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Blops?

First post
Author
Haatakan Reppola
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#61 - 2015-07-14 13:58:36 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
Sleepaz Den wrote:
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
I don't think a t2 battleship comes under the realms of "basic fits"


Basic fit, as in base or foundation. On a redeemer, 2 plates, 2 heat sinks, dcu and two platings are your *basic fit*, fyi. Roll


but if you are fitting t1 modules to a blops then you are probably too poor to fly it and doing it all wrong


If you faction the **** out of it, your most likely using at to hotdrop scrubs that have 0 chance to fight back. Thats a pretty poor base for balancing a ship. It could have 100x the EHP and all that changes is what numbers you see on your fitting screen (already choose targets that wont kill you)

BO have 2 reason for use, bridge and hotdrop from high sec (low/null can use titan+capitals for same effect)
Bringing the BO on grid is mainly for KM whoring or that you just dont have enough pilots to just send bombers/recon
Lan Wang
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#62 - 2015-07-14 14:20:03 UTC
Haatakan Reppola wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
Sleepaz Den wrote:
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
I don't think a t2 battleship comes under the realms of "basic fits"


Basic fit, as in base or foundation. On a redeemer, 2 plates, 2 heat sinks, dcu and two platings are your *basic fit*, fyi. Roll


but if you are fitting t1 modules to a blops then you are probably too poor to fly it and doing it all wrong


If you faction the **** out of it, your most likely using at to hotdrop scrubs that have 0 chance to fight back. Thats a pretty poor base for balancing a ship. It could have 100x the EHP and all that changes is what numbers you see on your fitting screen (already choose targets that wont kill you)

BO have 2 reason for use, bridge and hotdrop from high sec (low/null can use titan+capitals for same effect)
Bringing the BO on grid is mainly for KM whoring or that you just dont have enough pilots to just send bombers/recon


thats the idea of a blops...dropping on something that doesnt stand a chance of winning, im not trying to balance anything i feel blops are fine as they are.

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#63 - 2015-07-14 14:46:47 UTC
Sleepaz Den wrote:
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
I don't think a t2 battleship comes under the realms of "basic fits"


Basic fit, as in base or foundation. On a redeemer, 2 plates, 2 heat sinks, dcu and two platings are your *basic fit*, fyi. Roll


This is your idea of a "basic fit"

that's not a standard set by CCP.
Chance Ravinne
WiNGSPAN Delivery Services
WiNGSPAN Delivery Network
#64 - 2015-07-14 17:16:05 UTC
Gotta say I am also wondering what the main "problem" with Blops Battleships is. They are niche, surgical tools primarily used for ganking or baiting. They are meant to either bridge, jump in, or uncloak, then gtfo. Giving gank ships a substantial tank feels wrong; your "tank" is the element of surprise.

That said, dscan immunity would certainly be cool, just not sure what use cases necessitate it.

You've just read another awesome post by Chance Ravinne, CEO of EVE's #1 torpedo delivery service. Watch our misadventures on my YouTube channel: WINGSPANTT

Konrad Kane
#65 - 2015-07-14 18:34:00 UTC
ChromeStriker wrote:
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
the point is you drop on top of some unsuspecting ratter and take all his stuff and then disappear.


Easier to just jump other ships. Theres a reason black ops arent used, too much effort for little gain.


I think that's the general problem with them. For the almost billion isk you pay for them everything else makes more sense to drop ships with. So you end up with a ship you just use to bridge.

They appear super tricky to balance so i don't really have an answer.
Lan Wang
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#66 - 2015-07-14 18:55:00 UTC
Chance Ravinne wrote:
Gotta say I am also wondering what the main "problem" with Blops Battleships is. They are niche, surgical tools primarily used for ganking or baiting. They are meant to either bridge, jump in, or uncloak, then gtfo. Giving gank ships a substantial tank feels wrong; your "tank" is the element of surprise.

That said, dscan immunity would certainly be cool, just not sure what use cases necessitate it.


