Ships & Modules

It's been interesting to see it trade the web velocity bonus for a range bonus, get an 11th slot, fitting space, and a sweet nos bonus, but the other pirate frigates that have either been introduced or buffed seem to highlight the Cruor's weaknesses.

Rather than talk about the other hulls here, I'm going to talk about my beef with this ship:

Neuting range.

I don't think it should have any sort of parity with a Sentinel, but a Cruor should follow the lines of the other Blood Raider ships, which includes the possibility for a bulky neuting fit. Can you do that? Yes, and here's an example of the kind of fitting I'm talking about --

[Cruor, Blood Raider Stereotype]
Pseudoelectron Containment Field I
400mm Rolled Tungsten Compact Plates
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
'Refuge' Adaptive Nano Plating I

5MN Y-T8 Compact Microwarpdrive
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I

Small Diminishing Power System Drain I
Small Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Small Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Small Unstable Power Fluctuator I

Small Ancillary Current Router II
Small Trimark Armor Pump I
Small Trimark Armor Pump I

It's got a number of concessions in fitting to make the PG and CPU work, but the point is that you CAN fit it up. The problem lies in the application. You are forced to fly at an opponent in order to be worth investing in the hull over a Hyena. Once you hit 17km, you enter the range where enemies will start applying anti-tackle modules onto your ship to peel you away.

Ashimmu comparison- you're as slow as an Assault Frigate with this Cruor fit. Cruisers that web you before you land scram can peel you. Ashimmu often has dual webs and disruptor fitted, so an enemy can only "escape" if they are MUCH faster or have a scram, and even then they only "escape" to the point where their web range is shorter than yours, and you're pressuring their cap whenever you are around 12-13km from them. Cruor lacks CPU for a disruptor, and even if it had that CPU, it'd be hurting to fit a second nos which would take even more CPU and lower the overall neuting potential of the ship.

I'm not asking for Cruor to become an Ashimmu - It has somewhat thin tank to try and pull off a similar effect, but it needs more range for its cap warfare. I'm asking for the bonus to strength to include range for cap warfare modules. You would get 11km meta4 neuts at the low end, and 17.8km a-type nos at the high end of things.

In other words, you would have to shell out a lot of ISK and fitting space in order to have a little over half the range of Sentinel neuts, and nos only siphon around 40% as much as a neut on top of that. If you fit guns and have only 2 nos, then you get 14 GJ/s compared to a ghetto dual neut Tristan's 5w neuts doing 17 GJ/s or a triple neut Sentinel's 54 GJ/s.

TL;DR: Cruor fit for cap warfare can get scramkited. Good Blood hulls don't have this weakness. Make Cruor's 17.5% neut/nos effectiveness bonus also include RANGE, and consider making the ship faster with plated fits. Fittings are tight but possible.

Sorry for being so blunt but that cruor does zero damage. Given enough time an Ibis can kill that.

That is why you have friends.

I don't really see a need for both cap boosters if you have medium nos, because you're basically capstable MWD off with such a fit:

[Ashimmu, Blood Stereotypet]
Damage Control II
1600mm Steel Plates II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Armor Explosive Hardener II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II

50MN Quad LiF Restrained Microwarpdrive
Federation Navy Stasis Webifier
Federation Navy Stasis Webifier
Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I

Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Corpum C-Type Medium Nosferatu
Corpum C-Type Medium Nosferatu

Medium Trimark Armor Pump II
Medium Trimark Armor Pump II
Medium Anti-EM Pump II


Since you work with smaller cycle times (especially with Talismans) you use less cap at any given moment, meaning enemy neuts are less effective against you because they end up wasting 90% of their power on an "empty" capacitor. If you lack perfect skills, I would swap Thermic Hardener to a passive Membrane to still be capstable.

You're right with the tl;dr :P

I mean, I love them and in some cases they hard counter ships, but people who aren't baited by the shiny realize they will lose and won't fight.

I'd love to see this happen. With a 17.8km A-Type Nos would work perfectly with the range bonused webs. I might actually fly the stupid thing if this happened.

Swap that 5m3 drone bay out for a bit more laser DPS and you got yourself a real pirate frigate.

If you give them neut range i fear they'll become overpowered.... Also it will be one less argument against sheld tanking it ... and that is just straight up wrong...

Prop+web+point means you'd rarely shield tank it unless special conditions where you don't need a point.

If you truly are concerned with Nosferatu range, I am confident that it is possible to make it only increase neuting range in order to close the gap between its neut/nos ranges.



Guristas and Mordus are really strong right now. Orthrus stands to lose some PG and get its dmg bonus changed to RoF. In general I think that drones could use a rebalance with regards to projection and that such changes would help reduce the power of Guristas hulls.

In other words, make drone control range dependent BOTH upon the EWAR drone skill (changed to 10km total) AND the hull being used:

(This is just an example)
Frigates: 10km control range base (20km before fittings)
Destroyers get 15 -> (25)
Cruisers: 25 -> (35)
BC: 35 -> (45)
BS: 50 -> (60)

There'd have to be module/rig changes to accomodate this, ofc, but the general idea is to not have frig projection be 60km with no investment.

Expect that you have no dps in that cruor, a slicer gets 220dps at that range with beams.

I was waiting for the classic Cruor shitfit to show it's ugly face. This fit was very popular when the Cruor was newly buffed and everyone was crazy about the 'it's cap stable!!1!!!1!' factor. However you can only run your reps so as long as your opponent has cap and when they run dry, you run dry. It also does little damage and the tank isn't great, so in practice what happens is you cap the opponent out quite fast, which causes you to cap out really fast too, and with no cap booster to fuel your reps you get killed easily, especially by ships that don't need cap to run their weapons.

Honestly I feel like the Cruor is the weakest pirate frig for solo work. I'd take a Comet over a Cruor anyday for solo. However it does have some use in a gang setting for long range webs and neuts I suppose, but I've never really seen anyone make good use of it in that way. Some kind of bonus to the range of the neuts would really help it immensely.

My god you people with all the shitfits just embarrass yourselves. Stop posting this I have no idea who started posting fits on eveo forums but it was a terrible idea.

The blood raider ship line is largely bad because it has bonuses and attributes all over the place without a coherent concept of the intended ship role. CCP need to cut one of the bonuses and make it good at a single thing. As it is right now the ship line lacks damage, projection, true webbing range, the only thing its good at is very situational and thats heavy neuting.