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Is it me, or does it seem I could skip medium drones?
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Demerius Xenocratus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#21 - 2015-06-13 20:29:23 UTC
Bert Zangle wrote:
Sorry, the title is a bit simplistic and sensationalist :D What I mean is this:

I'm currently flying a Vexor in level 3 missions. Skills are fairly decent I would say, and I have fit that works well (no room for a Omnidirectional Tracking Link however), so I'm quite happy with my ISK/hour.

I use Hobgoblin II, and Integrated Hammerheads. Now, the Hobs are a safety measure for when a hole group of elite frigs show up, although I should say that the IHHs perform well enough against those as well. The IHHs take care of almost anything else efficiently.

Now I started testing Integrated Ogres on the same missions. They are about 50% slower, sure, but their tracking is pretty close to HHs, and their damage is double. So, I am getting the impression that I could skip the mediums and rely on light+heavy for level 3.

Sure, the limited drone cargo of the Vexor is a factor as well, but I do wonder if the point I'm trying to make (light+heavy seems to make using mediums less of a priority) has any value at all.


Integrated drones suck. Augmented are amazing but far too expensive for PvE. Navy faction drones are just a step below t2 in damage and if I recall correctly they have superior stats in some other areas. So, use Navy drones until you can use t2.

As for the Vexor it's a great ship for pvp and low end PvE but I will tell you the same thing I told another poster who was using a Vexor for PvE in highsec: You should upgrade to a Vexor Navy issue as soon as humanly possible. It's not terribly expensive and the increase in performance over a T1 Vexor is massive. The ability to deploy FIVE heavy or sentry drones instead of 3 is a 66% increase in damage, not to mention the VNI has an extra low slot so you can fit another drone damage mod (so you're probably looking at a 100% total DPS increase). The VNI also has a superior tank and a very nice bonus to drone speed and velocity, and it didn't get hit with the same sentry damage nerf as the Ishtar. A VNI with faction sentries or Ogre's will maul lvl 3's and many lvl 4's ad long as you watch for NPC's targeting your drones.

Get a VNI ASAP. You'll thank me. It's the best Navy cruiser in the game and superior to some T2 and pirate cruisers.

Skip medium drones for now, medium drones V is like a 9 day train in the event you ever buy a Gila, which is an amazing hull also but about 4x the price of a VNI. Drone interfacing is the most important drone skill; get that to 5, and Gallente cruiser to 5 for a total 100% bonus to drone damage and HP.

I would take Gallente cruiser, drone interfacing, drone navigation, durability, sentries and heavies to 4. Then DI and cruiser to 5. Then sentry and heavy to 5, first choice being the one you use more. Use faction drones until you get T2. Then round out your drones by getting the drone support skills to 5.

I personally have not found much use for mediums aside from my Gila. Anything small and fast enough to require mediums can be better dealt with by lights, anything that can be consistently killed by mediums will probably die even faster to heavies. The only exception is extremely fast kiting cruisers in PvP, and for those you should just use geckos.
Bert Zangle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#22 - 2015-06-14 11:00:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Bert Zangle
Demerius Xenocratus wrote:
[...]


Extremely helpful post. Thanks!

One question though, about:

Demerius Xenocratus wrote:

As for the Vexor it's a great ship for pvp and low end PvE but I will tell you the same thing I told another poster who was using a Vexor for PvE in highsec: You should upgrade to a Vexor Navy issue as soon as humanly possible. It's not terribly expensive and the increase in performance over a T1 Vexor is massive. The ability to deploy FIVE heavy or sentry drones instead of 3 is a 66% increase in damage, not to mention the VNI has an extra low slot so you can fit another drone damage mod (so you're probably looking at a 100% total DPS increase). The VNI also has a superior tank and a very nice bonus to drone speed and velocity, and it didn't get hit with the same sentry damage nerf as the Ishtar. A VNI with faction sentries or Ogre's will maul lvl 3's and many lvl 4's ad long as you watch for NPC's targeting your drones.

Get a VNI ASAP. You'll thank me. It's the best Navy cruiser in the game and superior to some T2 and pirate cruisers.


