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Frustration handling orders

Author
Aristocrate Kondur
DD Starship Ltd
#1 - 2015-05-19 23:13:40 UTC
Hi There,
I am a very intense marketeer in EVE, but gettin frustrated about the following: I change my market prices over 200 times a day. When i post an order well below regional average, i get a reminder if that's good.... So far no problem... But when i make an error in stating a buying-order (a comma) or a selling order (same thing), no warning whatsoever. I lost 600 mil because i thought selling cruisers but was a line false and i sold battlecruisers. Today i sold a vexor for 106 mil but it had to be 10,6 mil, no warning for such an order. I hate that and it makes me each time more careful to hit enter. In fact my market activities diminish because i won't want to take the risk of mistaken orders (i lower my market-mutations to a level which can be double-checked cause otherwise it's useless to participate in that market)

Ari
Aristocrate Kondur
DD Starship Ltd
#2 - 2015-05-19 23:37:14 UTC
Aristocrate Kondur wrote:
Hi There,
I am a very intense marketeer in EVE, but gettin frustrated about the following: I change my market prices over 200 times a day. When i post an order well below regional average, i get a reminder if that's good.... So far no problem... But when i make an error in stating a buying-order (a comma) or a selling order (same thing), no warning whatsoever. I lost 600 mil because i thought selling cruisers but was a line false and i sold battlecruisers. Today i sold a vexor for 106 mil but it had to be 10,6 mil, no warning for such an order. I hate that and it makes me each time more careful to hit enter. In fact my market activities diminish because i won't want to take the risk of mistaken orders (i lower my market-mutations to a level which can be double-checked cause otherwise it's useless to participate in that market)

Ari


So my point is: Stop giving warnings whatsoever (in the spirit of EVE no rules when not explicitely needed) OR be consequent and warn also for potential loss in all market-orders.
Cista2
EVE Museum
#3 - 2015-05-19 23:40:04 UTC
Supported.
Adjusting existing orders goes so smoothly with the different warnings in place - then not having it when launching on order... it must be like that simply to drive us bonkers.

Another pet subject of mine is the colors of the percentage deviations of the mean market value, something I use A LOT to avoid errors as well. When you adjust an order it glows red when you make an adjustment that is bad for yourself, green when it is advantageous to yourself (selling over average, buying under average).

The color will change when you add or remove digits. This works for adjusting buy order, adjusting sell order, and launching a sell order.
However, when launching a buy order, the colors are opposite! Green color is disadvantageous for you (way above average price), red color is what you want (buying below average price). WTF! grrrrrr

My channel: "Signatures" -

Kaea Astridsson
Hoplite Brigade
Ushra'Khan
#4 - 2015-05-19 23:40:06 UTC
Erm, I get warnings on buy orders also. "Your Buy Order is 66% Below Regional Average" or something like that.

Get on Comms, or die typing.

Aristocrate Kondur
DD Starship Ltd
#5 - 2015-05-19 23:49:39 UTC
Kaea Astridsson wrote:
Erm, I get warnings on buy orders also. "Your Buy Order is 66% Below Regional Average" or something like that.


Yep, but you won't get a warning when you mistakenly put a buy order which is 66% over regional average and you'll be surprised how fast such a mistake is used, In my example of battlecruisers i lost 600 mil in 19 seconds...
Aristocrate Kondur
DD Starship Ltd
#6 - 2015-05-19 23:59:20 UTC
Cista2 wrote:
Supported.
Adjusting existing orders goes so smoothly with the different warnings in place - then not having it when launching on order... it must be like that simply to drive us bonkers.

Another pet subject of mine is the colors of the percentage deviations of the mean market value, something I use A LOT to avoid errors as well. When you adjust an order it glows red when you make an adjustment that is bad for yourself, green when it is advantageous to yourself (selling over average, buying under average).

The color will change when you add or remove digits. This works for adjusting buy order, adjusting sell order, and launching a sell order.
However, when launching a buy order, the colors are opposite! Green color is disadvantageous for you (way above average price), red color is what you want (buying below average price). WTF! grrrrrr


I totally agree, there is no consequent use... so stop it at all or implement it in all market-actions in a consequent way.
Aristocrate Kondur
DD Starship Ltd
#7 - 2015-05-20 00:32:28 UTC
I noticed actually:

I am for now probably done with this game after almost 2 years of playing (more than half with 2 accounts) Cause i hate to lose days of work in an instant without any warning. I'll rather blow my isk away in a big fight then loosing it because of ****** game mechanics

So bye
Charlie Nonoke
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
#8 - 2015-05-20 01:31:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Charlie Nonoke
Ok... Obligatory, Stuff, can i haz?

But stop blaming anyone else but yourself. You made the mistake, HTFU.
It doesn't hurt to double check your figures before you hit OK.
There is no mandatory "warning" box for anything you do in life, let alone a game.

You got comfortable, and people make mistakes when they're comfortable. A way to weed out the weak I guess. But sleep on it, and you'll be back in no time.

I once sold 3 Paladins for 100m each, instead of 1b each, so laugh it off, and recoup the losses.
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#9 - 2015-05-20 02:07:24 UTC
Aristocrate Kondur wrote:
I noticed actually:

I am for now probably done with this game after almost 2 years of playing (more than half with 2 accounts) Cause i hate to lose days of work in an instant without any warning. I'll rather blow my isk away in a big fight then loosing it because of ****** game mechanics

So bye


If you are going to throw a tantrum over a small loss (and if you are a 'very intense marketeer' 600m is trivial), then I don't think EVE is a game suited for you at all.

I say this despite agreeing with your suggestion.

