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Intergalactic Summit

 
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Public Petition to Directive Enforcement Department (DED) of CONCORD

Author
Deitra Vess
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#21 - 2015-06-08 14:49:45 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
I would like to receive a capsuleer named "Vizage" for questioning regarding one of two following crimes:

1) Assistance or executing of serial murders of Caldari and Amarr young capsuleers in their quarters that happened about 1 year ago;

and/or

2) High treason and spreading of Gallente propaganda.


How exactly is she spreading propaganda? She pointed out your killing of Gallantes to show up some serial killer. Is it also propaganda to say that I sought you out to fight you for what you did? Propaganda is one thing, pointing out a fact is another. And exactly what proof do you have to accuseher of playing any part in those killings?
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#22 - 2015-06-08 14:55:48 UTC
Pointing out at unrelated thing and twisting facts to misrepresent them is called propaganda.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Deitra Vess
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#23 - 2015-06-08 15:10:31 UTC
Unrelated, ya I fully agree, but I don't see what facts were twisted. Your perceived motivation maybe? But that's her opinion like my opinion of those events falls relatively linear to hers.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#24 - 2015-06-08 18:04:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Diana Kim
Opinion of laying facts together, yes, it can be opinion, and you can have it, although I strongly disagree with it and can show you why elsewhere.

On other hand, her actions were not to post opinion on a situations, but rather on the author (me), she has used unrelated fact just to insult me and propagate her interests that way for one of three possible reasons:
1) She was actually that murderer, who got hurt by my threats or meeting justice, or
2) She is a Caldari defector and Gallente supporter and, or
3) She had a desire to do some forum trolling.

In any way, she has shown herself unable to bring real counterargument against the proposition. Probably she already understands that she has lost.

I would like to point out on a significant distinction between an opinion and a personal attack. And as thus I'd recommend to avoid arguments with peoples like Vizage.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Deitra Vess
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#25 - 2015-06-08 18:11:05 UTC
Hmm, ya I see your point. My bad...
Rinai Vero
Blades of Liberty
#26 - 2015-06-08 18:20:20 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
And as thus I'd recommend to avoid arguments with peoples like.... myself.


Fixed.
iyammarrok
Drunken Beaver Mining
Gnawthority
#27 - 2015-06-08 18:51:33 UTC
She refuted the claim that you were not a war criminal, by showing proof, supplied by you, that you in fact are.

not a lie, not propoganda, not even proof of any form of treason...

now, treason... that would be something like calling for a terrorist organisation to be declassified as such, support of the criminal Heth, (declared as such by the CEP)

you know, that kinda stuff.

not that you've ever been interested in reality.

Not indicative of corporate policy unless otherwise stated.

Vizage
Capital Allied Industrial Distribution
#28 - 2015-06-08 19:00:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Vizage
Deitra Vess wrote:
Unrelated, ya I fully agree, but I don't see what facts were twisted. Your perceived motivation maybe? But that's her opinion like my opinion of those events falls relatively linear to hers.


Right so I'm going to take the time to reply to you Ms. Vess but this will likely be the last time I post in this specific thread, as I made a promise a while back I would never engage Ms. Kim again, and give her another soapbox to preach her vileness from.

The point Deitra is that it is very much relevant what I said. Remember, this is a warcriminal asking a judicial body to try other warcriminals.

That was the point of my post. To remind everyone of the pure hypocrisy this entire thread entails. By claiming to see her point you are essentially saying that her crimes, though equally heinous, caught on film, and proudly posted by herself less than a year ago are somehow worth overlooking. That the lives she took don't merit the same justice as the lives she demands justice for.

It is... Simply put, disgusting. That's the point.

I hope that clarifies things.

-K. Amsel

P.s. How convenient for charges against me to suddenly and quite miraculously crop up in Ms. Kim's favour the moment she has her character put into question. I will undoubtedly put in as much time as these heinous claims merit to prove my innocence. That is to say, I won't waste a single breath.
Silvox Lunae
Perkone
Caldari State
#29 - 2015-06-08 19:17:58 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
Opinion of laying facts together, yes, it can be opinion, and you can have it, although I strongly disagree with it and can show you why elsewhere.

On other hand, her actions were not to post opinion on a situations, but rather on the author (me), she has used unrelated fact just to insult me and propagate her interests that way for one of three possible reasons:
1) She was actually that murderer, who got hurt by my threats or meeting justice, or
2) She is a Caldari defector and Gallente supporter and, or
3) She had a desire to do some forum trolling.

In any way, she has shown herself unable to bring real counterargument against the proposition. Probably she already understands that she has lost.

I would like to point out on a significant distinction between an opinion and a personal attack. And as thus I'd recommend to avoid arguments with peoples like Vizage.


