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Instawarp MWD+Cloak
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Dalto Bane
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2015-06-18 08:58:17 UTC
I am just curious of what the general opinion is on this tactic?

I know it has been around forever. I am just seeing it used in such frequency in Lowsec lately that my buttmad is starting to show. It's a bit annoying to have T1 ships with the same immunity to being pointed as a covert ship right off the gate. Of course there are tactics to combat these ships but its like taking an atom bomb to an anthill just to catch one.

Drops Mic
Wacktopia
Fleet-Up.com
Keep It Simple Software Group
#2 - 2015-06-18 09:00:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Wacktopia
Dalto Bane wrote:
my buttmad is starting to show


Lol - let it out. Let it all out.

I think it's fairly legit - I've used it a fair bit. There's plenty of room for human error in there and it's counter-able if you know what you're doing so it feels ok to me.

Kitchen sink? Seriousy, get your ship together -  Fleet-Up.com
Stacy Lone
Nirakura Inc
Decisions of Truth
#3 - 2015-06-18 09:03:02 UTC
It is annoying in LS, but less so in 0.0 where a solo Sabre can make this trick quite difficult to pull off.

In LS, just get a fast cepi and you'll catch them 40% of the time. Which means plenty of time to get him on one of the gates on his route ;)

Seriously, a cepi or sabre isn shooting ducks with cannons. It's just using the right tools.
Chatelaine Superior
Angels Dust
#4 - 2015-06-18 09:03:25 UTC
Easy ( or maybe not) to counter this. All you need is uncloak a ship before he uncloked by himself. Camp with ceptors and logistics and you will get these kills.
Yarda Black
The Black Redemption
#5 - 2015-06-18 09:20:41 UTC
Imagine killing a dude taking some effort....
Vek Hareka
Fist Bumps All Around
#6 - 2015-06-18 09:24:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Vek Hareka
Dalto Bane wrote:
I am just curious of what the general opinion is on this tactic?

I know it has been around forever. I am just seeing it used in such frequency in Lowsec lately that my buttmad is starting to show. It's a bit annoying to have T1 ships with the same immunity to being pointed as a covert ship right off the gate. Of course there are tactics to combat these ships but its like taking an atom bomb to an anthill just to catch one.


My opinion: I love this little magic trick.

It works (not in null though).

So does gate camping with resebo'ed wrecks... I mean Minmatar ships. Or pesky ceptors that almost nobody can catch.

All. Legit.

Use it. Counter it. Accept it. Roll with it.

Here comes a time, ganker,

When blingfits cease to sparkle,

When hermophite looses its luster,

When the station hangar becomes a prison

And all that is left is a capsuleer's love for his fedo.
Dalto Bane
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2015-06-18 10:11:55 UTC
Yarda Black wrote:
Imagine killing a dude taking some effort....


I would like to imagine a little effort to be put forth from the dude not to be killed other than fitting a cloak and a MWD and instawarping from gate to gate.

I actually would rather put forth the effort to "catch" the guy rather than get a few SB BS on a gatecamp but this tactic leaves little choice in Lowsec.

I appreciate all the input thus far!

Drops Mic
Keisha Tachyon
Perkone
Caldari State
#8 - 2015-06-18 10:28:21 UTC
They did put effort in. They fit a cloak on a ship normaly not suited to it. As in they have put on a travel fit.

As such you should not really see those as "missed" kills. Because let´s be honest, the Pilot put thought in the way he/she moved around. Meaning if that trick would stop working they would not be flying around unscouted in that ship anyway.
Dalto Bane
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2015-06-18 10:52:59 UTC
Keisha Tachyon wrote:
They did put effort in. They fit a cloak on a ship normaly not suited to it. As in they have put on a travel fit.

As such you should not really see those as "missed" kills. Because let´s be honest, the Pilot put thought in the way he/she moved around. Meaning if that trick would stop working they would not be flying around unscouted in that ship anyway.


Fair enough, though I would disagree with you on the "they would not be flying around unscouted"Lol

My question to you is, "Does this tactic, when used, devalue the role of blockade runners?"

Drops Mic
Mr Duffo
SQUIDS.
#10 - 2015-06-18 11:10:37 UTC
I use it a lot. So easy to pass tama camps everytime with bustard. Crane still usefull to move modules fast with its great warp speed so wouldnt say they are useless

Skeggǫld, Skálmǫld, Skildir ro Klofnir!

Never forget! #OICXmassacre2014
Gully Alex Foyle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2015-06-18 11:21:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Gully Alex Foyle
Dalto Bane wrote:
"Does this tactic, when used, devalue the role of blockade runners?"
BRs align in a couple of seconds depending on fit, with MWD+cloak you have to always wait the entire 10-second MWD cycle. That makes it much easier to get decloaked and pointed in the latter case.

Also, much faster warp speed, covops cloak makes you invisible on dscan while warping, beefier tank (FWIW), etc...

Oh, and BRs look nicer too.


EDIT: also, gate camping is a legit but quite annoying form of PVP, it's only fair that players that take steps to protect themselves get a fair chance of escaping.

Make space glamorous! Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!
Moac Tor
Cyber Core
Immediate Destruction
#12 - 2015-06-18 11:31:12 UTC
Dalto Bane wrote:
Keisha Tachyon wrote:
They did put effort in. They fit a cloak on a ship normaly not suited to it. As in they have put on a travel fit.

As such you should not really see those as "missed" kills. Because let´s be honest, the Pilot put thought in the way he/she moved around. Meaning if that trick would stop working they would not be flying around unscouted in that ship anyway.


