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Best incursion ship(s) to aim for?
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Archare
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#41 - 2011-12-25 05:38:59 UTC
Isan'na wrote:
Archare wrote:


Caveat to the above statement is that it's true only if people are lazy and just sit on the warpin and don't move. I'm starting to have some success with a MWD vindicator to close the distance to increase blaster dps, and think the same would work well on a machariel. It's especially nice to light up a deltole with void ammo at <5km

Ideal ship set up would be for me

2 basis with remote sebos and at least one of the basi's 4/2 fit to feed cap requests
4 nightmares
3 machariels
2 vindicators

All of the dps ships should be dual faction webs and an offgrid skirmish booster. Also vindicators should fit MWD to be useful in OTAs


Caveat to the movement is that if they aggress the MWD Vindi then the spawns will be pushed away from the main fleet; also, if you're competing, you have less time to get in range and be useful.

As for the Machariel vs Nightmare:

NM faction ammo is more affordable.
NM close range ammo does the same damage at 15 and tracks better (0.076 vs 0.0933)
NM scorch does more damage between 40km and 70km vs RF EMP on the Mach.
NM with a scan-res SeBo has the same scan-res as a Mach without a SeBo, but the Mach doesn't have the extra midslot to fit one.
Same tank, NM has one more utility high. Granted, this assumes a WELL FIT NM and not a scrubfit...

I'd take a fleet of 2 basis and 8 NM to be honest.



Actually the movement assumes machs are moving too with MWDs as they closer they get the more damage they do as well. Also the Sansha rats in OTA's orbit at close range to begin with so you won't push them away very far if at all, and once dual webbed won't matter either way.

If I was running OTA's only and never ran any other site then 9 NM's and 2 scimi's are the way to go. However mixing the pirate BSes makes them perform all the sites in 4 minutes or less.

Also general pro tip for new players is carry medium shield drones if you have the space in the drone bay. A cloud of them from 8-9 players = a logi. It's great insurance when one of your logis disconnect in the middle of an OTA. It's really saved my fleets from some surprise moments.
Isan'na
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#42 - 2011-12-25 06:34:07 UTC
Archare wrote:
Also general pro tip for new players is carry medium shield drones if you have the space in the drone bay. A cloud of them from 8-9 players = a logi. It's great insurance when one of your logis disconnect in the middle of an OTA. It's really saved my fleets from some surprise moments.


This, this, this. Also a large cap transfer in the high for your basis, plus a remote rep if you can.

On the movement bit, I suppose you could call me a lazy bum, but it was really the Nightmare's firepower, tracking, and extra mids which swayed me when I was doing my comparisons.
Mfume Apocal
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#43 - 2011-12-25 07:32:17 UTC
Goose99 wrote:
It's all connected, and originate from the fact that Mach handles not like a BS, but one hull size smaller. Sig, in particular, is a factor in its locking speed being competitive with Legion. Agility is responsible for align and bounce. All are interrelated to "handling." Fly it first, then look at stats, and you'll see why it handles the way it does. Just EFT, and you'll miss everything that matters.


No, it is not. Signature radius has absolutely nothing to do with scan res. Nor do agility or speed. Or do you really believe that nanos and prop mods improve your lock time, while shield extenders hurt it? I've been flying a PvE Mach for months. Also, it's tracking is worst among pirate faction BSes (practically speaking) so I'm not sure why you would imply a Mach's tracking is it's strong suite.
Arazel Chainfire
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#44 - 2011-12-26 03:44:01 UTC
Isan'na wrote:
Archare wrote:


Caveat to the above statement is that it's true only if people are lazy and just sit on the warpin and don't move. I'm starting to have some success with a MWD vindicator to close the distance to increase blaster dps, and think the same would work well on a machariel. It's especially nice to light up a deltole with void ammo at <5km

Ideal ship set up would be for me

2 basis with remote sebos and at least one of the basi's 4/2 fit to feed cap requests
4 nightmares
3 machariels
2 vindicators

All of the dps ships should be dual faction webs and an offgrid skirmish booster. Also vindicators should fit MWD to be useful in OTAs


Caveat to the movement is that if they aggress the MWD Vindi then the spawns will be pushed away from the main fleet; also, if you're competing, you have less time to get in range and be useful.

As for the Machariel vs Nightmare:

NM faction ammo is more affordable.
NM close range ammo does the same damage at 15 and tracks better (0.076 vs 0.0933)
NM scorch does more damage between 40km and 70km vs RF EMP on the Mach.
NM with a scan-res SeBo has the same scan-res as a Mach without a SeBo, but the Mach doesn't have the extra midslot to fit one.
Same tank, NM has one more utility high. Granted, this assumes a WELL FIT NM and not a scrubfit...

I'd take a fleet of 2 basis and 8 NM to be honest.


From personal experience, the best fleet I've ever been in was 2 logi's (I think it was actually a scimi and a basi... didn't really matter, they weren't really doing anything) 9 nightmares and a tengu fleet booster with 3 shield and 3 skirmish warfare links. If you can get every nightmare to fit at least 2 fed navy webs (17km with t1 links and max skills... not sure what it is now with t2) and a sensor booster, it was able to stomp over pretty much everything in OTA's and NMC's - it even competed with an armor legion fleet in NCO's for a bit, winning about half the sites. When competing in a site, not needing to move while still applying full dps is what will win it for you every time. That fleet was able to beat mixed nightmare/mach fleets in OTA's simply because of the better applied damage at 40+km, practically killing all the distance spawns before they could settle into an orbit, even in a non-competing site. Part of the reason why I think lasers are the best weapon to use for incursions.

-Arazel
Cedo Nulli
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#45 - 2011-12-26 08:19:34 UTC
Everyone seems to think getting invites is only about the ability of the ship. The truth behind it is that the monetary investment your willing to bring is a sign of trustworthiness. Its like a in a poker you have to lay down enough chips to show your worth and get a seat at the table.

This goes especially for logi pilots aka the easiest component for a griefer fleet. Logistics pass the aggro over to other players and boom they get smoked and nobody can do nothing about it. If you are only inferior player ... then it means you lose those 2-3bil ships of yours because of incompetence. Logistic pilot requires the least investment and can destroy the whole fleet while dps pilot cant. If you are trying to go lowest possible investment in everything ... what does that tell about you ? You aint up to no good or your expecting to screw things up.

Being efficient is secondary ... yet something you cant ignore if you want to make money ... and you know the ancient wisdom "Money comes to money" applies perfectly to incursion fleets too.
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