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WoW refugees and the future of EVE

Author
Alpheias
The Khaleph
#241 - 2015-05-06 20:56:52 UTC
Lina Sovereign wrote:
WoW is the best PvE RP game, you can't deny it, lore & raids are awesome.
Now EvE's a sandbox where players are writing their own story, goals are very different, and it's useless to compare them.

That said, we are not better because we play at EvE, we just like this kind of game, that's all.


The only thing about WoW that is undeniable up to this point, is that WoW is the most successful western themepark-MMO in the west when you look at the number of subscriptions (which pales in comparison to some of the long running Asian MMOs).

Everything else is subjective.

I'd argue that I am better than a WoW player because I have yet to meet a WoW player that cannot play the game (raids and whatnot) without mods.

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.

Lupe Meza
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#242 - 2015-05-06 21:15:18 UTC
Lina Sovereign wrote:
WoW is the best PvE RP game, you can't deny it, lore & raids are awesome.
Now EvE's a sandbox where players are writing their own story, goals are very different, and it's useless to compare them.

That said, we are not better because we play at EvE, we just like this kind of game, that's all.


Pretty much. But the chest beating is pretty entertaining.

Both games excel at what they set out to do and there is good reason why WoW is a metric by which all MMO's are measured. I did my 3 years, eventually lost interest. But I'm not going to pretend I didn't enjoy it while I played it like some type of videogame hipster.

I had fun, until I didn't, and eventually moved on. Not because of any fault of the game, my priorities have shifted priorities and I could no longer reconcile devoting so much freetime to the never ending gear grind and arena seasons. I just can't be bothered to progress in something to have it wiped away and then start again. The journey was enjoyable to be sure, but I just couldn't keep doing it, no longer having that kind of time.

EVE is the only MMO I'm actively playing solely because of it's design. Depending on the amount of time I have I have a bunch of things I can log on and do and barring dying in a ball of flame my "progression" will be there a day, a week, or a month later. My characters advance without me having to actively do things like "leveling". Not that there is anything wrong with games that use this system, but I tend to be left in the dust. I used to be a hardcore gamer but as I got older, not necessarily from desire but from a lack of time and shifting priorities, I've become more and more casual.

While that is a dirty word to many that play EVE as if you are not playing 23 hours a day with a bucket next you, you're doing it wrong; it is that complicated, obscure, and sometimes convoluted game mechanics aside this game is actually very casual friendly in it's design. There is no endgame content to get. A level 5 skill will be a level 5 skill forever; no need to prepare for the level 6 skills next patch. A player in the blingiest ship will still die in a ball of fire to a ship that costs a couple of million, unlike some level 80(or whatever the cap is now in WoW) decked out in the best PVP gear. You can go where you want, when you want, from Day 1 in EVE.

It's just a totally different experience from most MMO's. I'm not going to say it is better or worse intrinsically "because it is EVE and so difficult etc." because difficulty doesn't make a game good in and of itself.

While it can and does need improvements, EVE is not perfect, fears of it turning into "WoW" are overreactions. There is plenty of room for changes to EVE that improve the appeal and experience without the game losing its identity. Improving balance and accessibility aren't negative in and of themselves and crucial parts of any game. The game is 12 years old. If it is going to be around another 12 it will need to "adapt or die"; but I doubt it will ever get the SWG treatment and abandon its core.
Joe Atei
Aes Dei Asher
#243 - 2015-05-06 22:20:06 UTC
Alpheias wrote:
Lina Sovereign wrote:
WoW is the best PvE RP game, you can't deny it, lore & raids are awesome.
Now EvE's a sandbox where players are writing their own story, goals are very different, and it's useless to compare them.

That said, we are not better because we play at EvE, we just like this kind of game, that's all.


The only thing about WoW that is undeniable up to this point, is that WoW is the most successful western themepark-MMO in the west when you look at the number of subscriptions (which pales in comparison to some of the long running Asian MMOs).

Everything else is subjective.

I'd argue that I am better than a WoW player because I have yet to meet a WoW player that cannot play the game (raids and whatnot) without mods.


You know what, that was always something that bugged me about the community. Hell, after the first expansion I was basically left for dead in the raid scene because I didn't want to download grid or whatever that horrible ui mod was. I will admit, towards the end of my time in WoW, I did use archud, the original one, because it allowed me to tunnel vision and know my resources at all time. Was quite the advantage.
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#244 - 2015-05-06 22:37:31 UTC
Alpheias wrote:

I'd argue that I am better than a WoW player because I have yet to meet a WoW player that cannot play the game (raids and whatnot) without mods.

