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Wtf do the "theme parks that way" references mean

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Emiko P'eng
#41 - 2015-06-12 18:27:46 UTC
As so far stated 'go find a themepark game' is usually aimed at those who want to turn EVE into, as stated, WoW or SWToR

A game that will hold your hand and lead you through the stories and fights, giving you the things to fight in an interesting order that will be a bit of a challenge but not dishearten you if you die a couple of times.

They will even offer you an easier route to gain levels if you really don't want to try the 'hard stuff'

So unless you are a complete idiot everyone will end up stinking Rich with multiple sets of Armour, Titles, Achievements, Homes, Mounts, Crafting Skills all as the game designer and game owner wanted.

---

EVE on the other hand is where a Small Corporation who has friends in a 210 man Alliance. Spot some easy pickings.

So out of the blue they both Declare War on your little corp and proceed to rip up your Custom Offices and lay waste to your investments in a couple of evenings.

Forcing a quick rethink and redirecting of resources.

Totally unscripted and unexpected!

There is no end in EVE, there are no ultimate bosses to slay, just lots and lots of real life players all with their own goals and agendas.

Some of them will agree with you and help you with your aims and goals, but usually they will mostly oppose your aims and goals

This is what makes EVE a real challenge and as a result gives you a real buzz, even during a disaster Big smile

Hehe!

Even if you are a consummate ancient , in real life, carebear like me, who's the CEO of the little corp Big smile

That is why 'go find a themepark game' , 'Go back to WoW' are used as a term of derision if a suggestion in the forum seems to want to make EVE safer, easier or linear!
La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#42 - 2015-06-12 18:57:10 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Bellatrix Invicta wrote:
When a game has more information about boss fight tactics, positioning and class makeup online than history of the game or in-game lore, it's a themepark. It all gets boiled down to mobbing trash to the raid boss then all standing in certain spots while pressing butans. Mindless, boring and completely free of challenge.

Theme park. Where nothing is actually dangerous.
This would classify nearly every game (except brand new games amusingly, until they got big) as a themepark, EVE included. And dude, EVE isn't dangerous either, ships are just better categorised as consumables. Pretty much all you ever need to risk n EVE boils down to isk, which there's enough of that it's pretty much irrelevant to most people these days.


some ppl need the illusion, that they are tougher and smarter than other online players.
They are not!

wow like gameplay:
look for harder opponents. (boss fights)

eve pvp eltists:
look for the weakest targets and boast like klingons if you downed one...

hmmmm....
lol

Eve is much better than that!
i just got insight how the real big players play this game.
much more impressive than the standard carebear yapping.

Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#43 - 2015-06-12 19:37:56 UTC
Probably already covered.

A theme park is an mmo that has stuff you run in a linear progression. Or things designed for you to do.

Example: A raid in WoW is the equivalent of an E Ticket ride at Disneyland.

So you do the 'kiddy' adventures in the newbie area, run quests, raids, kill npc's. then when you reach lvl 5, you move to the next area, the mobs are harder, the raids harder, and quests harder. Then when you level up, you move to the next area. Wash rinse repeat.

Its like going to Disneyland, and riding the monorail, then pirates of the carabian, then haunted mansion, then maybe moving up to buz, then star tours, then doing the roller coasters, all the way up to the E-tickets. Once you have ran everything, you go run you favorite stuff again. Then eventually, the game developers (or in this case imagineers) make a new land with new rides in it. and they cycles keeps going.


EvE is not like this. there is a small theme park in that you CAN run missions, 1-5, you can go to incursions which has a natural progression of easy to hard. But this is basically like going to the Santa Cruiz beach board walk. you have the theme park area, but also the beach to go play in with tools littered all over.

thats what they mean by 'go back to the theme park'

Players now a days need a Final Fantasy (non mmo)type story, were you progress to the end and 'beat the game'

IMO, eve's theme park sections could be made better. But not at the expense of the sandbox.

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.
La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#44 - 2015-06-13 09:12:52 UTC  |  Edited by: La Rynx
i do not think people want "to beat a game".
it is just impossible to create a an endless game in a certain amount of time.

from this Point of view, MMOs are those endless games. WoW is like that. ppl hunger for more entertainment. blizzard delivers. No need to create extra social contacts.
Thats the reason for those lonewolfs playing multiplayergames. Because more content gets created as times go by.

eve and wow differ in the theme of the park. one is scifi, one is fantasy.
eve is a theme park too, one where some attraction is like sticks lying around where you can beat other players or puppets in the park. the owner still has to deliver new kinds of sticks or more surroundings and interesting opportuninities, to have the players to hide and seek.

but eve too , is a themepark.
Player content?
When it comes(?) to repetition, its even worse. There is not so much different content.
Waiting for easy kills at bubbles. Waiting for easy gank targets. The tactics are more repetetive than gameplay in WoW can be. If you are thinking it over and being honest, you know that.

Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."
Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#45 - 2015-06-13 10:48:51 UTC
DaReaper wrote:
EvE is not like this. there is a small theme park in that you CAN run missions, 1-5, you can go to incursions which has a natural progression of easy to hard. But this is basically like going to the Santa Cruiz beach board walk. you have the theme park area, but also the beach to go play in with tools littered all over.
Hey "E-Ticket" grandpa, missions are not a progression themepark mechanic PLol

If they were, you'd level-up by doing them. 5yrs into the game, you might find yourself grinding lvl1's to raise faction and standings. Missions have and do fit well inside a sandbox. EVE isn't the first sandbox to do so. gramps.

PotC was so much better before the johnny depp makeover. Well, at least they didn't cast MaAatt DAAaamooon as Capt. Jack Sparrow.

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12
Constantin Baracca
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#46 - 2015-06-13 13:33:58 UTC
La Rynx wrote:
i do not think people want "to beat a game".
it is just impossible to create a an endless game in a certain amount of time.

from this Point of view, MMOs are those endless games. WoW is like that. ppl hunger for more entertainment. blizzard delivers. No need to create extra social contacts.
Thats the reason for those lonewolfs playing multiplayergames. Because more content gets created as times go by.

eve and wow differ in the theme of the park. one is scifi, one is fantasy.
eve is a theme park too, one where some attraction is like sticks lying around where you can beat other players or puppets in the park. the owner still has to deliver new kinds of sticks or more surroundings and interesting opportuninities, to have the players to hide and seek.

but eve too , is a themepark.
Player content?
When it comes(?) to repetition, its even worse. There is not so much different content.
Waiting for easy kills at bubbles. Waiting for easy gank targets. The tactics are more repetetive than gameplay in WoW can be. If you are thinking it over and being honest, you know that.


I just want to point out here that there are ways to create truly randomized content in a PVE sense. You've seen it tried with games like Diablo. FfXIV FATEs and RIFT come to mind. There are examples of attempts to create a far mor random experience. They can't quite get there though because, of course, they're all sculpted landscapes and have issues with how structures and enemies can appear.

EVE, uniquely, doesn't have that problem. EVE is one of the only games that can, essentially, create something out of nothing. That's all a cosmic anomaly is. Content that springs to life from nowhere.

EVE could implement anything any other MMORPG does. More importantly, it can do a huge amount of things they can't. They can implement true random tuned encounters without becoming a theme park. And it's a shame they haven't. No other gamr I've seen out there can or will be able to do that. CCP hasn't even scratched the surface of what their game can do because they've got such a limited approach to their audience and design. Their current audience might see that effort as fueling a PVE conversion that weakens the draw of PVP at worst and an amusing distraction at best.

But there are a lot of people NOT playing the game right now who would find that kind of content to be endlessly fascinating.

"What good will it be for someone to gain the whole world, yet forfeit their soul? Or what can anyone give in exchange for their soul?"

-Matthew 16:26
Pops Tickle
Tickle Industries
#47 - 2015-06-13 15:09:29 UTC
As I am on a posting spree I would like to point at reddit, specifically the thread about drifter incursions. For fun, I will not link it myself and instead let you look for it. :)

CCP Rise wrote:

"We have tried and tried to validate the myth that griefing has a pronounced affect on new players - we have failed."

Source
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#48 - 2015-06-14 19:52:32 UTC
Webvan wrote:
DaReaper wrote:
EvE is not like this. there is a small theme park in that you CAN run missions, 1-5, you can go to incursions which has a natural progression of easy to hard. But this is basically like going to the Santa Cruiz beach board walk. you have the theme park area, but also the beach to go play in with tools littered all over.
Hey "E-Ticket" grandpa, missions are not a progression themepark mechanic PLol

If they were, you'd level-up by doing them. 5yrs into the game, you might find yourself grinding lvl1's to raise faction and standings. Missions have and do fit well inside a sandbox. EVE isn't the first sandbox to do so. gramps.

PotC was so much better before the johnny depp makeover. Well, at least they didn't cast MaAatt DAAaamooon as Capt. Jack Sparrow.



its as close to a theme park area as eve has,

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#49 - 2015-06-15 00:57:05 UTC
Key Difference:

Theme park MMO: The majority of content is made by the devs. Once you have done all the current quests, acquired all the current gear there is nothing much to do but hang around chat and wait till the next release for new quests/gear/stuff-to-do.

Sandbox MMO: A limited amount of content is provided by the devs. Most of the goals will be player created. The game only gets boring when the players get blaise and stop doing new stuff.

All games are a mixture. EVE has some theme park content like the new player tutorials, incursions and mission running. WoW has some player created content. Some games like Archmage seem to be about 50/50 of each.
Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#50 - 2015-06-15 02:25:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Webvan
DaReaper wrote:
its as close to a theme park area as eve has,
close to it... well you could say the same thing about mining then, in fact more so because it's actually a static encounter. EVE is obviously not a pure sandbox, it's an openworld mmo (more reminiscent of a simulator e.g. sandbox-simulator er or simulated-sandbox). Openworld shouldn't be confused with themepark, design mechanics tend to be a bit different. The only pure sandbox mmo I can think of is secondlife. I still have an old book of Disney tickets btw Big smile

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12
Kira Jonsdottir
Jameco Industries
#51 - 2015-06-15 09:26:04 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Theme parks are places filled with content to be consumed and happiness for all people.

