EVE New Citizens Q&A

[EDIT at top: I found the ship link in the kill report - it looks like this guy was flying a tactical destroyer. My memory was initially incorrect.Now I'm wondering if I would have stood a chance of popping him.]

I just had an experience I can't explain that unnerved me and I could use some advice from experience pilots...

Although my character age says otherwise, I don't have a ton of Eve experience, so this experience (I think?) caused me to make some rookie mistakes / reactions. I could use feedback.

I was in the _fifth_ pocket running AE (lvl4) in my Golem. I was d-scanning about every 15-20 seconds 3AU out. I was looking for only probes or other player ships (all types.) No hits on the scanner. Ever.

All of a sudden there's a flashy yellow guy 3km away in my overview. (well, solid background yellow, flashy dealy in the lower left of his overview entry.)

I tried to keep cool but was definitely unnerved - wondering where did this guy come from? I knew absolutely not to attack him. And then he started yellow-bracket flashing in my overview -. I assume that means he was locked on me but not firing? Was this an attempted provocation?

The first thing I did was found the right-click option to abandon all nearby wrecks and selected it. I didn't want to somehow accidentally make a mistake involving wrecks that I could make piece with losing. The next thing I did (mission was due in 34 minutes) was to make sure I killed off the trigger BS. But then I was stupid, and in such a hurry to get out of there that I forgot and left my MTU behind with about 4M of stuff in it. After I initiated warp to GTFO, I right clicked for some ship / pilot info. I honestly was unnerved enough that I don't remember what type of ship it was, but I remember seeing a whole bunch of sub-system entries at the bottom, so would that be a T3 cruiser? I couldn't figure out where to see how many SP the pilot had, or if that's even possible. His sec status was -1.2

As I hit the out-bound gate, I get a ding message and there's a kill report that's available. I took a look and the dude had killed my MTU.

I have tried to read up on the mechanics of can flippers, how MTUs work, etc, but forgot some of the stuff while being thrown off. Would there have been potential tricks for him to play on me if I had simply remembered to collect loot from my MTU then scooped the MTU into my cargo?

Would he have been able to retrieve some or all of the loot after destroying the MTU?

It was stupid of me to get so nervous and forgetful, but watching him get the drop on me in between my continuous scanning, I kept thinking "Oh god are there a crew of stealth gankers around and he's just the scout or something?" (11 in local, and I've tried to keep an eye out for surges in population in local.) My mind just kept screaming 'Kill trigger and GTFO!!"

(If you couldn't tell already, this is high-sec.)

Is there anything I can do differently next time - things I should have done, should not have done, etc? Can I go back and somehow get the ship info from the kill report? And... WHERE did this guy come from?? How do you probe someone down AND make it through 5 pockets of AE without someone noticing??

He was trying to bait you into giving him a Limited Engagement timer. If you'd shot him, or your drones had agro'd him, he'd be free to shoot you at will. Until you do that, if he'd shot you, he'd have been CONCORDed.

He can, however, shoot your MTU and only gain a Suspect timer.

Don't feel bad about warping off and leaving the MTU there, in 0.0 space I routinely leave behind drones and MTU when local spikes with neutrals.

As for 'how he got there without being spotted on D-Scan', perhaps you weren't as methodical on spamming the D-Scan as you thought? Or, perhaps you didn't have T3 Destroyers enabled on that overview panel? He had a cloak and had crawled through the earlier rooms? I don't know.



Highly doubtful.

He knew where you were, what you were doing and what ship you were flying. Based on that much intel, I daresay that he either brought a hard counter to your ship, or he was simply the initial tackle for a much larger gang waiting for him to yell that he had you.

GTFO was 100% the right move. You only lost an MTU and ~4m of loot rather than losing your MTU, loot AND your Golem.

I don't need 15 seconds to scan a Golem. You'll have only 2 or 3 seconds (basically the time it takes to do one scan) to see my probes if i'm coming for you.

That said, you did not lose your Golem, that means you made the right call
Think of it this way, it's better to be safe and lose the MTU and the 4m loot, then to lose the Golem.

whenever they add a new ship class it doesn't get added to existing overview settings. It is easily possible that t3 destroyers never got added to your d-scan overview setting.

I'd keep the scan range at max, especially in a marauder as said earlier, they are very easy to scan down.

and you finished the mission, kept your ship, but lost the MTU. Overall not a bad trade. For future reference just scoop the MTU/Mobile depot as soon as you see someone enter the pocket.

When you shoot a MTU you get a suspect timer, meaning anyone can attack you for 15 mins. When you kill the MTU normal loot rules apply and in general you get 1/2 the stuff. I think it drops in a can that belongs to the MTU owner (not 100% on that) but at that point they are already suspect so they don't mind going suspect again to take the loot. That said they might not even bother with the loot (probably at least look to make sure nothing shiny ends up in there) and just go for the killmail.