Im wondering how dscan immunity would benefit a blops, they dont roam because they have a jumpdrive, fit a mjd and it cloaks or warps, i see no real use for dscan immunity because if you see a blops then usually you are into armour and away to die

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

Mister Holder
Faceless Men
#67 - 2015-07-14 19:32:40 UTC
Chance Ravinne wrote:
That said, dscan immunity would certainly be cool, just not sure what use cases necessitate it.



All cases. I would like to be able to use my Blops for more than a bridge. That is basically all it is at the moment. A big, highly skill intensive, expensive, shiny, pile of bridging.
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
#68 - 2015-07-14 20:03:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Serendipity Lost
Konrad Kane wrote:
ChromeStriker wrote:
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
the point is you drop on top of some unsuspecting ratter and take all his stuff and then disappear.


Easier to just jump other ships. Theres a reason black ops arent used, too much effort for little gain.


I think that's the general problem with them. For the almost billion isk you pay for them everything else makes more sense to drop ships with. So you end up with a ship you just use to bridge.

They appear super tricky to balance so i don't really have an answer.



You guys have it all wrong. Put everyone in a blops. Add a few bombers for quick point capability and go. It just feels good to drop 9 bil worth of blops BS on a ratting carrier or anything for that matter.

If you're going to have blops fun bring a pile of blops BS. Quite being a bunch of cheap scrubs. The bridge should only be used to bring a few quick locks and maybe a recon or two.

In todays risk averse world as soon as the cyno goes up, 99% of folks only think 'bug out!' so normally you just try to catch what doesn't run away fast enough. A blops BS would benefit more from a scan resolution bonus than anthing else, but that's a slippery slope and you'll end up w/ a redeemer on every LS gate in eve.

At the end of the day there is no way you can talk about half of the chumps in eve to jump a 1B+ BS into any pvp situation. They just won't do it.
Lan Wang
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#69 - 2015-07-14 20:06:05 UTC
Serendipity Lost wrote:
In todays risk averse world as soon as the cyno goes up, 99% of folks only think 'bug out!' so normally you just try to catch what doesn't run away fast enough. A blops BS would benefit more from a scan resolution bonus than anthing else.


this. i was actually thinking this today only thing i could see a blops with is a bonus to scan res

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

Konrad Kane
#70 - 2015-07-14 21:01:00 UTC
Serendipity Lost wrote:

You guys have it all wrong. Put everyone in a blops. Add a few bombers for quick point capability and go. It just feels good to drop 9 bil worth of blops BS on a ratting carrier or anything for that matter. .


Be nice to see your kill-mails on those ratting carriers.
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#71 - 2015-07-14 22:31:30 UTC
Orlacc
#72 - 2015-07-15 02:29:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Orlacc
Was the Loki.

On topic though, blops are an expensive, long train niche item. But very good in that niche.

"Measure Twice, Cut Once."

Lan Wang
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#73 - 2015-07-15 08:07:22 UTC
Mister Holder wrote:
Chance Ravinne wrote:
That said, dscan immunity would certainly be cool, just not sure what use cases necessitate it.



All cases. I would like to be able to use my Blops for more than a bridge. That is basically all it is at the moment. A big, highly skill intensive, expensive, shiny, pile of bridging.


well thats your fault for only using at as bridge, its completely battle ready and its up to you to find the content to use it

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

Tiberius Heth
Doomheim
#74 - 2015-07-15 08:53:37 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
Chance Ravinne wrote:
Gotta say I am also wondering what the main "problem" with Blops Battleships is. They are niche, surgical tools primarily used for ganking or baiting. They are meant to either bridge, jump in, or uncloak, then gtfo. Giving gank ships a substantial tank feels wrong; your "tank" is the element of surprise.

That said, dscan immunity would certainly be cool, just not sure what use cases necessitate it.


