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How to fly a Marauder safely
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Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#41 - 2015-05-13 22:12:20 UTC
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Dante Burke wrote:
Anything one flies, by EVE's nature, is gank bait. If you're in high-sec, then there's a few things I'd keep in mind if you're banging out L4's.

Keep that safety set to Green. This will keep you from accidentally shooting some poor sod, and thus making CONCORD cranky.

If there's a ninja looter, or someone blaps your MTU, don't attack. Let them have that global flag. 9 (or more) times out of 10, people running missions who get ganked, seem to do so because they engaged someone who had some form of global/criminal status. There's a reason they're in a crappy frig and stealing your loot. Trade that 1M ISK ship for the however many hundreds of millions of yours (due to kill rights).

As long as you're in high-sec, and you don't engage anyone/get yourself flagged, then the only real way to get ganked (barring any kind of war dec/FW), is via suicide Tornado's (or whatever the flavor happens to be). Keeping to less populated areas will greatly mitigate this.


misconception correction time.
A suspect who's humping your mtu is usually flying something worth between 11 and 50 million isk, depending and the whatnot.
If you engage them they cannot call in their superfriends to roflstomp you, but they can bring in neutral logi to help.
The moment neutral logi does help them, the logi goes suspect as well and becomes a valid target for destruction.
Suspect baiting does not generate killrights.
It's not a gank if you open fire on them and they kill you in response... it's holy pee vee pee. Depending on the ship they are flying and what you have fit they may be unable to break your tank, that's a risk that's up to you to decide whether or not to take.
If you have a working batphone then you can call buddies in to blap a flipper who's messing with you as well.


If the mission Marauder does not have a point, nothing is stopping him from reshipping and coming back in something that can break the tank. Oh, and still call in neutral logi.
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#42 - 2015-05-14 04:13:48 UTC
Fair enough. However said marauder can warp off to parts unknown until the limited engagement ends if the flipper tries to reship elsewhere.

Neutral logi stops being neutral the moment it reps someone who is suspect, or I believe also when they do so for someone in a limited engagement, but not 100% on that last bit. If they bring a friend, holler to one of yours... their suspect logi will be delicious when served with grilled onions and mushrooms.

Either way, it's actually much easier for the mission runner to call for help and get it than the flipper. Well, easier assuming that they have friends or that anyone is actually paying attention to local. A suspect has a harder time adding pilots on his end of the engagement, as his dance partner must consent to anyone else who wants to play.

Ultimately it's a judgment call. If you have a working Batphone with some hungry pvp-curious bears on the line... then shoot. Odds are good that the baiter will be so busy dry humping your tank to notice the super friends before they land on grid.

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#43 - 2015-05-14 05:33:28 UTC
Quote:
If there's a ninja looter, or someone blaps your MTU, don't attack. Let them have that global flag. 9 (or more) times out of 10, people running missions who get ganked, seem to do so because they engaged someone who had some form of global/criminal status. There's a reason they're in a crappy frig and stealing your loot. Trade that 1M ISK ship for the however many hundreds of millions of yours (due to kill rights).


Thats not ganking in the video game sense of the word. Its just not understanding mechanics and paying a very high price for ignorance.

Ironically, it IS ganking in the original Eazy-E sense of the word.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it
Tarojan
Tarojan Corporation
#44 - 2015-05-19 14:28:24 UTC
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Fair enough. However said marauder can warp off to parts unknown until the limited engagement ends if the flipper tries to reship elsewhere.

Neutral logi stops being neutral the moment it reps someone who is suspect, or I believe also when they do so for someone in a limited engagement, but not 100% on that last bit. If they bring a friend, holler to one of yours... their suspect logi will be delicious when served with grilled onions and mushrooms.

Either way, it's actually much easier for the mission runner to call for help and get it than the flipper. Well, easier assuming that they have friends or that anyone is actually paying attention to local. A suspect has a harder time adding pilots on his end of the engagement, as his dance partner must consent to anyone else who wants to play.

Ultimately it's a judgment call. If you have a working Batphone with some hungry pvp-curious bears on the line... then shoot. Odds are good that the baiter will be so busy dry humping your tank to notice the super friends before they land on grid.



