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War Dec System Needs To Change.

Author
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#81 - 2015-07-31 12:05:23 UTC
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:

This would only become griefing if it was targeted at individual players, if the deccing corp followed you from corp to corp deccing each one in turn and then ganking you in between whilst you are in NPC corps. Then it would be griefing.


Hilariously, even this is not griefing. You can follow one specific guy around with wars all you want, and the GMs will just tell him to drop an NPC corp if he doesn't like it.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#82 - 2015-07-31 12:12:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Corraidhin Farsaidh
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:

This would only become griefing if it was targeted at individual players, if the deccing corp followed you from corp to corp deccing each one in turn and then ganking you in between whilst you are in NPC corps. Then it would be griefing.


Hilariously, even this is not griefing. You can follow one specific guy around with wars all you want, and the GMs will just tell him to drop an NPC corp if he doesn't like it.


That's why I included ganking you specifically whilst in NPC corps which I believe would then give a case for a griefing complaint.. By joining player corps however (no matter how new they are) you are accepting the risk of wars. Just as the wardeccer must currently accept the risk that the players will just roll corp. All the tools currently exist to deal with wars as they stand right now so until there's a full overhaul alongside the new structures being delivered any other changes would be pretty pointless.

I guess the difference would be that if you are trying to stop someone playing the game at all it is griefing, however if you are trying to stop them functioning in an area that puts them in competition with you then it isn't.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#83 - 2015-07-31 12:32:30 UTC
Lol at the very worst you're being driven out of your Corp. Not the game.

If you want to be in a Corp with friends but dont want to be decced, then support the social Corp idea.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#84 - 2015-07-31 12:44:23 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Lol at the very worst you're being driven out of your Corp. Not the game.

If you want to be in a Corp with friends but dont want to be decced, then support the social Corp idea.


Or just join a blasted chat channel.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#85 - 2015-07-31 13:25:51 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Lol at the very worst you're being driven out of your Corp. Not the game.....


Pretty much my point, you can't be griefed with wardecs alone.
Iam The Flash
Doomheim
#86 - 2015-07-31 22:37:14 UTC
Not the point

None of what any of u are saying is the point
Mag's
Azn Empire
#87 - 2015-07-31 23:45:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Mag's
Iam The Flash wrote:
Not the point

None of what any of u are saying is the point
And you don't even have a point.

The funniest thing about all this is your belief that those who do not want PvP, should be somehow left alone. Yet here they, are playing a game that is PvP centric and has been that way since day one.

It's rather like playing Monopoly with someone, then complaining when they charge you for landing on a street they own and you wanting the rules changed to stop that.

Do war decs need a change? Well yes, they are far too easy to avoid at the moment.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.

Valkin Mordirc
#88 - 2015-08-01 00:32:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Valkin Mordirc
Also on the note of Trolling.


I troll sometimes. But normally my trolling is more like sarcastically making fun of you to prove a point.

I enjoy it immensely.


Also I got to differnt guardians mixed up. There's the wardeccing guardians of the galaxy and then the FW guardians of the gate. Whoopies. XD

Also it's really funny how you are calling everyone griefers and pathetic, that they are immature.

And it's seem incredibly difficult for you to spell "You" correctly.

Like. My Grammar is pretty bad, and if it wasn't for spell check, my spelling would probably be worse. And I'm telling you, that your bad.


That's like....really bad yo.
#DeleteTheWeak
elise densi
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#89 - 2015-08-01 07:37:26 UTC
i live in nullsec some time now yes wardecs come and go but its not that mutch of an issue using our of ally alts etc to move in stuff


the main issues also is new corps cant grow in highsec anymore let alone alliance forming when u get basicly perma wardecced this is also a main reason why eve doesnt get newer players into the game

example new player joins a corp 1 day later corp gets wardecced new player is new he gets killed and he quits

higher wardec costs for corp and alliance and limits would be mint to have 1-5 max wardecs
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#90 - 2015-08-01 12:22:46 UTC
elise densi wrote:

the main issues also is new corps cant grow in highsec anymore let alone alliance forming when u get basicly perma wardecced this is also a main reason why eve doesnt get newer players into the game


Except that, according to CCP themselves, both of those statements are a lie.

In fact, being killed early on in their EVE career makes them more likely to resub.

