EVE General Discussion

o/ dear pilot!



After some time in eve-online, I like to share some thoughts.
Please feel free to share yours on this topic. We might get a descussion going

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When interacting with players or for that matter, people in game or RL, I try to get a feel for them based on their actions and not too much on words and looks.

Kind, dependable and trusthworthy players tend to behave just like:
They are kind and do interact with and talk to you with respect.
is you are in a pitch, they will support you.
If you give them access to ships and ISK, a thrustworthy player will probably not abuse your trust.


During my stay in eve-online, I am rather ... shocked by the actions of my fellow combatants in eve-online.
It seems to be highly popular to scam, gank, pod each other.
In addition, once you try to interact with players after you did end up in station (again).

"O/ . It seems you dont like new players in your system"
"O/. Please tell me how to improve"

I did recieve quite a few insults.
"Please come here more often! We like to shoot and pod you"
"Stupid noob"
...



After observing and experiencing first hand the conduct of my fellow capsule pilots here in eve, i came to a rather sad conclusion.
When meeting a pilot now, in I think

"You are just another a..hole"

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Then I started to question myself, why do pilots behave the way they do?
So after looking into the game mechanics, I did find a part of the answer:

"If you throw someone into an environment, that does support immoral conduct, he/she will most likely match their actiosn to the environment."


Now, a lot of players will say:
"But we have concord!"

And I would like to answer:
"Do we have jails in eve?"

Ganking in Jita seems to be very lucrative. With the income from the loot, you buy back standing.
And as you do fly cheap ships, no harm done if you loose them.
Assets and isk can then be transfered to your main to have "fun" somewhere else.

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Some pilots like to "play for fun" which translate as "I like to screw you over hard".
Well, this environment does allow it without panalties.
Very simmilar to **** in some contries.

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Some Q&A:

Q: Does this realy apply to the bulk of eve-online players?
A: How does the bulk of eve-online players behave?

Q: It does not matter if I screw with other players. This is a game right?
A: What is the difference if you make other players feel hurt, abused, cheated in game or RL?

Q: That surely does not apply to me!?
A: How do you behave when interacting with/ shooting at (new) players (in space)?

Q: Do I believe this post will improve the moral conduct of eve-online players?
A: No.
Why?
It is much more easy to ignore or flame here in this forum once, than change one's own moral conduct continously while playing.

Get ready for a bunch of psychotic people to justify their actions

no flamage.
violence is absolutely necessary to the economy of EVE. In order for things to not go completely haywire pilots must shoot at each other, as npcs do a pretty terrible job of causing ship/implant turnover.

that being said, it sounds like you've just had some bad experiences. That sucks, but like RL there are all kinds of people playing this game. Many pvp pilots will happily explain to you how you got exploded and will often volunteer advice on how to keep it from happening again... provided you ask in a civil manner.

Someone blowing your ship and/or pod up is not automatically a bad person. They are just playing the game within the rules set out. I personally enjoy exploding other pilots a great deal... it's a great deal more fun than shooting red plusses. When I win, yes, they lose stuff... but that's just how things go. When you undock you need to accept that you are putting your ship and your capsule at risk.

As far as scamming goes, well, if a deal seems like it's a really really good deal you ought to take a good hard look at it to determine it's legitimacy. Buyer beware and all that.

And ultimately, no, the conduct of EVE players is not going to change due to a forum post. The game content is created by the players themselves, it is the world you've entered. You have to adapt to it, as it is not going to conform to what you want it to be.

1. They aren't psychotic, mister armchair psychoanalyst.
2. Blowing up internet spaceships in a game the revolves around blowing up internet spaceships needs justification?

Time for a stroll down zkillboard lane, perhaps a little scooby doo work can unearth the source of thy butthurt.

Please refer to http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/may/12/how-virtual-world-edge-of-apocalypse-and-back-again and more precisely to this extract:



Translation: people behave like dicks in EvE because they can, without severe lasting consequences. as the game lets them project their "immoral" pulsions into virtual acts.

Plus, as Omar told you: violence, theft and overall space dickery are crucial fuels for the game to get going.

I'll address this part the most, but refer to the rest.

First, on buying back standing - this only applies to standing towards NPC empires - you can set your own standings towards a player/corporation/alliance, and this cannot be changed by anyone except you.