You sound like your talking from experience of being bat phoned on :P. Tbh though this is EVE... most highsec pvers play solo cos the biggest threat to a mission runner isn't a can flipper its a war dec which is why your not safe to fly in a pve corp in highsec.

Will gank for food
Ruvin
Amarr Empire
#45 - 2015-05-19 15:11:00 UTC
Rena Monachica wrote:
A Centum C-Type Medium Rep is currently at 50 million ISK ... that should be pocket money for marauder pilots



medium , really ?

Opportunities multiply as they are seized.
StupidMonkeyBeSpankinIt
Illicit Expo
#46 - 2015-05-19 15:20:32 UTC
Dato Koppla wrote:
Fit a smartbomb to deal with close range tackle frigs so that you won't be pointed when out of bastion mode.


And a heavy neut... just in case. I happen to have finally got two of my characters into vargurs... and they are great! I do not regret waiting for them and even though they are not fully trained to fly, they are hella powerful and fun to fly.

I fit mine to dps tank with tc's and tp's and a hefty shield tank, jsut a gist tyep c x lrg booster with a couple invuls... I like to fly cheap... so t2 the rest of the way, or some meta variant for specific reasons.

Have you tried the new micro jump drives? they are great!!!

Hint: hit and run, hit and run... :P
unidenify
Deaf Armada
#47 - 2015-05-19 17:22:52 UTC
Dato Koppla wrote:
Okay I feel bad, the smartbomb bit was a troll. NEVER fit a smartbomb in your utility highslot for a highsec missioning ship of any kind. Even though you can light it in relative safety in mission pockets, if someone scans you down and sees the smartbomb effect go off, they will bring an alt in a cheap ship and suicide it into your smartbomb causing you to get Concordokken'd.


don't feel bad. I saw one fit in mission channel where someone fly Krono with 2 smartbomb, and said he use it to kill frigate
we have to explain 5 time to him why it is bad idea, to have him accused me and other to be neckbeard virgin who live in mom basement.

make me want to hunt him down and use cloaked frigate to get closer to him to have him get concorded
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#48 - 2015-05-19 18:01:23 UTC
Ruvin wrote:
Rena Monachica wrote:
A Centum C-Type Medium Rep is currently at 50 million ISK ... that should be pocket money for marauder pilots



medium , really ?

with the 100% rep bonus from bastion, really! It reps about the same as a large t2 rep (out of bastion), and has a 9s cycle time (vs 11.25 for t2) and uses less cap. So when you DC in bastion and don't warp off, a medium rep will keep going and not suck your cap dry meaning you will probably live. where a large will be pulse tanked, and either off where you die to any incoming dps unless you get back in real quick, or it sucks your cap dry and you still die. or you fit way too many cap mods to keep it running all the time, and reduce your efficiency.

in bastion mode a C-type med rep with one less EANM tanks more than my old fit with a LAR and no bastion.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#49 - 2015-05-19 18:03:50 UTC
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Fair enough. However said marauder can warp off to parts unknown until the limited engagement ends if the flipper tries to reship elsewhere.


funny to think how many people don't even bother to do that...

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#50 - 2015-05-19 19:53:14 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Fair enough. However said marauder can warp off to parts unknown until the limited engagement ends if the flipper tries to reship elsewhere.


funny to think how many people don't even bother to do that...


^^^ This! I guess most players think, "I drove him off! He won't be back for quite some time."
Ruvin
Amarr Empire
#51 - 2015-05-20 10:18:25 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Ruvin wrote:
Rena Monachica wrote:
A Centum C-Type Medium Rep is currently at 50 million ISK ... that should be pocket money for marauder pilots



medium , really ?

with the 100% rep bonus from bastion, really! It reps about the same as a large t2 rep (out of bastion), and has a 9s cycle time (vs 11.25 for t2) and uses less cap. So when you DC in bastion and don't warp off, a medium rep will keep going and not suck your cap dry meaning you will probably live. where a large will be pulse tanked, and either off where you die to any incoming dps unless you get back in real quick, or it sucks your cap dry and you still die. or you fit way too many cap mods to keep it running all the time, and reduce your efficiency.

in bastion mode a C-type med rep with one less EANM tanks more than my old fit with a LAR and no bastion.


sorry i didnt really understood , your saying a large one will get you killed either way ?