In light of the footage provided by Vizage Ms. Kim, do you have an explanation as to your actions? It may be prudent to separate attacks against character and violations of wartime law. If your petition includes questionable considerations of war criminal status, then the footage provided previously would implicate you in criminal status as well.
Claudia Osyn
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#30 - 2015-06-08 19:44:28 UTC
Silvox Lunae wrote:


In light of the footage provided by Vizage Ms. Kim, do you have an explanation as to your actions?

Oh, she has one..... You may regret asking for it, and it doesn't justify her actions at all except in her eyes, but she has one.

A little trust goes a long way. The less you use, the further you'll go.

Deitra Vess
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#31 - 2015-06-08 20:29:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Deitra Vess
Vizage wrote:
Deitra Vess wrote:
Unrelated, ya I fully agree, but I don't see what facts were twisted. Your perceived motivation maybe? But that's her opinion like my opinion of those events falls relatively linear to hers.


Right so I'm going to take the time to reply to you Ms. Vess but this will likely be the last time I post in this specific thread, as I made a promise a while back I would never engage Ms. Kim again, and give her another soapbox to preach her vileness from.

The point Deitra is that it is very much relevant what I said. Remember, this is a warcriminal asking a judicial body to try other warcriminals.

That was the point of my post. To remind everyone of the pure hypocrisy this entire thread entails. By claiming to see her point you are essentially saying that her crimes, though equally heinous, caught on film, and proudly posted by herself less than a year ago are somehow worth overlooking. That the lives she took don't merit the same justice as the lives she demands justice for.

It is... Simply put, disgusting. That's the point.

I hope that clarifies things.

-K. Amsel

P.s. How convenient for charges against me to suddenly and quite miraculously crop up in Ms. Kim's favour the moment she has her character put into question. I will undoubtedly put in as much time as these heinous claims merit to prove my innocence. That is to say, I won't waste a single breath.


Really I see your point too. I see why she took offense, don't really understand how she couldn't see such things being brought up, and well, knowing her general logic see how she would instantly try to turn the tables on this "personal attack." You don't have to be clairvoyant to see it coming a km away. I see how almost laughable someone looks to call someone else's hands dirty when they can't even take the time to wash the blood off their own. The message is nice when you get down to it, fighting war crimes, the mouth piece, not so much.

Do I feel anything she did in that video was right? If I did then unless I'm mistaken why am I the only one to at least attempt to attack her for it? It didn't end well for me but at least I did something.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#32 - 2015-06-08 20:43:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Diana Kim
Silvox Lunae wrote:
In light of the footage provided by Vizage Ms. Kim, do you have an explanation as to your actions? It may be prudent to separate attacks against character and violations of wartime law. If your petition includes questionable considerations of war criminal status, then the footage provided previously would implicate you in criminal status as well.


Of course I have. Execution was performed according to Caldari law over those, who were found guilty by jury of tribunal. And in the future I'd ask to not pay attention to trolls, who pull out things they don't understand just to spread their groundless insults.

Killing is my profession, and I am really shouldn't answer to such questions if someone might pull also any of public record kills and make false claims I did it not according to the law or order, in their futile attempts to counter my words.

Such claims are unrelated to this petition, just as Vizage's insults. I hope I have answered everything and I hope we won't return to this here. For future information please send me mail.

Also I would like to note, even if I don't have desire to bring real arguments against any of these trolls attacks, I leave for myself right to answer them to tell them to shut up or to say what I think about them.

Thanks.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Rinai Vero
Blades of Liberty
#33 - 2015-06-08 20:47:43 UTC
Who was on the tribunal?
Silvox Lunae
Perkone
Caldari State
#34 - 2015-06-08 20:52:04 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
Silvox Lunae wrote:
In light of the footage provided by Vizage Ms. Kim, do you have an explanation as to your actions? It may be prudent to separate attacks against character and violations of wartime law. If your petition includes questionable considerations of war criminal status, then the footage provided previously would implicate you in criminal status as well.


Of course I have. Execution was performed according to Caldari law over those, who were found guilty by jury of tribunal. And in the future I'd ask to not pay attention to trolls, who pull out things they don't understand just to spread their groundless insults.

Killing is my profession, and I am really shouldn't answer to such questions if someone might pull also any of public record kills and make false claims I did it not according to the law or order, in their futile attempts to counter my words.

Such claims are unrelated to this petition, just as Vizage's insults. I hope I have answered everything and I hope we won't return to this here. For future information please send me mail.

Also I would like to note, even if I don't have desire to bring real arguments against any of these trolls attacks, I leave for myself right to answer them to tell them to shut up or to say what I think about them.