I'd say that's more indicative of WoW having a really ****** stock UI (which almost everyone can agree it does) than anything having to do with the players.
Unless something has changed a lot in the few years since I played WoW, raiding without mods would be a lot like playing Eve without the overview. Is it doable? Absolutely. Does anyone actually want to? Maybe only the most masochistic among us.
Jenshae Chiroptera
#245 - 2015-05-06 23:11:15 UTC
I do so love how the same people bring the same topics, with rehearsed responses into other threads, so they can try to appear as though they are intelligent.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.

Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#246 - 2015-05-07 00:42:46 UTC
I don't have a clue how to tell a WOW refugee from the 10% of EVE players that are neither current nor former WOW players.

From what I've seen you WOW refugees are the norm and not the exception, which makes me scratch my head in confusion when I see y'all bashing yourselves on a regular basis.

Anonymity only goes so far people. You spill more and more info about yourselves every time you post. I may not know who you are in real life, but I sure know from your posting that 90% of you have lived in the land of elves and fairies. So stop with the WOW rage. Or pull your hair out in front of a mirror to see the person you are actually putting down with all your insults.

Mr Epeen Cool
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#247 - 2015-05-07 00:45:34 UTC
Mr Epeen wrote:
I don't have a clue how to tell a WOW refugee from the 10% of EVE players that are neither current nor former WOW players.

From what I've seen you WOW refugees are the norm and not the exception, which makes me scratch my head in confusion when I see y'all bashing yourselves on a regular basis.

Anonymity only goes so far people. You spill more and more info about yourselves every time you post. I may not know who you are in real life, but I sure know from your posting that 90% of you have lived in the land of elves and fairies. So stop with the WOW rage. Or pull your hair out in front of a mirror to see the person you are actually putting down with all your insults.

Mr Epeen Cool

I may or may not have stabbed a few (thousand) dragons over the course of my life.
I feel so ashamed.
Eh, it's okay. If not for Eve being what it is, I'd never admit to having anything to do with sci-fi crap either.
Avaelica Kuershin
Paper Cats
#248 - 2015-05-07 01:08:39 UTC
Mr Epeen wrote:
I don't have a clue how to tell a WOW refugee from the 10% of EVE players that are neither current nor former WOW players.

From what I've seen you WOW refugees are the norm and not the exception, which makes me scratch my head in confusion when I see y'all bashing yourselves on a regular basis.

Anonymity only goes so far people. You spill more and more info about yourselves every time you post. I may not know who you are in real life, but I sure know from your posting that 90% of you have lived in the land of elves and fairies. So stop with the WOW rage. Or pull your hair out in front of a mirror to see the person you are actually putting down with all your insults.

Mr Epeen Cool


Ah, so you've noticed that!
There are the refugees who feel they are superior because they have escaped.
There are the refugees who haven't fully put it behind them and want to change EvE.

Kind of reminds me of recovering nicotine addicts. (Yes, I am one of those too) LolBlink
Jenshae Chiroptera
#249 - 2015-05-07 11:21:20 UTC
Mr Epeen wrote:
... I sure know from your posting that 90% of you have lived in the land of elves and fairies. ...
While they played it; did they like it or were they compelled by someone in real life?
WoW refugees are the people who liked the game, have lost their interest in it now due to changes done and are now either looking for a replacement or to get other games dumbed down to the levels they can enjoy them. Blink

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.

Gerhard Stringfellow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#250 - 2015-05-07 12:17:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Gerhard Stringfellow
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Mr Epeen wrote:
... I sure know from your posting that 90% of you have lived in the land of elves and fairies. ...
While they played it; did they like it or were they compelled by someone in real life?
WoW refugees are the people who liked the game, have lost their interest in it now due to changes done and are now either looking for a replacement or to get other games dumbed down to the levels they can enjoy them. Blink


I think this is a key point. I actually lost interest in WoW because I was playing it like EvE and just trading margins in the very early days of vanilla (which were absolutely lucrative, somewhere in the ballpark of 20000% markup for simply gathering schematics and trading them on AH).

But after awhile I realized I couldn't really do much with the money I'd made, and they took away zerging instances (flooding a higher level raid/etc with tons and tons of low level characters) which seemed to force a really boring way of playing where you had a certain low number of high level people running zones. I think in all honesty I played the game for maybe four months.

tl;dr I played but you couldn't really impact anything and they wanted people to play a certain way

Another pubbie elite PvE pay to win mining carebear

Adriana Nolen
Sama Guild
#251 - 2015-05-08 11:57:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Adriana Nolen
Alpheias wrote:

I'd argue that I am better than a WoW player because I have yet to meet a WoW player that cannot play the game (raids and whatnot) without mods.


& now you have.
It really depends on which position they are playing. I could wing it with dps & tanking but healing required them.

Edit: People from PVP servers tend to do just fine in eve.
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#252 - 2015-05-08 19:06:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Cipher Jones
Wis didn't get "shot down", it failed on the development level, then it received little support due to the huge resource investment for no payoff.