Quote:

higher wardec costs for corp and alliance and limits would be mint to have 1-5 max wardecs


No. You do not get to talk about nerfing wardecs until the dec dodging exploit is removed. Until they're not 100% voluntary with no consequences for leaving, nothing about it warrants being nerfed.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#91 - 2015-08-02 11:11:41 UTC
elise densi wrote:
i live in nullsec some time now yes wardecs come and go but its not that mutch of an issue using our of ally alts etc to move in stuff


the main issues also is new corps cant grow in highsec anymore let alone alliance forming when u get basicly perma wardecced this is also a main reason why eve doesnt get newer players into the game

example new player joins a corp 1 day later corp gets wardecced new player is new he gets killed and he quits

higher wardec costs for corp and alliance and limits would be mint to have 1-5 max wardecs


Allow me to show you what you've just done;

-WHs pay too well and are too safe.

Example, I day trip into a C6 with my buzzard and solo 2 anoms and make 300billion off salvage in 10 minutes.-


New corps cant grow in hisec anymore? Since when? Do you have all the information of every noob Corp that has ever started? Can you give actual examples of all these perma-decced noob corps? Names? Links? ANYTHING?

The only thing in this post that is remotely true is that null sec groups use alts.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#92 - 2015-08-02 11:26:12 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
...

In fact, being killed early on in their EVE career makes them more likely to resub.

[quote]

I'm really not sure what this statement shows to be honest. I think it more likely shows that those who stay in Eve are the folks more willing to take risks and lose ships (as opposed to being killed is good for you!). An example would be my first month where i set myself a target to plex after the first signup month. To do so I mined better ore in losec, lost ships doing so but on balance achieved my goal. Being killed didn't make me more inclined to stay, but enjoying the kick from taking the risks did.

[quote=Kaarous Aldurald]No. You do not get to talk about nerfing wardecs until the dec dodging exploit is removed. Until they're not 100% voluntary with no consequences for leaving, nothing about it warrants being nerfed.


As wardecs stand right now I'm fine with this as corps can also check war histories to not dec rolling corps. This all needs a damn good looking at when the new structures come in though.
Lugburz
Mind Games.
Suddenly Spaceships.
#93 - 2015-08-02 11:29:01 UTC
Actually highsec war decs do affect null operations specifically those that are dumb enough to have their jump frieghter guys not only in alliance but also on ap through hs. These wardecs hinder trade and supply lines to and from nullsec, imo what needs to change isnt the wardec itself but the players attitude towards it. In most null alliances you are actually specifically told not to operate in highsec whilst at war... wtf kind of stupidness is that? In reality what should happen, especially with larger groups is that they should form up and go fight, this would make the contracts groups like pursuit of happiness and marmite often take less appetising if they already have several decs up. In honesty i think thats what was intended but most null secers are miners or anom runners and wont fight.. its the same reason a lot of them are complaining about fozzie sov and being 'forced' to take a proactive approach rather than simply docking up..

You want easy made isk run incursions and remain in an npc corp; you want to interact with the rest of space and eve.. help defend your corpies and alliance folk and the image your all 'technically' portraying when some neut comes in local and you start spamming crappy smack talk like your an actual valued member.
Colt Blackhawk
Doomheim
#94 - 2015-08-02 11:44:17 UTC
I am really no highsec bear but CCP needs to do something about highsec.
Let us face it: Yes there are players who simply want to do some occasional PVE and nothing else.
Actually you can´t do that in high without getting forced to do PVP.
But why the **** we try to force players into pvp when they don´t want it?
CCP is really cutting off some customers from the game here completely.
All these psychopaths who gank and wardec highsec bears can go to madhouse where they belong to and basta.
This is not fighting, this is not pvp, this is simply destroying the game for other players by ganking and permawardeccing them.
You can´t tell me that a catalyst idiot ganking peeps in high has good fights. Honestly every damn idiot could do that and no one can seriously tell me it is fun.
This is not about fun, this is about saddism and nothing else.
I would go even further and say we need something like super highsec without ganking and **** like that for people who REALLY only want to do some occasional pve. I really don´t know why CCP refuses something like that to a special customer group.

[09:04:53] Ashira Twilight > Plant the f****** amarr flag and s*** on their smoking wrecks.

Karra Masamune
Intelligence Operation NetCorp
#95 - 2015-08-02 11:51:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Karra Masamune
Colt Blackhawk wrote:
I am really no highsec bear but CCP needs to do something about highsec.
Let us face it: Yes there are players who simply want to do some occasional PVE and nothing else.
Actually you can´t do that in high without getting forced to do PVP.
But why the **** we try to force players into pvp when they don´t want it?
CCP is really cutting off some customers from the game here completely.
All these psychopaths who gank and wardec highsec bears can go to madhouse where they belong to and basta.
This is not fighting, this is not pvp, this is simply destroying the game for other players by ganking and permawardeccing them.
You can´t tell me that a catalyst idiot ganking peeps in high has good fights. Honestly every damn idiot could do that and no one can seriously tell me it is fun.
This is not about fun, this is about saddism and nothing else.
I would go even further and say we need something like super highsec without ganking and **** like that for people who REALLY only want to do some occasional pve. I really don´t know why CCP refuses something like that to a special customer group.



