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Could Eve benifit from an experience system?

First post
Author
Horatius Caul
Kitzless
#81 - 2011-12-23 22:05:48 UTC
Marduk Nibiru wrote:

On the other hand, if you make it actually useful. Perhaps I save a day or two...now you have a problem. Now it becomes NECESSARY to do that grind I just described. EvE becomes a ******* NPC grind fest.
That, or people will just fly out into safespots with friends and shoot at each others' tanks afk, like in Tibia.
Jimi Crackcorn
Directed Evolution Corp
#82 - 2011-12-23 22:21:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Jimi Crackcorn
Marduk Nibiru wrote:
I'm a dumbass


Here is your one mistake, if you would'vejust realized this, you would've saved yourself about 100 lines of text. You're ASSUMING that you would HAVE to grind for it and completely ignoring the fact that it would just be something to supplement the way you do play the game.

Here are two scenarios:

1. Your completely idiotic scenario. Put skill, go out and grind(EVEN THOUGH IT'S BEEN STATED TONS OF TIMES IN THIS THREAD THAT, THAT IS NOT THE PURPOSE)

2. Train your skills like normal, run your missions like normal, get passive skill increase as you do what you normally do.

If you choose to grind, that is a CHOICE. No one is forcing you to go out and change your daily routine to gain a few minutes, like you seem to think. It would happen passively as you play the game the way you normally do.

Most people training for blasters level 5 are using blasters in their daily gaming, am I right? So you put Blasters V in your queue, and go out and do whatever you do normally and gain a few extra sp. You don't have to go out and grind for it, you just do what you normally do. It's a passive system, as I've stated a thousand times before.

Let me bold this so maybe, just maybe I won't have to explain this again

The way this would work would require NO changes in the way anyone plays their game. You do NOT have to go out and grind for it as that would be a waste of time. It is something meant to supplement your normal gaming experience and make it that much more worthwhile.

Like really, did you even think before you posted? Did I ever say someone would hold a gun to your head and force you to go out and grind to save 5 minutes? No, that's a choice, and if you chose to do that, well I must say, you are the stupid ass, not the system.

The system I'm proposing, as I've said over and over, completely discourages grinding to the point where only the biggest dumbasses(you) would consider doing it. Please, be less stupid next time you post ok?
Marduk Nibiru
Chaos Delivery Systems
#83 - 2011-12-23 22:34:29 UTC
Jimi Crackcorn wrote:
Marduk Nibiru wrote:
I'm a dumbass


Here is your one mistake, if you would'vejust realized this, you would've saved yourself about 100 lines of text. You're ASSUMING that you would HAVE to grind for it and completely ignoring the fact that it would just be something to supplement the way you do play the game.


Actually, my mistake was taking you seriously and treating you like an intelligent individual when all evidence pointed to the contrary.

What's it like being that stupid? I've always been incredibly curious but none of you stupid people will tell me. I imagine it must be sort of like when I'm super drunk or haven't slept for like 2 weeks or something....but one can never know until someone's willing to describe it.

Anyway, don't really expect an answer here either. Good luck with your brilliant plan. I hope that it gets all the attention that it deserves.
Marduk Nibiru
Chaos Delivery Systems
#84 - 2011-12-23 22:40:35 UTC
Horatius Caul wrote:
Marduk Nibiru wrote:

On the other hand, if you make it actually useful. Perhaps I save a day or two...now you have a problem. Now it becomes NECESSARY to do that grind I just described. EvE becomes a ******* NPC grind fest.
That, or people will just fly out into safespots with friends and shoot at each others' tanks afk, like in Tibia.


Yeah, it would take a lot of undeserved work and developer attention to design and implement a system that was at all useful and wasn't trivially abusable. It's a game ruining idea poorly thought out by someone obviously unwilling to have a serious look at its flaws.

There are ways around this issue too. You could require that the ship actually get destroyed. You could require different ships, etc... But each and every skill would require this kind of attention and it's simply not worth it.
Horatius Caul
Kitzless
#85 - 2011-12-23 22:58:26 UTC
Jimi Crackcorn wrote:
90% Ad hominems, 10% actual argumentation
It doesn't matter if it's optional or voluntary or whatever. It would still be rewarding a play style diametrically opposed to what EVE has been constructed to cater to.

As Marduk says, there are two possible scenarios:

Either the buffs the system provides are so negligible as to be a complete waste of developer time, or it produces a non-trivial bonus, in which case anyone grinding will have an advantage over everyone else - which in turn forces everyone to grind to remain competitive.

Just because it's optional or not mandatory doesn't mean that the problem completely ceases to exist for people who don't want it. If opting out means you're gonna be standing still in comparison to the people who opt-in, it's not a viable option at all.
Jimi Crackcorn
Directed Evolution Corp
#86 - 2011-12-23 22:59:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Jimi Crackcorn
Marduk Nibiru wrote:

Actually, my mistake was taking you seriously and treating you like an intelligent individual when all evidence pointed to the contrary.

