX over the last two hours available galaxy-wide according to Eve-Central (but I don't overly trust their data anymore but it's at least consistently wrong/slow).
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#639 - 2015-09-16 19:01:31 UTC
Leetmcfeet wrote:


Don't expect CCP to bail out the plex economy this time; the reserves simply are not there


Source?

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

u3pog
Ministerstvo na otbranata
#640 - 2015-09-16 19:14:17 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Leetmcfeet wrote:


Don't expect CCP to bail out the plex economy this time; the reserves simply are not there


Source?


Crystal ball.

Price is backing up now, but not for long. Few people decided it's time to sell.