I get why the Vexor Navy is preferable over the regular Vexor, but after playing around with fits I'd like to fly, it looks to me as if a Myrmidon would be even better for what I'm doing (going through lvl 3 missions fast, and possible some lvl 4 at some point).

For a slightly lower price, with the Myrmidon I seem to get the following: if I go for the shield thank fit I want to, I'll get twice the EHP, 3 times the shield recharge rate. and I can actually add some turrets to add to overall dps.

It is *worse* than the VNI in: 25 less drone bandwidth (but like I said, at least I can some turrets), slower (but on the Myrm. I have ample space for a MWD), and of course, twice the signature.

Anything wrong then with me aiming to upgrade from Vexor to Myrmidon? Right now, it looks like the better option than the VNI, for what I'm doing.

EDIT: yeah, never mind the above... I think I get it now: the Myr can easily be better tanked than the VNI, but in terms of actual DPS applied to targets, the VNI is a lot better. And since the goal is to run missions efficiently, that's more important.

Roughly correct?
Demerius Xenocratus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2015-06-14 19:13:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Demerius Xenocratus
Bert Zangle wrote:
Demerius Xenocratus wrote:
[...]


Extremely helpful post. Thanks!

One question though, about:

Demerius Xenocratus wrote:

As for the Vexor it's a great ship for pvp and low end PvE but I will tell you the same thing I told another poster who was using a Vexor for PvE in highsec: You should upgrade to a Vexor Navy issue as soon as humanly possible. It's not terribly expensive and the increase in performance over a T1 Vexor is massive. The ability to deploy FIVE heavy or sentry drones instead of 3 is a 66% increase in damage, not to mention the VNI has an extra low slot so you can fit another drone damage mod (so you're probably looking at a 100% total DPS increase). The VNI also has a superior tank and a very nice bonus to drone speed and velocity, and it didn't get hit with the same sentry damage nerf as the Ishtar. A VNI with faction sentries or Ogre's will maul lvl 3's and many lvl 4's ad long as you watch for NPC's targeting your drones.

Get a VNI ASAP. You'll thank me. It's the best Navy cruiser in the game and superior to some T2 and pirate cruisers.


I get why the Vexor Navy is preferable over the regular Vexor, but after playing around with fits I'd like to fly, it looks to me as if a Myrmidon would be even better for what I'm doing (going through lvl 3 missions fast, and possible some lvl 4 at some point).

For a slightly lower price, with the Myrmidon I seem to get the following: if I go for the shield thank fit I want to, I'll get twice the EHP, 3 times the shield recharge rate. and I can actually add some turrets to add to overall dps.

It is *worse* than the VNI in: 25 less drone bandwidth (but like I said, at least I can some turrets), slower (but on the Myrm. I have ample space for a MWD), and of course, twice the signature.

Anything wrong then with me aiming to upgrade from Vexor to Myrmidon? Right now, it looks like the better option than the VNI, for what I'm doing.

EDIT: yeah, never mind the above... I think I get it now: the Myr can easily be better tanked than the VNI, but in terms of actual DPS applied to targets, the VNI is a lot better. And since the goal is to run missions efficiently, that's more important.

Roughly correct?


You hit it. VNI can run a full flight of any drones, with further 25% (with cruiser V) to speed and tracking. That extra heavy or sentry drone makes a huge difference in your damage, the only way to match that with the myrm would be to run a set of railguns on a hull with no turret bonuses, and you'll have to worry about swapping out ammo and managing range/transversal in a slow battlecruiser just to apply that extra 150-200 DPS. Fitting a full rack of rails also eats up quite a bit of fitting space.

Basically, start using a hull that can run 5 heavy/sentry drones and then start maxing out your drone DPS skills and you will start to hit 500, 600, even 750 DPS well applied with drones.

If you do want to start running lvl 4's though, a sentry dominix with micro jump drive is worth looking into. An ishtar wrecked lvl 4's before the nerf but you'd probably have to use heavy drones now and the elite frigate rats like to shoot them. Still very doable if you can keep aggro off your drones, and 800 DPS Ogres remove NPC battleships from the field pretty quickly.

And the VNI has only 1 less med slot and the same low slots as a myrm, coupled with much smaller sig it can tank just as effectively; you just get to learn to actually fly your ship to manage range and transversal.
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