What's it like being that stupid? I've always been incredibly curious but none of you stupid people will tell me. I imagine it must be sort of like when I'm super drunk or haven't slept for like 2 weeks or something....but one can never know until someone's willing to describe it.

Anyway, don't really expect an answer here either. Good luck with your brilliant plan. I hope that it gets all the attention that it deserves.



Ooo ad hominem, I should've expected as much from someone like you. I'll take that as you admitting defeat?

Horatius Caul wrote:
It doesn't matter if it's optional or voluntary or whatever. It would still be rewarding a play style diametrically opposed to what EVE has been constructed to cater to.

As Marduk says, there are two possible scenarios:

Either the buffs the system provides are so negligible as to be a complete waste of developer time, or it produces a non-trivial bonus, in which case anyone grinding will have an advantage over everyone else - which in turn forces everyone to grind to remain competitive.

Just because it's optional or not mandatory doesn't mean that the problem completely ceases to exist for people who don't want it. If opting out means you're gonna be standing still in comparison to the people who opt-in, it's not a viable option at all.



It wouldn't have to be either of those. Negligible in the short term, yes. In the long term it would = out to days worth of sp, but not so much that it would be worth wasting time in the short term to grind it out.

Also, that was 10% ad hom, 90% argument. There are I believe 2 line of ad hom in that post? Look at Marduk for 100% ad hom, no amount of intelligence in his post whatsoever.
Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#87 - 2011-12-23 23:04:15 UTC
Anybody that replied to this guy like he was serious got trolled.

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.

Marduk Nibiru
Chaos Delivery Systems
#88 - 2011-12-23 23:10:04 UTC
Jimi Crackcorn wrote:
Marduk Nibiru wrote:

Actually, my mistake was taking you seriously and treating you like an intelligent individual when all evidence pointed to the contrary.

What's it like being that stupid? I've always been incredibly curious but none of you stupid people will tell me. I imagine it must be sort of like when I'm super drunk or haven't slept for like 2 weeks or something....but one can never know until someone's willing to describe it.

Anyway, don't really expect an answer here either. Good luck with your brilliant plan. I hope that it gets all the attention that it deserves.



Ooo ad hominem, I should've expected as much from someone like you. I'll take that as you admitting defeat?



You'd have to be smarter than you are to understand the irony here I think. In other words, you'd have to know what the term you're using actually means.

And yes, I am admitting defeat here.

Quote:

Horatius Caul wrote:
It doesn't matter if it's optional or voluntary or whatever. It would still be rewarding a play style diametrically opposed to what EVE has been constructed to cater to.

As Marduk says, there are two possible scenarios:

Either the buffs the system provides are so negligible as to be a complete waste of developer time, or it produces a non-trivial bonus, in which case anyone grinding will have an advantage over everyone else - which in turn forces everyone to grind to remain competitive.

Just because it's optional or not mandatory doesn't mean that the problem completely ceases to exist for people who don't want it. If opting out means you're gonna be standing still in comparison to the people who opt-in, it's not a viable option at all.



It wouldn't have to be either of those. Negligible in the short term, yes. In the long term it would = out to days worth of sp, but not so much that it would be worth wasting time in the short term to grind it out.


In other words, "I want both and am pretending that's possible."

Marduk Nibiru
Chaos Delivery Systems
#89 - 2011-12-23 23:12:02 UTC
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Anybody that replied to this guy like he was serious got trolled.


But by a sophisticated form of simulated stupidity or the real deal?
Jimi Crackcorn
Directed Evolution Corp
#90 - 2011-12-23 23:12:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Jimi Crackcorn
Quote:


In other words, "I want both and am pretending that's possible."




I don't have to pretend as it is very possible. I can see why someone like you couldn't come to that conclusion though :)
Zoltar
Perdu Opus
#91 - 2011-12-23 23:53:35 UTC
Horatius Caul wrote:
Nova Fox wrote:
There are those who say put this on the crew, so when crew dies you lose thier experince they provided.

Hmmm... now that could actually work...

Crew could develop certain bonuses over time. This would probably not be skill advancement increases, but something that can stack with skills - akin to rigs. It'd probably mainly be module activation cycle bonuses, capacitor usage, etc.

Larger ships would have more "crew slots" allowing you to have bigger bonuses or more different ones - like rigs.

If the ship is destroyed, the crew is lost. (like rigs... just kidding, I'll stop now) Or they have a very low chance of dropping as loot or salvage. Perhaps a 5%-20% chance for each "crew unit" dropping "intact" with its accrued skill, and/or a chance to produce a blank "crew unit" from salvaging a wreck.

If the crew is inactive for a certain period of time, it begins to lose its bonus, dwindling down to a blank slate.

Crew units would be tradeable on a personnel market. This would flatten the playing field, allowing people not interested in grinding to acquire the elite crews as well.


I kinda like parts about this. Take out the crew dropping as loot, or being able to sell the ship or crew members on the market or contracts. If you repackage or contract it the crew bonus gets set to 0.

