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Monitor Battleships
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Freelancer117
So you want to be a Hero
#1 - 2015-03-18 22:16:18 UTC
a long long time ago... we had the opportunity to design attack battlecruisers

I would like to see another contest for a new ship class: Monitor Battleships

Monitor Battleships like attack battlecruisers can fit weapon systems normally reserved for a higher hull class.

e.g. a Tornado can fit large Battleship-grade weapons



A Monitor Battleship can fit Dreadnought-grade weapons.

CCP could do another design contest for these new class of Warships

By fitting a capital weapon to a battleship hull, penalties will be incurred to most likely mass, inertia, tracking/explosion velocity, signature (?)

The Monitor warship class (one per empire faction) can be used to enhance pvp gameplay, and adds capital weapons (in a limited way) to the Empire faction space, carefully balanced by CCP and with feedback from CSM

Eve online is :

A) mining simulator B) glorified chatroom C) spreadsheets online

D) CCP Games Pay to Win at skill leveling, with instant gratification

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Zimmer Jones
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2015-03-18 22:27:01 UTC
Look at dread gun stats. You will need some decent bonuses in order to get those guns up to bs level DPs, and huge amounts of tracking.

Also, I believe I have seen this post before. Pretty recently.

Use the force without consent and the court wont acquit you even if you are a card carryin', robe wearin' Jedi.
Anhenka
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2015-03-18 22:30:29 UTC
The careful balance part prevents their existence.

The feedback from the CSM would say "There is no way to make these ships viable on a small scale, and not incredibly overpowered when I put 500 of them in one place"

This is not the first "BS as a mini dreadnaught" thread, and it won't be the last, but they never end well. There's really no mix of downsides and upsides to this concept that create a ship that is both useful and not horribly overpowered in some situations.
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#4 - 2015-03-18 22:50:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Arthur Aihaken
Freelancer117 wrote:
A Monitor Battleship can fit Dreadnought-grade weapons.

I'd rather have the ability to switch from large weapons to a secondary array of medium weapons (addendum: without refitting or having to deploy a mobile depot). Just my $0.02.

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Elenahina
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2015-03-18 22:51:12 UTC
You have a significant balance issue here.

1. As is, dreadnought guns have terrible DPS and tracking. It's only in seige mode that they get good.
2. If you made them viable for battleship size hulls, they would be so OP in seige mode on actual dreads, it would be hilariously bad.

Eve is like an addiction; you can't quit it until it quits you. Also, iderno
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#6 - 2015-03-18 22:53:34 UTC
Elenahina wrote:
1. As is, dreadnought guns have terrible DPS and tracking. It's only in seige mode that they suck less.

Fixed it for you.

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Oscae
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#7 - 2015-03-18 22:58:22 UTC
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
I'd rather have the ability to switch from large weapons to a secondary array of medium weapons (addendum: without refitting or having to deploy a mobile depot). Just my $0.02.

I always wondered why my battleships never had point defense...
Zura Namee
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2015-03-19 00:46:05 UTC
Elenahina wrote:
You have a significant balance issue here.

1. As is, dreadnought guns have terrible DPS and tracking. It's only in seige mode that they get good.
2. If you made them viable for battleship size hulls, they would be so OP in seige mode on actual dreads, it would be hilariously bad.


That's something that can be baked into the hull to keep dreds where they are.

As for the idea.... OP will need to actually figure out those baked-in bonuses that make this ship worth using without being the only ship worth using.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#9 - 2015-03-19 01:08:50 UTC
Oscae wrote:
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
I'd rather have the ability to switch from large weapons to a secondary array of medium weapons (addendum: without refitting or having to deploy a mobile depot). Just my $0.02.

I always wondered why my battleships never had point defense...

Energy neuts, drones, webs, scrams, friends, massive tank (relative to smaller ships), and/or any combination of the aforementioned things.

How did you Veterans start?
Tusker Crazinski
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2015-03-19 03:17:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Tusker Crazinski
As much as I like the idea, I've seen 1400s miss near stationary NPC cruisers just because riding an alignment vector kicked the angular velocity up too high. now I could only imagine cap guns would be much much worse. the only use I could see for these ships is alpha striking caps, and alpha striking battleships with the assistance of Serpentis webs.

