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Regarding the proposed structure changes

Author
Mister Tazinas
Faceless Men
#1 - 2015-03-24 09:24:11 UTC
I've read through the Dev Blog here, http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/back-into-the-structure/, and will say that for the most part the changes sound great. I believe this is the concept they proposed to us years ago, but subsequently shelved because of all the failures they mustered in a short time frame (Monoclegate, greed is good, Dust514, etc).

My concern comes from the very last portion. It states that current structures will essentially be phased out, and no longer function. Does anyone know exactly what will happen to them? Will we essentially have dead sticks everywhere? Will we be able to exchange our multi-billion isk faction towers for new faction structures?

It just kind of seems that destroying trillions of isk in one fell swoop is.... a bad idea any way you look at it. CCP did not really mention any transition plan for the change other than saying current structures will cease to function.

If anyone has a line on this, or if a Dev wants to post a clearer explanation of what happens to our old stuff that would be great.


Ioci
Bad Girl Posse
#2 - 2015-03-24 09:27:26 UTC
I'm having the same issue.

Part of me really likes these concept changes but I'm looking at my Faction POS mods and thinking, really? You are just going to burn them? Seems kind of scuzzy.

R.I.P. Vile Rat

Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#3 - 2015-03-24 09:32:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Scipio Artelius
Mister Tazinas wrote:
CCP did not really mention any transition plan for the change other than saying current structures will cease to function.

From the bottom part of the devblog?

TRANSITION PLAN
It is obvious such changes will not come in one release, nor that we are going to alter or remove existing structures without prior and sufficient warning.

As such our plan is to:

  • Progressively cut functionalities from existing structures. This would match new structures arrival that provide an overlapping gameplay. For instance, deploying the new Assembly Arrays would cause existing Starbases and Outposts to lose their manufacturing bonuses at first, then their manufacturing capability.
  • Give ]ample time for players to evacuate their assets from existing structures and adapt to the changes.


http://cdn1.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/67008/1/Transition2.png

Other then that, no one here has anymore information.

There is however, an official comments thread linked in the devblog too and te devs are actively monitoring and responding to it:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=413728&_ga=1.10685236.106196680.1422569957
Mister Tazinas
Faceless Men
#4 - 2015-03-24 09:41:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Mister Tazinas
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Mister Tazinas wrote:
CCP did not really mention any transition plan for the change other than saying current structures will cease to function.

From the bottom part of the devblog?

TRANSITION PLAN
It is obvious such changes will not come in one release, nor that we are going to alter or remove existing structures without prior and sufficient warning.

As such our plan is to:

  • Progressively cut functionalities from existing structures. This would match new structures arrival that provide an overlapping gameplay. For instance, deploying the new Assembly Arrays would cause existing Starbases and Outposts to lose their manufacturing bonuses at first, then their manufacturing capability.
  • Give ]ample time for players to evacuate their assets from existing structures and adapt to the changes.


http://cdn1.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/67008/1/Transition2.png

Other then that, no one here has anymore information.

There is however, an official comments thread linked in the devblog too and te devs are actively monitoring and responding to it:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=413728&_ga=1.10685236.106196680.1422569957



I specifically referred to the final part as they are highly unclear, or just don't know, what they plan on doing with current structures other than making them no longer function.

My main concern is that this basically makes trillions upon trillions of isk assets in Eve disappear. The isk still exists, but the owner who bought/built the structures is left out on a limb.

I own multiple faction towers, multiple faction mods. If they no longer work, they will just become lost isk. They won't become "collector items" as there are thousands, if not tens of thousands of them around. This is something that does not please me, nor do I think it pleases anyone else if it turns out to happen this way.
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn
Department 10
#5 - 2015-03-24 09:43:16 UTC
If you go to the 'F & I board' on this forum you will find sub-sections where you discuss the various issues regarding the new structures. Or use the comments section on the main structures dev blog. I imagine this OP will be closed soon by the ISD.

On the subject of faction POS modules I would personally advise unanchoring them, selling them on if possible, and replacing them with standard module types. If they haven't already the price of faction modules and ones like the Hyasoda (I've spelt that incorrectly.) labs are probably going to decrease a lot.