Opportunities multiply as they are seized.
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#52 - 2015-05-20 13:30:43 UTC
Ruvin wrote:
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Ruvin wrote:
Rena Monachica wrote:
A Centum C-Type Medium Rep is currently at 50 million ISK ... that should be pocket money for marauder pilots



medium , really ?

with the 100% rep bonus from bastion, really! It reps about the same as a large t2 rep (out of bastion), and has a 9s cycle time (vs 11.25 for t2) and uses less cap. So when you DC in bastion and don't warp off, a medium rep will keep going and not suck your cap dry meaning you will probably live. where a large will be pulse tanked, and either off where you die to any incoming dps unless you get back in real quick, or it sucks your cap dry and you still die. or you fit way too many cap mods to keep it running all the time, and reduce your efficiency.

in bastion mode a C-type med rep with one less EANM tanks more than my old fit with a LAR and no bastion.


sorry i didnt really understood , your saying a large one will get you killed either way ?



No, he is saying a Marauder using a med deadspace armor rep in Bastion is equal to a T2 large armor rep not in Bastion.

Even so, a Large Core-X armor rep averages for 250mil isk. Chump change really when you are putting it on a 1bil isk ship.
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#53 - 2015-05-20 14:42:16 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Fair enough. However said marauder can warp off to parts unknown until the limited engagement ends if the flipper tries to reship elsewhere.


funny to think how many people don't even bother to do that...


Most of the better baiters are bumping the ship by then with their alt. If you don't have the MJD, you're dead anyway. Can't shoot the bumping ship, can't warp and can't log out.

Most often they reship directly out of the bumping orca.

This is not their first rodeo. You lost the minute you opened fire.
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#54 - 2015-05-21 07:33:23 UTC
I have been batphoned on more than once in truth, yes. The first time was the most surprising and educational. "Ishtar? Gecko? Huh... OMG!!!! *warpwarpwarpwarp*"

As I prefer to use an assault frigate for baiting it can take a very long time to break the tank on a marauder, and if they're fit well enough I may not be able to break it at all. Same goes for many battleships to be honest.

As far as using an alt to bump the mission ship, well I'm sure that some folks do this, but I tend to use my alt for scanning and as such I'd rather keep his identity under wraps when I'm flipping. Outing him to bump someone who's trying to get away may pay off in the short run but it's bad for business in the long run. Also, I do question the practicality of trying to bump a marauder with a covops frigate.

The scenario you present is plenty feasible, it just represents someone who's willing to put a great deal more effort and ISK into something I do for fun than I'd be willing to. I just find it more practical to take the view of what you're likely to see on average rather than the extremes.

Baiters can be scary, but they are not invincible boogeymen. Keep calm, assess the situation, decide and act.

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#55 - 2015-05-21 10:13:47 UTC
The ones I've seen out in main mission hub necks of the woods use

2-4 logi as backup
OGB
Orca for bumping and reshipping
Generic "bait" ship.

They don't bump with the scanner, they bump with the orca.

Or they used to, it was a long time ago.
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#56 - 2015-05-21 10:44:35 UTC
That's a pretty sophisticated setup there. I'm not doubting you, it just strikes me that a gang like that would be after a specific target that they've already scanned to confirm the presence of shiny shiny loot. Not the kind of thing I'd expect to see drop on random Joe Runner. Most mission runners simply wont take the bait; roughly one in eight will pull the trigger I've found, and some of those warp off immediately upon realizing what they've done. (before I get into scram range at least)

To be honest I've only managed to get a few Marauders to shoot at me in the past, battleship pilots tend to be more frisky. Of the marauders I've engaged I've only managed to drop one Kronos and stalemate a Paladin. Of course I'm also bad at EVE, so mileage may vary.

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#57 - 2015-05-21 12:09:59 UTC
Tarojan wrote:
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Fair enough. However said marauder can warp off to parts unknown until the limited engagement ends if the flipper tries to reship elsewhere.