Other than being able to hack your TV to watch my little pony of course.

Also, WoW might be the best fantasy MMO RPG as far as PvE, but AA has the sandbox aspect of that beat by miles, and the PvE in Eve is incredible. So much so that both WoW and AA incorporated the PLEX system.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it

Dyner
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#253 - 2015-05-11 17:03:17 UTC
thowlimer wrote:
Dyner wrote:
Joe Atei wrote:
Dyner wrote:

-Lots of stuff-


-even more stuff than me P -




I used the EVE Fitter to plan out what ships I wanted. Learning Skills shaved something like 36 days off the total time. So after the basics for flying a Destroyer, I spent my time training the Learning Skills.

As for Agent Guides. I meant doing what the Agent Finder does now; looking up the agent in the role you want to do (Security, Industry, R&D, etc). --I don't recall there being an easy way to find Agents from with in the game. You just kind of docked and looked.

I never knew you could rebind steering to the keyboard...I'll have to give that a whirl with my Joystick Blink



Corp info/agent tab ...Roll(and you could pull up all the corps for each faction using the info tab on faction first and their corp list)



Yes, and it's far easier, now, to find the Agent in the field you want to specialize in.
Carrie-Anne Moss
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#254 - 2015-05-22 04:34:45 UTC
Adriana Nolen wrote:
Alpheias wrote:

I'd argue that I am better than a WoW player because I have yet to meet a WoW player that cannot play the game (raids and whatnot) without mods.


& now you have.
It really depends on which position they are playing. I could wing it with dps & tanking but healing required them.

Edit: People from PVP servers tend to do just fine in eve.


Eve doesn't need mods cuz most combat is click approach, click orbit 500m. Or click keep at range 22km. You can afk most pve dude. ... you cant honestly say that eve pve is harder/ more intelligent that WoW.

Hell dude eve runs on 1hz server ticks.
One second for your click to be sent to server.
One second to be sent back making you do it.

2seconds round trip for actions in eve.

WoW is twitchy combat where you need to run/jump/spin 180/shoot insta-cast fireball/summon your war-pet/dispell/use pvp trinket/cast invisibility. ... ALL WITHIN 1-2 SECONDS. SEE THE DIFF SLOWPOKE?

TWITCH MORE
Silver Price
Doomheim
#255 - 2015-05-22 06:46:54 UTC
don't want skins? don't pay for them. it's that simple, this entire thread is pointless...

your whiney opinions about this being similar to wow or that you pay 15$ a month so everything else should be free is literally telling all of us that you need a better job.

that's all it is, poor opinionated folks whining on forums. same thing for wow.
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
CODE.
#256 - 2015-05-22 07:10:55 UTC
Silver Price wrote:
don't want skins? don't pay for them. it's that simple, this entire thread is pointless...

your whiney opinions about this being similar to wow or that you pay 15$ a month so everything else should be free is literally telling all of us that you need a better job.

that's all it is, poor opinionated folks whining on forums. same thing for wow.

I am happy CCP that they found a way to get some extra bucks from idiots who are willing to pay money for a pixel spaceship texture. As long as this is not impacting any real gameplay and as long as I can turn it off I have no problem with it.

However, I am sad they changed the special edition ships. It was fun to kill 600mil Mackinaw hulls 10min after they got them on the market.
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
#257 - 2015-05-22 08:00:47 UTC
Can anybody give me an example where ,so called WoW refuges, had an impact on EvE developement?

"I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas..." - Herman Melville

Meryl SinGarda
Belligerent Underpaid Tactical Team
#258 - 2015-05-22 13:31:24 UTC
Okay but are there actually WoW refugees? Because when I see WoW players talking about EVE it's usually some kind of derpy comment that has no basis in reality. So I would not immediately expect to pull one of their corpses from a wreck (although all things considered, that makes total sense).
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#259 - 2015-05-22 15:03:13 UTC
Silver Price wrote:
don't want skins? don't pay for them. it's that simple, this entire thread is pointless...

your whiney opinions about this being similar to wow or that you pay 15$ a month so everything else should be free is literally telling all of us that you need a better job.

that's all it is, poor opinionated folks whining on forums. same thing for wow.


You judging other peoples financial situations tell us that you are willing to speak on things you know nothing about.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it

Harrison Tato
Yamato Holdings
#260 - 2015-05-22 16:56:12 UTC
I have never played WoW but..

Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs flow.
The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!

On we sweep with threshing oar, Our only goal will be the western shore.

Ah, ah,
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
How soft your fields so green, can whisper tales of gore,
Of how we calmed the tides of war. We are your overlords.

On we sweep with threshing oar, Our only goal will be the western shore.

So now you'd better stop and rebuild all your ruins,
For peace and trust can win the day despite of all your losing.