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Drifter Combat Analysis

Author
Ace Echo
The Shadow Raiders
#1 - 2015-02-17 21:13:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Ace Echo
There's been quite a bit of speculation on Who these Drifters are, and Why they're doing what they're doing. I've been following that as much as I can, but we have to all admit that we just don't know.

In the meantime, I'm working on developing a way of making sure we can take these suckers down if they start to look in the wrong direction. These gals and blokes seem pretty trigger-happy toward us, and although I'm not advocating outright war, I think it's nice to have a database of their combat capabilites if worse comes to worse.

So first, let's start with the numbers. I'm currently trying to make some combat research runs with to determine their damage output, damage types, and inherent resistances.

~
Stats:

X denotes unknown fields.

Defense:
Hit Points (top shield, bottom shield, armor, hull): X / X / X / X
Resistances (same order): X/X/X/X , 50/50/50/50, 50/50/50/50, 50/50/50/50[/i]

Offensive Damage, Standard 1400/1400/1400/1400 Approx. Dmg. per shot.
- They use the same uniform damage profile as Sleepers do.
Offensive Damage, Superweapon X/X/X/XApprox. Dmg. per shot.
- I'll take a guess... but I'm including this for the sake of completion.

Sensor strength: Likely above 30 points with multispectral scan strength.
Signature radius: 612m (7s to lock with 113 scan res. feel free to check my math)

Optimal Range, Standard weapons: 100% Zero-Hit distance appears to be around 140km.
Optimal Range, Superweapon: X.

Max Velocity: 3400m/s Straight-Line Maximum. 2400m/s avg. Orbit.

Capacitor: 7700 Gj. Can be neuted, but has no effect on combat capability.


~

Tactics:

So far, we've found that any sufficiently large capsuleer fleet can take down a Drifter with losses. The Drifter, unless jammed, will always get a doomsday shot off.

Effective fleet compositions appear to lean toward high-damage attack fleets. Groups of Stealth Bombers, Attack Battlecruisers, etc. have both sufficient firepower to down Drifter battleships, as well as being cost-effective enough to afford inevitable losses.

Also, ECM has been known to completely disable them. However, I will assume that this is due to errors in their ship's... software subroutines... and will likely be repaired in time. If it isn't that simple of a problem, though, then we have the keys to the Drifters 'killswitch', which can be researched and effectively weaponized, if need be.

~

Please, fellow capsuleers, I invite you to help fill in some of this information. I can't do this all alone. Please submit any research/tactics that you found are helpful for defending yourself against these foes.

If you can milk it, it's an udder.

Jukko Riis
Doomheim
#2 - 2015-02-17 21:37:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Jukko Riis
Ace Echo wrote:
There's been quite a bit of speculation on Who these Drifters are, and Why they're doing what they're doing. I've been following that as much as I can, but we have to all admit that we just don't know.

In the meantime, I'm working on developing a way of making sure we can take these suckers down if they start to look in the wrong direction. These gals and blokes seem pretty trigger-happy toward us, and although I'm not advocating outright war, I think it's nice to have a database of their combat capabilites if worse comes to worse.




I don't see them as being "trigger happy" at all.

You must mean you.

'Cause I just spent the last 20 minutes hanging around with Artemis and Apollo Tyrannus and we had a grand time. Zero agression.

Your response is typical, yet so impinging on their "Freedom."

Maybe you'd like to ask them to vote before you try to kill them next time?
Ace Echo
The Shadow Raiders
#3 - 2015-02-17 21:41:10 UTC
I see them being trigger-happy. Approximately 60 seconds on-grid with circadians + drifters before aggression.

Way to try to politicize an issue. Again. That's basically what all of this drama comes to, these days.

If you can milk it, it's an udder.

Ace Echo
The Shadow Raiders
#4 - 2015-02-17 21:43:16 UTC
Ace Echo wrote:
I see them being trigger-happy. Approximately 60 seconds on-grid with circadians + drifters before aggression.

Way to try to politicize an issue. Again. That's basically what all of this drama comes to, these days.