Fair enough, though I would disagree with you on the "they would not be flying around unscouted"Lol

My question to you is, "Does this tactic, when used, devalue the role of blockade runners?"

The fact that you are comparing the mwd + cloak trick to a proper covert ops cloak shows you don't know much about about this.

The MWD cloak fitted ship has to make sacrifices and generally precludes the ship from any meaningful combat, it is still easy to catch them in null sec, and very possible to be caught by a gate camp in low sec. Most ships that use them will generally take the MWD cycle to get into warp so you have 10 seconds to uncloak them before they warp off.

Compare that to a blockade runner and you have a ship that is near on impossible to catch anywhere in space if the pilot doesn't screw up, with only a slight increased risk in null sec.
Mag's
Azn Empire
#13 - 2015-06-18 11:32:39 UTC
I'm fine with it and feel it's part of the game.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Keisha Tachyon
Perkone
Caldari State
#14 - 2015-06-18 11:37:29 UTC
Dalto BaneFair enough, though I would disagree with you on the "they would not be flying around unscouted"[:lol: wrote:


My question to you is, "Does this tactic, when used, devalue the role of blockade runners?"



As has been said, BR´s are moving/aligning a lot faster than ships with normal cloak and mwd. As such they are still very good at actually evading ships incoming to decloak you. So they still work well in bubbles where a normal mwd/cloak is getting into trouble.

The ability to warp cloaked is also very nice to Scout gates in peace.
Dalto Bane
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2015-06-18 11:56:02 UTC
Moac Tor wrote:


The fact that you are comparing the mwd + cloak trick to a proper covert ops cloak shows you don't know much about about this.

The MWD cloak fitted ship has to make sacrifices and generally precludes the ship from any meaningful combat, it is still easy to catch them in null sec, and very possible to be caught by a gate camp in low sec. Most ships that use them will generally take the MWD cycle to get into warp so you have 10 seconds to uncloak them before they warp off.

Compare that to a blockade runner and you have a ship that is near on impossible to catch anywhere in space if the pilot doesn't screw up, with only a slight increased risk in null sec.


I actually have quite a bit of knowledge on the subject. I have also used this trick in the past. I was speaking in the general sense of the role of blockade runners (alibi-Deep space transports also). Their roles were specifically designed for Lowsec and Nullsec transport respectively.

Is it possible to catch a ship using MWD+cloak in Lowsec? sure, as long as you have a ship that can fly into and decloak it because, unfortunately, there aren't enough sebos and resebos in the game that can get scanres below the one sec server tick.Straight

Drops Mic
Khanid Voltar
#16 - 2015-06-18 13:02:28 UTC
Dalto Bane wrote:

Is it possible to catch a ship using MWD+cloak in Lowsec? sure, as long as you have a ship that can fly into and decloak it because, unfortunately, there aren't enough sebos and resebos in the game that can get scanres below the one sec server tick.Straight


So basically you are saying that because you can't be bothered to adapt your game style you think the practice should be nerfed?
Nicholas Kirk
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#17 - 2015-06-18 13:24:21 UTC
Stacy Lone wrote:
It is annoying in LS, but less so in 0.0 where a solo Sabre can make this trick quite difficult to pull off.

In LS, just get a fast cepi and you'll catch them 40% of the time. Which means plenty of time to get him on one of the gates on his route ;)

Seriously, a cepi or sabre isn shooting ducks with cannons. It's just using the right tools.

If never lost any of my low end low skilled alts in LS using this combo. WHs and null with bubbles and lots of frigs tho have snagged a few but LS 40% you're on crack.
Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#18 - 2015-06-18 13:32:26 UTC
Nicholas Kirk wrote:
Stacy Lone wrote:
It is annoying in LS, but less so in 0.0 where a solo Sabre can make this trick quite difficult to pull off.

In LS, just get a fast cepi and you'll catch them 40% of the time. Which means plenty of time to get him on one of the gates on his route ;)

Seriously, a cepi or sabre isn shooting ducks with cannons. It's just using the right tools.

If never lost any of my low end low skilled alts in LS using this combo. WHs and null with bubbles and lots of frigs tho have snagged a few but LS 40% you're on crack.



If you use a T3 with an interdictor nullifier then you can skip the cov ops offensive and use the MWD+Cloak trick. This is the best way to get a ratting T3 into otherwise un-useable null space.

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

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Nicholas Kirk
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#19 - 2015-06-18 13:33:50 UTC
Keisha Tachyon wrote:
They did put effort in. They fit a cloak on a ship normaly not suited to it. As in they have put on a travel fit.

As such you should not really see those as "missed" kills. Because let´s be honest, the Pilot put thought in the way he/she moved around. Meaning if that trick would stop working they would not be flying around unscouted in that ship anyway.

This

As I stated in my last post my low end skilled alts have basic skills but they can fit a travel fit in a fast frig making LS jumping safer then HS.

Using this cloak travel fit can be harder the bigger the ship tho but let's say a nano hull warped stabbed BS with or with out cloak is also hard to catch with out a dictor.
Dalto Bane
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2015-06-18 13:44:21 UTC
Khanid Voltar wrote:
Dalto Bane wrote:

Is it possible to catch a ship using MWD+cloak in Lowsec? sure, as long as you have a ship that can fly into and decloak it because, unfortunately, there aren't enough sebos and resebos in the game that can get scanres below the one sec server tick.Straight


So basically you are saying that because you can't be bothered to adapt your game style you think the practice should be nerfed?






I have not mentioned nerfing this mechanic in any of my post. It is not always about whether to nerf/buff/fix something. I honestly wanted to know other's opinions on the matter is all. I don't like it, doesn't mean I can't be bothered to adapt my game style.

Drops Mic
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