Second, on punishment - yes we have concord. we also have players who have guns - if you don't trust concord to police the target, become the police yourself and gather like minded pilots to hunt down those you deem "criminal".
you have the freedom to do anything you wish. This includes breaking the "law" or defending it. Or even deciding it, out in null sec.



Now to address your "Q&A".

1) Does it apply to most EVE players? Probably not. Tarring everyone with the same brush in generalising at best, and bleakly insultingly assumptive at worst.
Most EVE players, in my experience, tend to be decent human beings. Sometimes they like to make other human beings explode within a virtual world, which makes those other human beings sad. Those other human beings are usually quite capable of coming back and making the first group of human beings explode too (in a virtual world).
But in EVE (and in chat) the majority will be kind. The ones who aren't are either joking with you (seriously, let it go, there are worse people in this world), or aren't worth bothering with in the first place (see my first point, because seriously, why are you taking this so seriously?).

2) As for Game vs RL, the difference is in RL it has far further reaching consequences in reality. People can be sent to prison, or otherwise punished for breaking the law - and murder is illegal.
EVE, on the other hand, is a virtual world - to whit, a game. It is a fantasy, an abstraction, and glorious wonderful escapism.
If you're allowing it to affect you that much, then you are taking it far too seriously, and far too much to heart.
It is a virtual world - if you die in the game do you die in reality? This is not the matrix. At most it is annoying.
Anyone who equivocates death and loss in EVE with, say the sheer heartbreak of losing a family member, is A: far too dramatic for their own good, and B: potentially in need of suitable mental support from real world professionals.
Seriously, it's not that big a deal!

3) Yes it applies to everyone. Including you. You seem to be implying the majority of EVE players are deplorable human being in the real world, as well as in game, which is a horrifically insulting generalisation to begin with (this small amount of people were bad to me, thus all people in this group will be bad to me). Go join Red vs Blue or EVE Uni, and you'll find most (but perhaps not all) will be reasonably kind to you. And seriously, stop generalising. In general it tends to be wrong.

4) Everyone is playing their own game, and if you demand they conform to your worldview then you're not really much better than they are. EVE is about freedom as much as anything else, and if you were to force them to follow your worldview (~in a game~) then you would essentially be yet another tinpot dictator, with delusions of heroism.

The best you can do is set an example, and hope others follow you - cheer on those that do, and feel bad for those that don't.

As far as EVE is concerned, your actions in game/here on the forums define who your EVE persona is, and how you will be known in game. They form your reputation, and create a history that will follow you through your EVE career, unless you make a new character, or trade characters with another.

But does this define who you are in reality?
Are you a mass murderer?
Do you snark at everyone in sight, and treat them poorly?
Are you a thief?
A spy?

In game, most anyone who has anything to do with combat is the first of these - players slaughter countless NPCs and players on a daily basis. And that's just the ships, never mind the crews.
Is this actually an accurate reflection of who you are as a real human being?

I think not.

Your actions and how you treat other people (like me should you choose to respond) will be a reflection of who you are as your character in this game. If you choose to be as alike as possible to your real self, then that is up to you. But that reputation, and attitude towards something which is (no matter how brilliant) a game, will follow you.


My advice would be to take this game with a degree of salt, some cynicism, and a sense of humour to laugh at things, both good and bad. Otherwise you will waste time worrying about things that are not so big of a deal - you are to have fun, find a group of people you like, and get to it!

Morals!

Sheesh! Now I will go buy thousand slaves, drop them into a can into space and blow it up!

There ... thousand lives evaporated with a single press of a button and don't forget
the tens of thousands of people I deliberately throw into CONCORD's fire!

This threads smells of onesidedness. The worse players are those you blow up
and then start a gigantic hate and ragefest against you for touching their egos !

The people with the issues are those who identify with their virtual characters,
not those who don't and blow you up!

Is there some kind of Ten Commandments in EVE? Post them here.

WHAT??? Some people play this spaceship game FOR FUN??? And they are not punished for it???

This is outrageous! Wait here for a minute I will get my pitchfork and the torch! This will be the last time someone had fun in a computer game!! WE CAN'T ALLOW THIS!! NERF THE FUN!!

Hint: What is just and what is not?