Additionally, the only time I've agressed one was with a 80dps sacrificial research Dominix.
And, to add on that, I'm not advocating war on these. They're worth more alive than dead.

If you can milk it, it's an udder.

Jukko Riis
Doomheim
#5 - 2015-02-17 21:47:39 UTC
Ace Echo wrote:
They're worth more alive than dead.



Sorry Chummer. Hard not to politicize when you have an attitude like that.

I kept a steady 1K distance for the entire time and other than the occasional scan, never had an issue. Maybe it was your ships, maybe you locked on first. Or maybe they just don't like you.

Can't imagine why....
General Stargazer
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#6 - 2015-02-17 22:05:15 UTC
Was able to scan the ship and can at least answer some of the questions:

Capacitor was 7700.00 GJ. It is vunerable to both Nos and Neuts, however draining the ship seemed to have no noticeable detrimental effect and the ship was still capable of firing its superweapon.

Offensive damage types - i tested this using a reactive armor hardener, it adapted by making my tank completly universal, so it appears it is uniform damage. I was being hit by approximately 2500 damage per shot at 60% uniform resist.

Doomsday seems to be linked to the secondary shield layer. From what i've experienced if the shield is prevented from recharging the doomsday does not re-fire. Timer from the doomsday being used, to shield recharging while un-inhibited is approximately 20 minutes. Damage type appears to also be omni. In excess of a 130,000 units of damage.

Additional observations:

Visually it appears that based on the position of the energy weapons on the external hull of the ship it appears to have 6 turrets.

While the secondary shield layer is active and the doomsday is primed, the ship appears to have an almost golden/yellow shimmer around the hull.

Highest velocity if have encountered so far is 2700 m/s. Webbing is effective, however scrambling to deactivate what appeared to be a microwarp drive, was not.
Ace Echo
The Shadow Raiders
#7 - 2015-02-17 22:14:55 UTC
Thanks for the info, Stargazer. Also, Jukko, another capsuleer in an ingame channel just got shot at without any instigation - that person hadn't ever shot at one before, and was just sitting next to it.

If you can milk it, it's an udder.

General Stargazer
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#8 - 2015-02-17 22:24:32 UTC  |  Edited by: General Stargazer
Ace Echo wrote:
Thanks for the info, Stargazer. Also, Jukko, another capsuleer in an ingame channel just got shot at without any instigation - that person hadn't ever shot at one before, and was just sitting next to it.


Yes, seems to be a reoccurring theme across the cluster that they now attack without provocation as well. Seen reports of them attacking unarmed vessels as well.

Edit for clarification: Such as unarmed vessels - Including Covert ops ships and the Zephyr.
Jukko Riis
Doomheim
#9 - 2015-02-17 22:36:57 UTC
Noted.

Good report Stargazer.

Again, what are the standings? Me, my corp and the State are neutral. Could they be responding to other acts of aggression?


General Stargazer
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#10 - 2015-02-17 22:52:42 UTC
Don't know if its of any importance or relevance, but the ships are also 700m long.
Jukko Riis
Doomheim
#11 - 2015-02-17 23:37:03 UTC
Six hardpoints on each side. And they look like they're floating a couple of meters off the hull.
Uriel Paradisi Anteovnuecci
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#12 - 2015-02-18 00:43:54 UTC
CONCORD's Database lists the turrets as "Lux Kontos".

Also, the ships do not aggress unless you pas too closely to their wormhole or the unidentified structure.

Apollo is flying alongside my Society Battlecruiser right now, transmitting... something to me.

And there are five Circadians orbiting me: none of them have shown any aggression.
Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#13 - 2015-02-18 16:35:00 UTC
If you are inclined, I would suggest trying a fleet of tornados and simply alpha the ships off the grid. I have no idea how many ships would be required.

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY

soldieroffortune 258
Nagas gave me Harpies
Requiem Eternal
#14 - 2015-02-19 17:55:33 UTC
Soldarius wrote:
If you are inclined, I would suggest trying a fleet of tornados and simply alpha the ships off the grid. I have no idea how many ships would be required.