Im wondering how dscan immunity would benefit a blops, they dont roam because they have a jumpdrive, fit a mjd and it cloaks or warps, i see no real use for dscan immunity because if you see a blops then usually you are into armour and away to die


It would create too much of a problem: not detectable while warping in, not scannable when left alone at safespot and forgotten to cloak it while your combat ships do the work, and would increase their usefulness outside the gank scenario, in actual normal combat. It'd be hilariously good/useful for all the wrong reasons.
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
#75 - 2015-07-15 14:31:21 UTC
Make Etana a regular ship and give me a Scimitar, Guardian and Oneiros version of it.

Alternatively make a Nestor blop hull.

Thanks from your friendly neighborhood logi buddy.

Not today spaghetti.

Haatakan Reppola
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#76 - 2015-07-15 14:46:49 UTC
Sexy Cakes wrote:
Make Etana a regular ship and give me a Scimitar, Guardian and Oneiros version of it.

Alternatively make a Nestor blop hull.

Thanks from your friendly neighborhood logi buddy.


A CovOps logi would be nice, ofc the repping power have to stay way behind normal logi but need good range on those reps (around Nestor ranges)

Current BO ships are more or less tied with their T1 counterparts for combat ability (spend the same isk on T1 and you get same or even better dps/ehp).
1vs1 a BO would never take the fight against an equaly fitted T1 battleship (1vs1 as in not dropping someone with shield/armor dmg or using more than 1 pilot total)
Vic Jefferson
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#77 - 2015-07-15 16:15:55 UTC
Sexy Cakes wrote:
Make Etana a regular ship and give me a Scimitar, Guardian and Oneiros version of it.

Alternatively make a Nestor blop hull.

Thanks from your friendly neighborhood logi buddy.



Blops aren't supposed to go toe to toe with equal numbers of dedicated combat ships.

Damage, tank, and maneuverability; pick two, as having all three would be horribly unbalanced. Blops have absurd damage and extreme maneuverability.

If you want to fly blops logi, there are extremely good cloaky t3 fits that fit the bill just fine. Yes, you have to be disciplined with their use, but they shouldn't have the full functionality that normal T2 logistic ships have. A few blops BS, recons, and T3 logi can actually take a small fight and do great.

Vote Vic Jefferson for CSM X.....XI.....XII?

Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
#78 - 2015-07-15 18:32:37 UTC
Sexy Cakes wrote:
Make Etana a regular ship and give me a Scimitar, Guardian and Oneiros version of it.

Alternatively make a Nestor blop hull.

Thanks from your friendly neighborhood logi buddy.


Your desire to soil the majesty of blops fleets w/ logi sickens me.

You can't go into this blops stuff w/ the standard risk averse pansy point of view. This is not an activity for scrubs.


Man up and JUMP JUMP JUMP.
Lan Wang
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#79 - 2015-07-15 20:18:03 UTC
Serendipity Lost wrote:
Sexy Cakes wrote:
Make Etana a regular ship and give me a Scimitar, Guardian and Oneiros version of it.

Alternatively make a Nestor blop hull.

Thanks from your friendly neighborhood logi buddy.


Your desire to soil the majesty of blops fleets w/ logi sickens me.

You can't go into this blops stuff w/ the standard risk averse pansy point of view. This is not an activity for scrubs.


Man up and JUMP JUMP JUMP.


we always have triage on standby when we blops and most of the sins are fitted with remote reps anyway :) blops is an adrenaline rush, i love it

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

Haatakan Reppola
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#80 - 2015-07-15 20:21:45 UTC
Serendipity Lost wrote:
Sexy Cakes wrote:
Make Etana a regular ship and give me a Scimitar, Guardian and Oneiros version of it.

Alternatively make a Nestor blop hull.

Thanks from your friendly neighborhood logi buddy.


Your desire to soil the majesty of blops fleets w/ logi sickens me.

You can't go into this blops stuff w/ the standard risk averse pansy point of view. This is not an activity for scrubs.


Man up and JUMP JUMP JUMP.


You mean to say that blops is MORE risk averse than normal fleets, hotdropping is NOT a risky activity. Its the most risk averse form of PvP you will ever find (yes that include SRP fleets)