Overall it balances out - I'm about neutral, maybe slightly up, from market errors in my favor and market errors that hurt me.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com

Aldur Saken
Doomheim
#10 - 2015-05-20 06:48:20 UTC
Yeah i've had this happen to me before, normally I catch them before It's accepted But a few have slipped the net. Apart from just checking carefully, which I can understand might be difficult with 200 orders I don't see what else u can do
HeXxploiT
Doomheim
#11 - 2015-05-20 07:08:26 UTC
I can't disagree with the OP. Wait until this happens at 5 or 10bil. Big smile

The single most important effective deterrent I have implemented in my own system that has almost certainly saved my ass as well as my wallet on many occasions is
GankYou
9B30FF Labs
#12 - 2015-05-20 11:30:10 UTC  |  Edited by: GankYou
Aristocrate Kondur wrote:
I noticed actually:

I am for now probably done with this game after almost 2 years of playing (more than half with 2 accounts) Cause i hate to lose days of work in an instant without any warning. I'll rather blow my isk away in a big fight then loosing it because of ****** game mechanics

So bye


Don't be mad.

If it makes you feel better, I once sold 3x Abaddon Tash-Murkon Edition hulls for 440k ISK each. Cool

Charlie Nonoke wrote:

I once sold 3 Paladins for 100m each, instead of 1b each.


Wooo, look at that - we have a tough one here. v0v
RAW23
#13 - 2015-05-21 11:28:00 UTC
Charlie Nonoke wrote:
Ok... Obligatory, Stuff, can i haz?

But stop blaming anyone else but yourself. You made the mistake, HTFU.
It doesn't hurt to double check your figures before you hit OK.
There is no mandatory "warning" box for anything you do in life, let alone a game.

You got comfortable, and people make mistakes when they're comfortable. A way to weed out the weak I guess. But sleep on it, and you'll be back in no time.

I once sold 3 Paladins for 100m each, instead of 1b each, so laugh it off, and recoup the losses.


This is a pretty tiresome example of the kind of cliched posting that bedevils this game. Someone points out that a game mechanic is legitimately broken (it is and has been for 8 years now; CCP acknowledges this and refunds the consequences of the broken mechanics when other players aren't involved, i.e. fees) and your response is HTFU. It's not big, tough or clever to pretend that crappy implementation of the game design is a feature rather than a bug. Yes, people should be careful. However, the game should also work properly and comments such as those in the OP raising genuine issues contribute far more towards eventually improving things than does the kind of slavish acceptance that you are pushing (while also trying to be edgy).

There are two types of EVE player:

those who believe there are two types of EVE player and those who do not.

GankYou
9B30FF Labs
#14 - 2015-05-21 13:28:33 UTC  |  Edited by: GankYou
No argument that is is somewhat broken. How should we go about fixing it - would that be an additional Yes/No prompt for every single transaction that you undertake on the market? Would such a warning be optional? Smile

Funny thing is that most of these "Sold plex for 610k" happen after the seller hits OK on the low regional average price warning. Blink

What is the threshold currently to get such a warning - 30, 50% deviation?
GankYou
9B30FF Labs
#15 - 2015-05-22 11:13:22 UTC
Any suggestions how to improve the system then?

"Warning: your selected market price exceeds the regional average by 1204000%, Do you like to continue with the order?"

What was I purchasing? Why, the Thukker Large Shield Extenders for 35 mil of course. Pirate
Cista2
EVE Museum
#16 - 2015-05-22 11:23:37 UTC
GankYou wrote:
Any suggestions how to improve the system then?

The same warnings as when adjusting orders would work excellent imo.

My channel: "Signatures" -

Shakuul
Infinitus Sapientia
#17 - 2015-05-22 15:05:36 UTC
Since cache scraping is permitted, is there a way to flag the fact that you had an order window open and flash warnings before you pressed enter? Going a step further, would it be EULA permissible to have a program that intercepts the enter key press until you address the warming? I think the answer is yes, since the program doesn't actually cause any behavior in the EVE client (rather it prevents behavior).

As far as in game improvements, I would have several options:
- Threshold % (set by you) that will trigger a warning on any type of order modification
- Checklist to enable/disable all warnings, by order type (buy, sell, modify, etc)
- Option to disable warnings for specific items
TheSmokingHertog
Julia's Interstellar Trade Emperium
#18 - 2015-05-22 15:11:05 UTC
At EVE amsterdam and Fanfest 2014 / 2015 I brought this up... no joy jet.

My solution; If there is a market value difference on the product you are selling, be able to set the warning on a threshold (100mil, 1bil, etc)... It would be best to do this on a product basis. But if that is to difficult to implement an overall solution could work too.

"Dogma is kind of like quantum physics, observing the dogma state will change it." ~ CCP Prism X

"Schrödinger's Missile. I dig it." ~ Makari Aeron

-= "Brain in a Box on Singularity" - April 2015 =-

Fornost Fornostsen
Global Isk Network
Pen Is Out
#19 - 2015-05-25 11:18:58 UTC
Marmket mistakes are annoying, but they tend to balance in the long period.

The best solution I read is to make you're order AT LEAST match the higher buy order/the lower sell order that is active in you station.

Example:
You are selling a Paladin and you mistype 100.000.000 instead of 1.000.000.000.
In your station the higher buy order is 900.000.000.
You're Paladin is automatically sold for 900M.

You probably are losing your expected margin, but at least not 90% of item value.


Makhpella
Bad Taste.
#20 - 2015-05-25 16:47:52 UTC
there was always warning which they finaly fixed like month or two ago so when you spam enter it wont sell for the unusual price

before the fix I managed to sell 7 vindicators for 700k ISK
then I wrote Evemail to those guys(5 or 6), only one replied and sent me 50m so it is rare to meet a decent man these days
greedy f**kers everywhere, watch out
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