It's high sec it's not without RISK, if you want to do PVE do it smart, a bit less dps a bit more tank, or don't over bling your BS, or just use second character to scout ahead, or be in one of those intel channels where people say "watch out they are ganking in [insert system name]" etc etc etc

There are ways to do it, but you need to be smart about it and not lazy about it, also being cost efficient helps a lot especially with how ship insurance work.

I did forget, you can do 1 man corp that will almost never be deced, and even if someone does dec it you make new one before war start.
Lugburz
Mind Games.
Suddenly Spaceships.
#96 - 2015-08-02 11:51:36 UTC
Colt Blackhawk wrote:
I am really no highsec bear but CCP needs to do something about highsec.
Let us face it: Yes there are players who simply want to do some occasional PVE and nothing else.
Actually you can´t do that in high without getting forced to do PVP.
But why the **** we try to force players into pvp when they don´t want it?
CCP is really cutting off some customers from the game here completely.
All these psychopaths who gank and wardec highsec bears can go to madhouse where they belong to and basta.
This is not fighting, this is not pvp, this is simply destroying the game for other players by ganking and permawardeccing them.
You can´t tell me that a catalyst idiot ganking peeps in high has good fights. Honestly every damn idiot could do that and no one can seriously tell me it is fun.
This is not about fun, this is about saddism and nothing else.
I would go even further and say we need something like super highsec without ganking and **** like that for people who REALLY only want to do some occasional pve. I really don´t know why CCP refuses something like that to a special customer group.


wrong, you want safe pve rejoin npc corp as they cant be decked.
Colt Blackhawk
Doomheim
#97 - 2015-08-02 13:21:13 UTC
Lugburz wrote:
Colt Blackhawk wrote:
I am really no highsec bear but CCP needs to do something about highsec.
Let us face it: Yes there are players who simply want to do some occasional PVE and nothing else.
Actually you can´t do that in high without getting forced to do PVP.
But why the **** we try to force players into pvp when they don´t want it?
CCP is really cutting off some customers from the game here completely.
All these psychopaths who gank and wardec highsec bears can go to madhouse where they belong to and basta.
This is not fighting, this is not pvp, this is simply destroying the game for other players by ganking and permawardeccing them.
You can´t tell me that a catalyst idiot ganking peeps in high has good fights. Honestly every damn idiot could do that and no one can seriously tell me it is fun.
This is not about fun, this is about saddism and nothing else.
I would go even further and say we need something like super highsec without ganking and **** like that for people who REALLY only want to do some occasional pve. I really don´t know why CCP refuses something like that to a special customer group.


wrong, you want safe pve rejoin npc corp as they cant be decked.


Wrong.
You can be ganked.
Probably eves no1 new player killer.

[09:04:53] Ashira Twilight > Plant the f****** amarr flag and s*** on their smoking wrecks.

Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#98 - 2015-08-02 13:24:51 UTC
Colt Blackhawk wrote:
...

wrong, you want safe pve rejoin npc corp as they cant be decked.


Wrong.
You can be ganked.
Probably eves no1 new player killer.[/quote]

'Safe' PvE should only come from players taking the appropriate precautions for their style of play. Nothing is truly totally safe in Eve and nor should it be. I believe you are still told this from the very start too.
Lugburz
Mind Games.
Suddenly Spaceships.
#99 - 2015-08-02 13:41:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugburz
Colt Blackhawk wrote:



wrong, you want safe pve rejoin npc corp as they cant be decked.


Wrong.
You can be ganked.
Probably eves no1 new player killer.


I dont view ganking as pvp but either way it is a part of eve and always has been, it also has nothing what ever to do with war decs [unless it causes one] so im actually at a loss as to why you feel it relevant here?
In effect if you do not wish to aid your corp or alliance when it is threatened or you are simply not willing or uninterested in pvp the option is there to remain or be in an npc corp; the rest of eve and its dangers are all associated with 'risk vs reward' and as such utalises the player base to add danger and challenges that AI will never (in any game i think?) be as hmm... as unpredictable and dangerous as only humans can be.
Iam The Flash
Doomheim
#100 - 2015-08-02 14:35:27 UTC
You won't convince them.

Just wait till fozzie sov fully hits n null falls apart n CCp realise most of there "pvp" pilots are nothing more than griefers in empire

They want to "pvp" in empire, with booster alts, safe stations, the ability to run like cowards the second it looks like there gonna loose

Its incredible.

Hell ive killed more people in low/null than most of these high sec idiots ever have, they have no concept of true pvp, just there stupid griefer version of pvp