The current plans for structures are different to previous fanfest announcements such as the ones for 'the door', ring mining, & modular POSes in that there was never any concrete work visible for them shown to us. They were just possible visions or ideas that will likely never come to pass at least not in those specific formats. The new structure plan on the other is wet concrete in terms of what CCP has in mind and will probably be at least partially implemented later this year.

" They're gonna feel pretty stupid when they find out. " Rick. " Find out what ? " Abraham. " They're screwing with the wrong people. " Rick. Season four.   ' The Walking Dead. ' .

Ioci
Bad Girl Posse
#6 - 2015-03-24 09:49:34 UTC
Mister Tazinas wrote:



I specifically referred to the final part as they are highly unclear, or just don't know, what they plan on doing with current structures other than making them no longer function.

My main concern is that this basically makes trillions upon trillions of isk assets in Eve disappear. The isk still exists, but the owner who bought/built the structures is left out on a limb.

I own multiple faction towers, multiple faction mods. If they no longer work, they will just become lost isk. They won't become "collector items" as there are thousands, if not tens of thousands of them around. This is something that does not please me, nor do I think it pleases anyone else if it turns out to happen this way.


and observant people know we are going to get boned - ask a Titan pilot - CCP don't seem to value our investments but a null player brought it up at the peek of the question. They plan to eventually make even outposts void. Consider all the assets sitting in a decommissioned outpost. It's at a scale I really don't know if CCP will go there. Scorched Earth in the extremes.

R.I.P. Vile Rat

Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn
Department 10
#7 - 2015-03-24 10:01:06 UTC
To Mister Tazinas: CCP did not mention anything about racial towers or POS modules at all at least on the HD stream. Whether anything was mentioned in the roundtables you would have to ask people that are at Fanfest. So this would lead me to believe that there will just be one type of each basic structure in the new plan per size of structure/module. This will mean other changes like removal of POS fuel savings on faction tower usage for example.

I know for a fact we were short-changed on reimbursement for the interfaces a little while ago where supposed current market values. If that method is used to reimburse for faction towers and modules you and others will potentially be royally screwed over.

I made a suggestion for CCP to give us back all the materials - P4 etc - used in production of any structures they are removing and not swapping over for new types rather than a paltry sum of ISK. It does sound like there won't be any exchange of old for new though. But this doesn't help people like you who have potentially purchased expensive faction BPCs in addition to material cost of base or racial POS structures and modules.

I have no interest in buying faction POS stuff now so I have no axe to grind. So I still say it may be best to look to decrease any losses and sell/swap out faction POS modules for standard versions.

" They're gonna feel pretty stupid when they find out. " Rick. " Find out what ? " Abraham. " They're screwing with the wrong people. " Rick. Season four.   ' The Walking Dead. ' .

Mister Tazinas
Faceless Men
#8 - 2015-03-24 10:20:51 UTC
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn wrote:
To Mister Tazinas: CCP did not mention anything about racial towers or POS modules at all at least on the HD stream. Whether anything was mentioned in the roundtables you would have to ask people that are at Fanfest. So this would lead me to believe that there will just be one type of each basic structure in the new plan per size of structure/module. This will mean other changes like removal of POS fuel savings on faction tower usage for example.

I know for a fact we were short-changed on reimbursement for the interfaces a little while ago where supposed current market values. If that method is used to reimburse for faction towers and modules you and others will potentially be royally screwed over.

I made a suggestion for CCP to give us back all the materials - P4 etc - used in production of any structures they are removing and not swapping over for new types rather than a paltry sum of ISK. It does sound like there won't be any exchange of old for new though. But this doesn't help people like you who have potentially purchased expensive faction BPCs in addition to material cost of base or racial POS structures and modules.

I have no interest in buying faction POS stuff now so I have no axe to grind. So I still say it may be best to look to decrease any losses and sell/swap out faction POS modules for standard versions.



Yeah... looks like I may just be pulling down a bunch of towers here shortly...