This is actually not a bad method. As a matter of fact I have already tried this with success. 2 Artillery fit Tornadoes can alpha the secondary shield layer. I think 6 Tornadoes at the edge of Falloff could put one of these down within 2 weapon cycles.
Ace Echo
The Shadow Raiders
#15 - 2015-02-20 18:40:15 UTC
Alright, I updated the OP with some new intel.

Right now, I'm looking for info on their "hitpoints". If possible, can someone that has killed a drifter to either parse your group's combat logs after the fight and analyze total damage dealt? I can also accept raw logs from all involved fleet members and parse them myself.

If you can milk it, it's an udder.

Lugh Crow-Slave
#16 - 2015-05-05 05:46:30 UTC
Currently gathering fragmented data from an observatory and i can say that seekers will fire on you for doing this. They will also stop scanning other things in the system to return to the observatory once you start running an entosis link. They will not stop firing on a ship or swap ago to you for this however
Arkady Vachon
The Gold Angels
Sixth Empire
#17 - 2015-05-05 06:01:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Arkady Vachon
What's the effectiveness of EWAR systems, Tracking Disrupts, Sensor Damps, Painters and ECM, on the Drifter ships?

Nothing Personal - Just Business...

Chaos Creates Content

Voodoo Williams
Shooting Star Company
#18 - 2015-05-06 07:51:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Voodoo Williams
This myth of C-Seeker/Drifter non-aggression is absurd and needs to be squashed. At first I was hesitant to attack these new foes, and refrained from firing on them. That is until they started taking pot-shots at my interceptor unprovoked. I was simply orbiting a bubbled gate in nullsec, not locked on to anything, simply observing their habits. One of the seekers scanned me with their beam, and then stopped. Moments later, another Seeker locked me and immediately opened fire, tearing into my shield. Not wanting to lose the ship, I jumped the gate and returned to my station. At this point, no one in my corp had aggressed either Seekers or Drifters.

They are obviously hostile and I was nowhere near either one of their wormholes or the Jovian structures (though there was one in system). I called up a few of my past corpmates who had been fighting the Drifters a few regions away, and had succeeded in destroying one of the Drifters. After comparing notes, my current corpmates and I began to plan a way to rid our system of this threat.

The plan worked wonderfully. C-Seekers can be easily killed, and have very little tank, though a great deal of speed. The Drifters, though tougher, were also fairly easy to kill as long as one manages aggro properly and has a ship capable of surviving their doomsday weapon (yes it IS possible to survive it). We proceeded to slaughter all Seekers/Drifters in our system. Sometimes we would kill a batch and they would be immediately supported by more. Sometimes they would take a few minutes to appear in another location in system. After destroying numerous groups, they suddenly stopped appearing. It took until the next day for anymore to be spotted, and now they were much more wary of our tactics (but would still not totally avoid us). Total count over the weekend was over 50 Seekers destroyed, and three Drifter Battleships, with no losses to ourselves.

Stasis webs are the the key to defeating these foes. And oddly, the webs do not cause aggression, as long as the Drifter is otherwise engaged. They also seem to be fond of hanging out around our bubble-camps, being seen there nearly as often as by the Jovian Observatories themselves.

Feel free to mail me for more detailed information on the ships and tactics I used, as I do not feel comfortable sharing more on such a public forum.

Edit: Unfortunately I didn't record combat logs....maybe another corpmate did. I will ask and share if they did.
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#19 - 2015-05-06 15:15:40 UTC
Voodoo Williams wrote:
This myth of C-Seeker/Drifter non-aggression is absurd and needs to be squashed.

From what I've been hearing, it sounds like they're not so much non-aggressive as ... unpredictable, individually.

It feels a little like looking in a mirror.
Merdaneth
Angel Wing.
#20 - 2015-05-06 17:18:07 UTC
Aria Jenneth wrote:

From what I've been hearing, it sounds like they're not so much non-aggressive as ... unpredictable, individually.

It feels a little like looking in a mirror.


I find capsuleers very predictable. Well, at least much more predictable than Drifter vessels.
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