You can build your crew up and in turn they will get better flying the ship. Maybe boost the ships resistances slightly the more your shot, boost the weapon damage the more you shoot, or any of the other attributes pertaining to that ship. Once you lose the ship you lose your crew with there bonuses.

I can see people building up ratting ships and saving them, but as long as the bonus is minimal it could be fun.
Marduk Nibiru
Chaos Delivery Systems
#92 - 2011-12-24 00:02:29 UTC
Zoltar wrote:
Horatius Caul wrote:
Nova Fox wrote:
There are those who say put this on the crew, so when crew dies you lose thier experince they provided.

Hmmm... now that could actually work...

Crew could develop certain bonuses over time. This would probably not be skill advancement increases, but something that can stack with skills - akin to rigs. It'd probably mainly be module activation cycle bonuses, capacitor usage, etc.

Larger ships would have more "crew slots" allowing you to have bigger bonuses or more different ones - like rigs.

If the ship is destroyed, the crew is lost. (like rigs... just kidding, I'll stop now) Or they have a very low chance of dropping as loot or salvage. Perhaps a 5%-20% chance for each "crew unit" dropping "intact" with its accrued skill, and/or a chance to produce a blank "crew unit" from salvaging a wreck.

If the crew is inactive for a certain period of time, it begins to lose its bonus, dwindling down to a blank slate.

Crew units would be tradeable on a personnel market. This would flatten the playing field, allowing people not interested in grinding to acquire the elite crews as well.


I kinda like parts about this. Take out the crew dropping as loot, or being able to sell the ship or crew members on the market or contracts. If you repackage or contract it the crew bonus gets set to 0.

You can build your crew up and in turn they will get better flying the ship. Maybe boost the ships resistances slightly the more your shot, boost the weapon damage the more you shoot, or any of the other attributes pertaining to that ship. Once you lose the ship you lose your crew with there bonuses.

I can see people building up ratting ships and saving them, but as long as the bonus is minimal it could be fun.


So long as you can order them to abandon ship, causing a blob of pods to spawn, distracting those trying to pop you in their bubble until you get away...
Ris Dnalor
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#93 - 2011-12-24 00:16:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Ris Dnalor
you grind for isk. With that isk you can buy implants which increase your skill training. So, really, you can grind to get skill points faster, indirectly.

enough grind is enough.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961

EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody

  • Qolde
Sarah Schneider
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#94 - 2011-12-24 00:34:24 UTC
Landrae wrote:
Apollo Gabriel wrote:
I really think eve could benefit from some sort of skill point grinding system. However it should be limited in how many points per day you could gain, so it wasn't mandatory, but it could give new players something to "work for" until they get the ropes better.

I think Active skills would be the best way to do it, so guns and missile skill points are learned while being used, in addition to the normal training. Again, only a few thousand points per day (good training now is 2800 pts per hour)


no, just no. Eve is great because its the only game that doesnt have a gaytarded leveling system.

+1

if ccp put some kind of grind-your-sp system, i'll definitely bail.

"I'd rather have other players get shot by other players than not interacting with others" -CCP Soundwave

Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#95 - 2011-12-24 02:44:10 UTC
Guys, guys...what Eve really needs is Night Elves!

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.

Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#96 - 2011-12-24 03:05:30 UTC
Quote:
Did you actually come here to say something constructive or are you just trolling?


What I said is very constructive, it just goes against what you want so you don't like it. I have played other video games where players talked devs into stupid ****. I am very thankful that the skill system is exactly as it is in EvE. Adding a grind to it would cause many people to leave the game. There is PLENTY of grind for the people who WANT it.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it

Marduk Nibiru
Chaos Delivery Systems
#97 - 2011-12-24 03:34:26 UTC
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Guys, guys...what Eve really needs is Night Elves!


Underwear gnomes!
Anndy
The Evocati
#98 - 2011-12-24 03:37:39 UTC
sounds to me like someone just wants more skills but is unwilling to wait for it
Selinate
#99 - 2011-12-24 04:14:50 UTC
You know what Eve would really benefit from? Banning alt accounts.
Gorefacer
State War Academy
Caldari State
#100 - 2011-12-24 04:30:41 UTC
Marduk Nibiru wrote:
Jimi Crackcorn wrote:
Marduk Nibiru wrote:
I'm a dumbass


Here is your one mistake, if you would'vejust realized this, you would've saved yourself about 100 lines of text. You're ASSUMING that you would HAVE to grind for it and completely ignoring the fact that it would just be something to supplement the way you do play the game.


Actually, my mistake was taking you seriously and treating you like an intelligent individual when all evidence pointed to the contrary.

What's it like being that stupid? I've always been incredibly curious but none of you stupid people will tell me. I imagine it must be sort of like when I'm super drunk or haven't slept for like 2 weeks or something....but one can never know until someone's willing to describe it.

Anyway, don't really expect an answer here either. Good luck with your brilliant plan. I hope that it gets all the attention that it deserves.


Do a bunch of coke. Come up with a dumb plan that sounds brilliant in your coked out brain. Idiots are the luckiest bastards alive.