You are very honest about your panic - I am sure we all recognise it as part of our EVE experience. That adrenaline rush is one of the things that gets us hooked. But despite that, you actually didn't do too much wrong. You didn't react aggressively to him. You left behind an item that had minimal value compared to your ship. You GTFO as fast as possible. Then you sat down, analysed it and asked for advice on how to handle it better next time.

You'll survive.

Undoubtedly this. Check your overview settings and make sure all the types are checked for ships.

A single flashy guy is just trying his best to provoke you to shoot him. You did all the right things (except forgetting to scoop the MTU) but he's just killing it to get a rise from you. He doesn't care about the loot. A single guy poses no threat whatsoever as long as you do not attack him. You can, in fact, continue on with the mission and ignore him entirely. Just be wary for inbound tornadoes or catalysts in case of suicide ganks (though they will normally use a more subtle warp-in).


Very unlikely. I have killed several missioning battleships in a Hawk, including a Dominix (arguably the best battleship at applying its damage to small targets). Flashy yellow guys have done this before, and it's all part of the plan. They appear unassuming but their ship is designed easily survive against large ships (quickly kill drones and sig tank turrets or missiles). And since most mission ships don't have tackle the flashy can just warp out if they need to. The mission ship has no such luxury.

People probe for MTUs because they're easy to scan for and provide an easy means of both getting a suspect flag and provoking an engagement. Their specific goal is to provoke you into shooting them with your mission boat.

There's no reason to leave your mission as they cannot initiate an engagement, just scoop your MTU and continue as you normally would. If you want to screw them the thing to do is lock them with your mission ship which will make them think you intend to shoot them, meanwhile have one or more of your associates in PVP ships show up whiless he is distracted by you.

MTUs have a signature radius of 500m, which is as big as a shield tanked battleship and excluding POS results isn't that hard. It's what I do personally, but I'm specifically interested in shooting MTUs rather than just being there suspect because it's a bit more provocational.

Good stuff and just a few things to add from personal preferences.

Warp out is always the safest thing you can possibly do it is hard to make a mistake that can cost you a ship when you are not even there. Yes I have seen players continue missions after an intruder has joined them and I have seen them make that mistake and lock and shot them by accident.

I disagree with not bothering to blue your wrecks. Looting a wreck is one of the possible ways a player has to try and get you to shoot them, if you routinely blue your wrecks as you go you completely remove that possibility. I have had intruders warp into and then immediately out of pockets when they see the sea of blue wrecks. Not sure how this would affect the MTU since I have never used one so you would have to look into that.

So now lets talk about this mythical 2-3 second probe scan.
To be honest it cannot happen and here is why.
Probes take approximately 2 seconds to warp to a final scan position and that is if they have to move less than 2 AU. If they are farther out they will take even longer to re-position. And while they are in warp probes are still visible on d-scan.
Now we add that the actual probe scan cycle which starts out at a base of 10 seconds. With max skills and a full set of mid level implants(+6) this drops to about 4 seconds. Given the paper advantages of the more costly implant sets I can see this dropping into that magical 2-3 second range.
Now add 1-2 seconds for the pilot to see and act on those results
Then add an additional 2-3 seconds for the probes to recall far enough to be out of your d-scan range.
So that mythical 2-3 second scan actually is more like 6-8 seconds. Still significantly less than your 10-15 second scan times but no where near that mythical 2-3 second scan.

So what does this mean? set you d-scan to about 10-12 AU and scan every 8-10 seconds.
These changes mean it is highly unlikely that anyone will be able to move probes into position, have them complete the scan cycle and then move them back out of scan range between your scans. Can it be done? yes but it would require and extreme level of proficiency on the part of the scan pilot and the very best equipment and implants that ISK can buy. To be honest with you if someone wants to bring that level of skill and that level of ISK investment in implants to high sec just to chase me in my mission ship then so be it.

They aren't a griefer any more than a Mordrus Mammoth is a griefer. They are an opponent - albeit a smarter one than the rats.

Shooting an MTU is considered a theft-level crime rather than an assault-level crime. You had the right (and no obligation) to counterattack for 15 minutes; if you did the T3 destroyer could shoot you back too (a limited engagement). During the LE you could legally shoot each other - and for as long as he was flashy yellow, you could have allies assist you without penalty, an advantage you have over them.

If you'd gotten into a limited engagement with the T3 dessie pilot, there is no realistic way they could have broken your tank unless they could neut you out (unlikely in practice for a destroyer), although you would not have been able to escape either.

You could drive them off if you had an energy neutraliser fitted. I fly a Kronos a good deal (seldom for PVE but I do that on occasion when the sec status gets too low) and it can fit 3 heavy neutralizers, which would get you out of trouble in this situation. However, there's no realistic way you could have killed them - your drones are too fragile and your missiles too inaccurate.