Gotta love CCP's blatant disregard for the player base, and their opinions :-)
Anatoly Kataev
In Gila We Trust
#9 - 2015-03-24 10:24:57 UTC
CCP, keep our POS fields, its beautiful !!!
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#10 - 2015-03-24 10:30:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Scipio Artelius
Mister Tazinas wrote:
Gotta love CCP's blatant disregard for the player base, and their opinions :-)

Your jumping the gun a bit.

The structures haven't even been fully developed yet. It's all still way up in the air, so difficult for detailed transition arrangements to be outlined when it's still not certain what's actually going to be replaced when and how.

Yet despite that, CCP have released an early devblog, months in advance of any changes occuring, opened a comments thread for that devblog and answered questions the best they can so far. Somehow that is blatant disregard.

So far it seems like a fair regard for the community. The blatant disregard will come later.
Mister Tazinas
Faceless Men
#11 - 2015-03-24 15:53:48 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Mister Tazinas wrote:
Gotta love CCP's blatant disregard for the player base, and their opinions :-)

Your jumping the gun a bit.

The structures haven't even been fully developed yet. It's all still way up in the air, so difficult for detailed transition arrangements to be outlined when it's still not certain what's actually going to be replaced when and how.

Yet despite that, CCP have released an early devblog, months in advance of any changes occuring, opened a comments thread for that devblog and answered questions the best they can so far. Somehow that is blatant disregard.

So far it seems like a fair regard for the community. The blatant disregard will come later.



If one wants to see the the future they only need to look to the past.
Luna Arindale
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#12 - 2015-03-24 15:59:58 UTC
Poses will cease to exist period. However Outposts hopefully are going to be changed to the XL stations. They will lose all their current bonuses and gain respective modual slots and bonuses to them. If you look in the dev blog, the XL station example is the Gallente outpost.
Seven Koskanaiken
Shadow Legions.
SONS of BANE
#13 - 2015-03-24 16:43:12 UTC
If you like your outpost you can keep it.
TigerXtrm
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#14 - 2015-03-24 16:55:42 UTC
Regarding outposts I think the idea (or at least I hope so) is that once all the structures have taken over existing functionality, no new outposts will be able to be built. You will probably still be able to dock in them, but they won't have any more function other than docking. At this point they will probably be made destructable and everyone can have a field day in destroying them all until non are left.

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Rapscallion Jones
Omnibus Solutions
#15 - 2015-03-24 17:52:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Rapscallion Jones
As stated above just look to the past to see the future.

Doubt my words? Well then just step into the way-back machine with me. Here we are at the industry revamp announcement. There is much outcry from industrialists about the huge loss in value they are going to take when the surplus of labs flood the market. (Remember when your labs could only run a limited number of jobs). Look, the devs are making assurance that 'something' will be done.

Let's step back into the way-back machine and go forward a few months later. Oh look Crius is on Tranquility now. Let's take a look at the market . Wow, look at all of those dirt cheap Hyasoda labs. Hmmph! What happened? Too bad, so sad capsuleers. Your property is now worth next to nothing.
Kuga
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#16 - 2015-03-24 18:05:35 UTC
They'll probably refund people who have the stuff in hangars at the deadline with a market value taken at some arbitrary time.


However to be really honest, towers and mods aren't worth enough to give a care over. If you can afford to keep faction towers around, the hit is likely to be a minuscule one for you in any case.
Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
#17 - 2015-03-24 18:13:09 UTC
No refunds. Suck it up.

The Tears Must Flow

Conrad Makbure
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2015-03-24 18:50:14 UTC
Wow, these changes are bad ass, totally looking forward to it. Then again I don't own any kind of structure now so I don't care what they do to the old ones.
Tuttomenui II
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2015-03-24 19:00:08 UTC
Watch all pos structures and modules that are in hangers get CCP HAX refined with 100% efficiency to their constituent parts.

d0cTeR9
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#20 - 2015-03-24 19:52:47 UTC  |  Edited by: d0cTeR9
Same thing will happen to super owners. Live on or leave.

You are whining about a few billions, try 100 bil Titan nerf, or 30 bil supercarrier nerfs.

Same thing, no isk or skill refund.

Been around since the beginning.

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