Neutral logi stops being neutral the moment it reps someone who is suspect, or I believe also when they do so for someone in a limited engagement, but not 100% on that last bit. If they bring a friend, holler to one of yours... their suspect logi will be delicious when served with grilled onions and mushrooms.

Either way, it's actually much easier for the mission runner to call for help and get it than the flipper. Well, easier assuming that they have friends or that anyone is actually paying attention to local. A suspect has a harder time adding pilots on his end of the engagement, as his dance partner must consent to anyone else who wants to play.

Ultimately it's a judgment call. If you have a working Batphone with some hungry pvp-curious bears on the line... then shoot. Odds are good that the baiter will be so busy dry humping your tank to notice the super friends before they land on grid.



You sound like your talking from experience of being bat phoned on :P. Tbh though this is EVE... most highsec pvers play solo cos the biggest threat to a mission runner isn't a can flipper its a war dec which is why your not safe to fly in a pve corp in highsec.


I mentioned the batphone thing in a previous post, yes... I've had the justice league drop in and deliver righteous punishment to me for my dastardly deeds before. It was fun. I love the fight, a killmail is nice, but just getting into a scrap is a win for me.
As far as wardecs go, that's a whole different matter. The war thing is scarier than it should be to be honest. I'm in a rather small merc alliance who specializes in war for hire, while my corporation specializes in dirty tricks and training new members in how to deal with player interaction through interpretive antimatter.

War is only as scary as you let it be. When I first started I was intimidated as all heck. I was an aging carebear who'd been lured over tot the dark side with promises of cookies and glorious explosions... and a cure to boredom. When I realized that we were ALWAYS at war I about pooped in my pod. Unthinkable. Then I noticed something... people ran away from me when I entered their system. They were scairt without even knowing just how bad I was at this game.

Last count last week we had over 140 active wars. Over 140 wars... it blew my mind. I enter system, people dock up, warp elsewhere, hide under their bunks and hug their fedos. It's baffling, because _I_ know I'm terrible, but they do not. Mindset plays a powerful role in EVE, and most pve players have this mental image of the pvp players being these monolithic juggernauts of destruction that they stand no chance against. We are the boogeymen to them. It is, of course, all in their heads.

Well fit ships flown by competent pilots fare just as well against the evil pvp guys as their ships do against the pve'ers. Often times the only difference in fits between pvp and pve are a single module or two who serve no function in missions and are excluded.... scrams, webs, neuts etc. The real difference lies in the psychology of the pilot.

I'm sure I had a point, but the beer has started to kick in. /ramble off.

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
Amanda Chan
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#58 - 2015-05-22 08:45:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Amanda Chan
Estella Osoka wrote:
Ruvin wrote:
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Ruvin wrote:
Rena Monachica wrote:
A Centum C-Type Medium Rep is currently at 50 million ISK ... that should be pocket money for marauder pilots



medium , really ?

with the 100% rep bonus from bastion, really! It reps about the same as a large t2 rep (out of bastion), and has a 9s cycle time (vs 11.25 for t2) and uses less cap. So when you DC in bastion and don't warp off, a medium rep will keep going and not suck your cap dry meaning you will probably live. where a large will be pulse tanked, and either off where you die to any incoming dps unless you get back in real quick, or it sucks your cap dry and you still die. or you fit way too many cap mods to keep it running all the time, and reduce your efficiency.

in bastion mode a C-type med rep with one less EANM tanks more than my old fit with a LAR and no bastion.


sorry i didnt really understood , your saying a large one will get you killed either way ?



No, he is saying a Marauder using a med deadspace armor rep in Bastion is equal to a T2 large armor rep not in Bastion.

Even so, a Large Core-X armor rep averages for 250mil isk. Chump change really when you are putting it on a 1bil isk ship.


You'll actually find most optimal shield fits for PvE involve medium deadspace boosters. Using Large/X-Large shield modules usually involve having to fit cap modules which take up valuable spots that you can use for apply damage better.

With a medium pith/large gist shield booster, good resists and/or a deadspace shield amp you can easily have 400+ ehp/s tank and 4+ minutes of cap without any cap modules. Which is all you really need for level 4/epic arcs, outside some butt pucker inducing missions like Showtime for the Gallente Epic arc, etc.
Tarojan
Tarojan Corporation
#59 - 2015-05-22 09:43:47 UTC
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Tarojan wrote:
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Fair enough. However said marauder can warp off to parts unknown until the limited engagement ends if the flipper tries to reship elsewhere.

