Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Well it seems CCP does not care to fix their mistakes with R64 & R32 moons to fix the bottleneck. So I would like to propose every 2-4 months moving all the current R64 & R32 moon concentrations to other regions forcing the mega-alliances to move if they wish to keep their cash cows.

It would give CCP much more PVP in null-sec as everyone will move to the new locations of the moons and give player alliances something to really fight over vs the entrenched situations we have today. It will also cause major disruptions in the supply chain maybe forcing CCP's hand into actually adding more of them slowly as they re-locate them.

For example move them from the north to the south then to the east then the west etc..

Please only post constructive criticism.

turn moon goo mining in a mechanic similar to PI, except unlike PI these moons will not regenerate.

overmining will cause the moons to deteriorate and then poof, or perhaps for extra fun explode due to overmining and damage/destroy orbiting stations.

overmining can be determined by some equation of moon mass vs. goo extracted per day, if the balance tips... see above

once a moon has been mined out the moon will 'respawn' in another corner of new eden (east, west, south, north). by respawn I mean use a bit of RP and say a new unnoticed vein of moon goo was discovered, or a comet full of magical materials from the deep reaches of unknown space has crashed into a nearby moon adding to its minable contents. blah blah blah

the concept is sound imo. too many people in nullsec not moving around is boring.

might also change sov strategy where instead of owning massive swathes of nullsec, alliances will decide to own small pockets within jump bridge range of one another to increase their agility and ability to project power throughout new eden. rather than being confined to their little corner.

Thanks for the constructive feedback Elindreal. Your implementation of my idea is exactly what I was looking for to promote this.

As for Nicolo, that's exactly what I am proposing. There is no reason these huge alliances with massive resources should not be able to take down and setup new towers in new locations every few months. It only takes 1 second now to online and offline modules for the POS if you didn't read the patch notes for the winter expansion.

I have been thinking along very similar lines for some years now.
I've set out how I would see it working in this post.

The only issue, as the poster above says, is moon scanning time. This would need reworking.

I think you mean that the SOV system makes it way too easy to defend systems against an even vaguely competent (and alive) foe.


I literally can't wait to have to scan every moon in every region, repeatedly, just to see what moons have gotten what material, so I can plop down a POS for a few weeks before it runs out.

if there is so much hate towards having to rebuild a new moongoo mining pos every couple months then by all means make the mooning similar to PI where it does naturally regen its moongoo.

that said, if you outstrip its natural regen (akin to PI) it will eventually poof.

therefore major alliances who get a moon are able to hold their moon more or less indefinitely by limiting their greed. meanwhile if a tech moon appears in enemy territory, but not too far off, an alliance could conceivably run over, set up a pos and mine the hell out of the moon until it poofs.

you now have a game of risk, a sov holding alliance will want to limit their take to hold their moon, an opposing alliance has an incentive to storm in, set up their own pos which will likely tip the regen balance over the edge and cause the moon to poof.
the sov holding alliance will only have a couple days to rid the enemy pos before the regen is overcome.

as for having to scan all these moons down to find the new tech, i dunno, maybe issue regionwide DED reports which talk of new veins appearing.
if the tech does come from distant comets crashing into moons the report can talk about a comet headed for system 'x' so at least people know where they have to scan as opposed to looking for a needle in a haystack.
/shrug
not very creative i know, the concerns are valid but not insurmountable.

I will begin by say that I wish these wasn't a Tech bottleneck. Mostly because I PvP and would love for my Basilisks, Falcons, etc to be much cheaper. However....

There is nothing wrong with how things are now. Everyone is complaining about Tech moons being all taken by the big alliances who are only releasing a small amount to keep their isk flowing.

I think this is awesome for a bunch of reason:
There is incentive to go to war for better SOV
These moons allow larger alliances to take on larger projects like ship replacement programs
These moons allow smaller alliances to fight over the few not controlled by the major SOV alliances
If a smaller alliance manages to be in control of one of these moons then they have the ability to get more caps, super caps, and possibly even a titan for PvP.
These moons allow for SOV alliances to build up and maintain a large number of systems, even one or more regions with upgrades, SOV bills, POS fuels, etc.