Thanks.


Who presided over this tribunal? I only ask as the claims brought up by Vizage are far from 'groundless' as the original topic of your petition called for the identification and trial of suspected war criminals. If your execution was not carried out by State sanctioned jurors through the proper avenues of authority, then possible war crimes may have been committed.

Regardless of whether or not killing is your profession, you have claimed to be a loyal citizen and soldier of the State. For that to be true, you must be beholden to the same laws and policies of the State. The attempt to counter your original argument is a separate matter irrelevant to the primary goal of your petition to pursue war criminals.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#35 - 2015-06-08 20:53:16 UTC
Vizage wrote:

saying that her crimes

I would like to point out on obvious lies in Vizage's words, as footage she has posted contains no crimes from my side.

I hope now you can see, that she is a simply disgusting liar.

My request for capturing her for questioning to find out where she is that serial murdeder, or defector, or traitor, still stands.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#36 - 2015-06-08 20:57:11 UTC
Silvox Lunae wrote:

Who presided over this tribunal? I only ask as the claims brought up by Vizage are far from 'groundless' as the original topic of your petition called for the identification and trial of suspected war criminals. If your execution was not carried out by State sanctioned jurors through the proper avenues of authority, then possible war crimes may have been committed.

Regardless of whether or not killing is your profession, you have claimed to be a loyal citizen and soldier of the State. For that to be true, you must be beholden to the same laws and policies of the State. The attempt to counter your original argument is a separate matter irrelevant to the primary goal of your petition to pursue war criminals.

I will answer one last time regarding Vizage's lies, and further questioning here disregarding my request to discuss it elsewhere, I will consider as a trolling attempt and gallente propaganda.

Three available high-ranked officers of baseline crew presided over the tribunal. They were varied for different cases, I wasn't present there myself. Proceedings can be extracted from the archive upon proper request.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Rinai Vero
Blades of Liberty
#37 - 2015-06-08 21:06:00 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
Proceedings can be extracted from the archive upon proper request.


Ah, so you'll tell us but first we have to submit the proper paperwork eh? Typical.

What amuses me is that if we applied Kim's logic to the problem of the detention facilities in Black Rise the only Gallente sin would be not properly documenting our mass killings.

How about this, by the power vested in moi as a Gallente loyalist Capsuleer with no official Federation government authority whatsoever... I hereby declare all Caldari detainees currently being held in Black Rise facilities GUILTY. Sentence to be carried out with due expedience by Black Eagles personnel I, again... have no authority over or official affiliation with whatsoever.

Oh, and I got three of my baseline crew to sign off. We're good.
Steffanie Saissore
Tyrathlion Interstellar
#38 - 2015-06-08 21:26:25 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
I would like to receive a capsuleer named "Vizage" for questioning regarding one of two following crimes:

1) Assistance or executing of serial murders of Caldari and Amarr young capsuleers in their quarters that happened about 1 year ago;

and/or

2) High treason and spreading of Gallente propaganda.


This is so highly amusing and sad at the same time.

We travel in the dark of the new moon,

A starry highway traced on the map of the sky

Claudia Osyn
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#39 - 2015-06-08 21:59:03 UTC
Rinai Vero wrote:
Diana Kim wrote:
Proceedings can be extracted from the archive upon proper request.


Ah, so you'll tell us but first we have to submit the proper paperwork eh? Typical.

What amuses me is that if we applied Kim's logic to the problem of the detention facilities in Black Rise the only Gallente sin would be not properly documenting our mass killings.

How about this, by the power vested in moi as a Gallente loyalist Capsuleer with no official Federation government authority whatsoever... I hereby declare all Caldari detainees currently being held in Black Rise facilities GUILTY. Sentence to be carried out with due expedience by Black Eagles personnel I, again... have no authority over or official affiliation with whatsoever.

Oh, and I got three of my baseline crew to sign off. We're good.

If that isn't enough I could get some of my crew to sign off on it too. I mean, it's not like anyone here selects their crews based political affiliation in addition to skill.....

A little trust goes a long way. The less you use, the further you'll go.

iyammarrok
Drunken Beaver Mining
Gnawthority
#40 - 2015-06-08 23:48:04 UTC
so... now she's implicating a lot of baseline crew in her war crimes too.
not only that, but the pilot and crew of the wyvern too

this also doesn't mesh with her repeated claims that she does not take federal prisoners and instead shoots all escape pods.

so, one of them has to be a lie, and if this one is documented, i guess the latter must be the lie.
so why hide the fact that you actually do take prisoners by claiming you shoot every escape pod?

hmmmm.

gotta love it when people trip themselves up.

Not indicative of corporate policy unless otherwise stated.