Neutral logi stops being neutral the moment it reps someone who is suspect, or I believe also when they do so for someone in a limited engagement, but not 100% on that last bit. If they bring a friend, holler to one of yours... their suspect logi will be delicious when served with grilled onions and mushrooms.

Either way, it's actually much easier for the mission runner to call for help and get it than the flipper. Well, easier assuming that they have friends or that anyone is actually paying attention to local. A suspect has a harder time adding pilots on his end of the engagement, as his dance partner must consent to anyone else who wants to play.

Ultimately it's a judgment call. If you have a working Batphone with some hungry pvp-curious bears on the line... then shoot. Odds are good that the baiter will be so busy dry humping your tank to notice the super friends before they land on grid.



You sound like your talking from experience of being bat phoned on :P. Tbh though this is EVE... most highsec pvers play solo cos the biggest threat to a mission runner isn't a can flipper its a war dec which is why your not safe to fly in a pve corp in highsec.


I mentioned the batphone thing in a previous post, yes... I've had the justice league drop in and deliver righteous punishment to me for my dastardly deeds before. It was fun. I love the fight, a killmail is nice, but just getting into a scrap is a win for me.
As far as wardecs go, that's a whole different matter. The war thing is scarier than it should be to be honest. I'm in a rather small merc alliance who specializes in war for hire, while my corporation specializes in dirty tricks and training new members in how to deal with player interaction through interpretive antimatter.

War is only as scary as you let it be. When I first started I was intimidated as all heck. I was an aging carebear who'd been lured over tot the dark side with promises of cookies and glorious explosions... and a cure to boredom. When I realized that we were ALWAYS at war I about pooped in my pod. Unthinkable. Then I noticed something... people ran away from me when I entered their system. They were scairt without even knowing just how bad I was at this game.

Last count last week we had over 140 active wars. Over 140 wars... it blew my mind. I enter system, people dock up, warp elsewhere, hide under their bunks and hug their fedos. It's baffling, because _I_ know I'm terrible, but they do not. Mindset plays a powerful role in EVE, and most pve players have this mental image of the pvp players being these monolithic juggernauts of destruction that they stand no chance against. We are the boogeymen to them. It is, of course, all in their heads.

Well fit ships flown by competent pilots fare just as well against the evil pvp guys as their ships do against the pve'ers. Often times the only difference in fits between pvp and pve are a single module or two who serve no function in missions and are excluded.... scrams, webs, neuts etc. The real difference lies in the psychology of the pilot.

I'm sure I had a point, but the beer has started to kick in. /ramble off.


Yeah, but your not trying to do level 4s with a mara are you? your wandering around in a PVP FIT. Ofc war decs aren't scary for you. Of course the guys at the other end are docking up their retrievers, ravens and badgers.

"most pve players have this mental image of the pvp players being these monolithic juggernauts of destruction that they stand no chance against"? I would rephrase this in respect to myself: "I have a mental image of pvp fits being monolithic juggernauts of destruction against which my badger/missioning rokh/mining barge stand no chance against" I'm pretty sure I'm right too.

So again what it boils down too: I have no batphone and I play eve alone cos its just far to risky to let any of you lot anywhere near me with shooty rights (unless Im ganking/about to gank someone then I don't care cos Im gonna be concorded shortly anyway Twisted)

Will gank for food
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#60 - 2015-05-22 10:34:09 UTC
Fair enough. I actually can't fly marauders because of well... attention span is too short for the train, and when I run lvl 4's I've found either a raven or a SNI does the trick just fine for me without too much of an ISK investment.

Keeping an eye on local and d-scan goes a long way towards surviving war when engaging in pve activities, I can't really stress that enough. No need to duck and cover, but when someone flashy red pops into system it's time to align out. Likewise if combat probes start showing up on scan it's probably a good idea to start making yourself scarce.
The best defense in those kind of situations is the same as for surviving a gank.... simply not being there when the bads land on grid.

Of course, you already know all this Lol

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.