Now when something is valuable people are drawn to it. So it would make sense that these moons are taken by larger alliances capable of defending them from others. Don't like it? Get a PvP alliance going and work to taking these moons from them. Pandemic Legion is a great example. They hold little to no SOV, but a large number of moons they can defend. And PL is one of the few alliances I would not want to fight. You can do this too. You just have to work for it.

Of course you could always go a different route. You could turn always turn another moon goo in to a bottleneck without people realizing then cash in. No doubt it will be a lot of work. But it would be very worth it. I would recommend an R64 moon goo. That would mean fewer moons to control and maintain. And the goo is worth more than Tech would be without the monopoly on it. So a monopoly on R64 goo would make Tech look like child's play.

But let's say we decide to change things.

1. Don't even think about getting rid of POS mining. If it's worth it you need to be able to defend it. A POS allows you to do that. No POCO for moons is going to help you defend anything. SOV is about building up infrastructure and then having someone else painfully tear it down. POS are all part of this. And if you went away from POS then all of the PI materials would crash hard since the demand would plummet. More harm than good IMO.

2. An idea that has been kicked around is unlocking Moon mining in highsec. You could moon mine, but all of the reactors would have to be in low and null. Of course then pet alliances from the large SOV alliances would move in and claim all the good highsec moons. Altogether, his would cause far too much damage to 0.0 SOV isk making. SOV is not cheap. Something has to pay for it.

3. Randomizing/evenly distributing the moons so all of SOV is worth the exact same isn't a good solution. You have no idea how annoying it is to put up or take down a POS. And scanning the moons isn't any more fun. So randomization is out the window. (No. Really. I am serious. Randomization would cause a revolt that would make Incarna look small.) You could evenly distribute them to all the regions. But that really doesn't make any particular space more valuable than any other. This would cause massive stagnation in SOV holding since there would be no motivation to attempt to get better, more profitable space.

4. You could have the moons not regenerate resources. I am not going to waste my time explaining just how large a moon is and how pulling out just a few m3 an hour would not deplete the resources. If the moon did not regenerate resources then you would have to get some way to create new moons with that resource. And we are back to randomization. And let me remind you that is a terrible idea. But what if you had them slowly regenerate resources? Then you would have to add a new mechanic to vary how much of the resource you pulled out. Something not currently supported but he Moon Harvesting Array (MHA) on a POS. So this is a no go.

5. But what if we added t2 MHA? This would allow you to pull out 200 units per hour instead of 100. Brilliant. I think this would be an idea supported by all. Who wouldn't want more profit from their moons? And possibly eventually if there were enough moons that you could pull 200 units out of the sheer amount produced would eventually lower prices. But I doubt this would make much of a difference. If the large alliances are already not releasing all the units they mine then they just won't release the extra 100 units they get a hour.

In all reality you are better off playing by the rules that are already in place. No solution for re-balancing, redoing, redistributing, etc is going to solve this. In fact just about anything you do will make this worse and make everyone angry. Go become another Pandemic Legion. Make a PvP alliance with the goal of taking moons away from the large SOV alliances. Or go make your own bottleneck. As Goonswarm has proved with the oxi-topes a dedicated group of pilots can change Eve.

Since a pos is anchored to a moon moving the moon would drag any pos with it. It would make for an interesting opportunity for someone to try to destroy the pos as it would likely be in someone elses soverign territory. Such a pos would likely be set with a cyno generator since when it moves they would want to catch up to it fast. This might make for an unxpected giant fleet battle which might loosen mega alliance control over both the moon and the system they left to chase it.

Are most of you guys actually spending time thinking when coming up with these ideas? Because while I kind of like the idea of changing moongoo to a PI like system, adding depletion which can "permanently" deplete moongoo from a moon is just awful because you just know people won't be able to restrain themselves. Randomly moving moongoo from moon to moon every 2 months or whatever is just as bad. And now, moving the entire moon and any potential mining POS?

Mother of god.

Don't worry, I wasn't talking about your post.