Eve is not such a place.

In eve you make content rather than have it spoon fed and the competitive nature creates winners and losers.


That makes absolutely no sense at all.

In a true sandbox the traditionally held concepts of winning and losing are largely meaningless, there is no set win condition and winning and losing are entirely subjective experiences that can vary considerably between people.
Falken Falcon
#52 - 2015-06-15 10:25:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Falken Falcon
Kira Jonsdottir wrote:
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Theme parks are places filled with content to be consumed and happiness for all people.

Eve is not such a place.

In eve you make content rather than have it spoon fed and the competitive nature creates winners and losers.


That makes absolutely no sense at all.

In a true sandbox the traditionally held concepts of winning and losing are largely meaningless, there is no set win condition and winning and losing are entirely subjective experiences that can vary considerably between people.
It makes sense. The win/lose depends what game are the rivals playing. In sov warfare winner is the one who stands longer, but mostly people in eve consider winning something, let's say a battle, is that you killed more isk than you lost (aka ISK war) even if you welp the fleet to kill one ship. On the other hand the other fleet might consider winning as the last ship standing. This is why the idea of 'winning' something in eve is not usually clear.

Aye, Sea Turtles
Nyxium
Dwarfers Mining Guild
#53 - 2015-06-15 20:12:35 UTC
Everything's prepared for you in a themepark MMO, all of the rides are predetermined for your fun and entertainment, all you have to do is show up and play your part and let the rollercoasters and log flume game mechanics do it all for you. If you like to be dazzled and thrilled, then fine, go for it, it's your custom they get.

In a sandbox MMO like EVE, you make your own fate.

I know which of the two I prefer, being here grants a hint of my choice.

"Enterprising asteroid's is a serious business."
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#54 - 2015-06-15 22:03:12 UTC
Webvan wrote:
DaReaper wrote:
its as close to a theme park area as eve has,
close to it... well you could say the same thing about mining then, in fact more so because it's actually a static encounter. EVE is obviously not a pure sandbox, it's an openworld mmo (more reminiscent of a simulator e.g. sandbox-simulator er or simulated-sandbox). Openworld shouldn't be confused with themepark, design mechanics tend to be a bit different. The only pure sandbox mmo I can think of is secondlife. I still have an old book of Disney tickets btw Big smile



nice. i wish i did. sigh heh

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.
Harry Forever
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#55 - 2015-06-16 20:11:55 UTC
Deimos UK wrote:
As above.

I keep seeing this reference in forum replies on various topics..

Can someone give me the idiot-friendly translation please.


Thank you


its out there in nullsec, people made a themepark with all their friends... they all go blue with eachother to assure they are not disturbed by killing NPCs, however from time to time somebody really evil from highsec jumps out there to crash their party and blast the **** out of them... this makes them really sad and thats why they keep telling everybody "leave alone our themepark, meh"

Harry Forever vs. Goonswarm
Nicolai Serkanner
Incredible.
Brave Collective
#56 - 2015-06-16 21:19:46 UTC
Three pages and nobody has mentioned it's just a roadsign Sad
Mikhem
Taxisk Unlimited
#57 - 2015-06-16 21:53:54 UTC
Immediately when I saw this thread I checked Urbandictionary.com and found this:
"In a video game, a scripted event with limited interaction, also known as a "rail shooter" sequence. "

I suppose theme park is like roller coaster ride where everyone goes the same trip on rail and sandbox game you decide what you want to do.

Sandbox game in Urbandictionary.com:
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sandbox+game

Theme park in Urbandictionary.com:
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Theme+Park

Mikhem

Link library to EVE music songs.
Hippinse
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#58 - 2015-06-16 21:54:44 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
It's a kind of insidious, "Borg-Like" Carebearism where people can't just go play games that make them happy, they need to go into games they don't like (made by companies they can't stand) and make them CONFORM. And it does not work in reverse, when I play Star Trek Online you don't get legions of people asking for 'more sandbox', you get people asking for more theme park ("When are we going to see higher level caps!!!").


The people on the reverse side don't always communicate with devs and ASK for this, I'll grant you that. They usually just take/do what they want and then deal with the consequences, if any. There is no shortage of people doing this in any game, in any genre.
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
Goonswarm Federation
#59 - 2015-06-16 22:14:40 UTC
Deimos UK wrote:
As above.

I keep seeing this reference in forum replies on various topics..

Can someone give me the idiot-friendly translation please.


Thank you

If you want a explaination.....
<-----theme park is that way.

TunDraGon is recruiting! "Also, your boobs [:o] "   CCP Eterne, 2012 "When in doubt...make a diȼk joke." Robin Williams - RIP
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