ShahFluffers wrote:
Oscae wrote:
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
I'd rather have the ability to switch from large weapons to a secondary array of medium weapons (addendum: without refitting or having to deploy a mobile depot). Just my $0.02.

I always wondered why my battleships never had point defense...

smartbombs


fixed
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#11 - 2015-03-19 03:31:07 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Tusker Crazinski wrote:
As much as I like the idea, I've seen 1400s miss near stationary NPC cruisers just because riding an alignment vector kicked the angular velocity up too high. now I could only imagine cap guns would be much much worse. the only use I could see for these ships is alpha striking caps, and alpha striking battleships with the assistance of Serpentis webs.

You need the Siege Mode's 500-600% damage bonus to be able to one/two-shot battleships with capital weapons.

Without Siege Mode bonuses, the most dps 3x capital weapons can deal is 1000 to 2000.


It's the ship bonuses and/or that single mod that make capital weapons work well. They otherwise suck. What?

How did you Veterans start?
Elenahina
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2015-03-19 03:35:54 UTC
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
Elenahina wrote:
1. As is, dreadnought guns have terrible DPS and tracking. It's only in seige mode that they suck less.

Fixed it for you.


Touche

Eve is like an addiction; you can't quit it until it quits you. Also, iderno
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#13 - 2015-03-19 04:50:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Arthur Aihaken
ShahFluffers wrote:
You need the Siege Mode's 500-600% damage bonus to be able to one/two-shot battleships with capital weapons.

Let's not forget stasis webs and target painters as a requirement for this to occur.

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Iroquoiss Pliskin
9B30FF Labs
#14 - 2015-03-19 05:39:26 UTC
If you want to see battleships make a comeback, then there is another solution: Bastion-type/class module for all current battleships.

Perhaps, it could have lesser stats than the current marauders version, but something like this needs to happen in this age of nanofag Ishtars and T3s with 350k EHP.

// [PvP Damage Done by Class (Scylla)] //

[Cruisers Online]
Sigras
Conglomo
#15 - 2015-03-19 07:12:56 UTC
If you want to see battleships make a comeback, you have to introduce some sort of AOE mechanic (Bombs) that effects cruisers.

Why would anyone ever fly battleships when cruisers are 80% as good and arent susceptible to hardly any AOE?

I suppose you could also remove bombs from the game, but then it just turns into a completely un-tactical "he who brings more wins more" situation.
Tabyll Altol
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#16 - 2015-03-19 07:40:21 UTC
Freelancer117 wrote:
a long long time ago... we had the opportunity to design attack battlecruisers

I would like to see another contest for a new ship class: Monitor Battleships

Monitor Battleships like attack battlecruisers can fit weapon systems normally reserved for a higher hull class.

e.g. a Tornado can fit large Battleship-grade weapons



A Monitor Battleship can fit Dreadnought-grade weapons.

CCP could do another design contest for these new class of Warships

By fitting a capital weapon to a battleship hull, penalties will be incurred to most likely mass, inertia, tracking/explosion velocity, signature (?)

The Monitor warship class (one per empire faction) can be used to enhance pvp gameplay, and adds capital weapons (in a limited way) to the Empire faction space, carefully balanced by CCP and with feedback from CSM


No use a dread if you wanna big damage use a bs for good dmg and a good tank with remote rep.

-1
Duchess Starbuckington
Doomheim
#17 - 2015-03-19 08:49:59 UTC
Oh look it's this idea again.
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#18 - 2015-03-19 10:27:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Zan Shiro
Freelancer117 wrote:


Monitor Battleships like attack battlecruisers can fit weapon systems normally reserved for a higher hull class.

e.g. a Tornado can fit large Battleship-grade weapons




this crap gets old....


you are aware of the fact the tradeoff for this ability is around a 50% reduction in tank on the tier 3's...right? Looked at 2 races...tank drops down about 50% for the ABC versus CBC. Going to assume the other 2 do as well


You are also aware if you take 50% off most BS tanks....they tank less than BC (tier 1 or 2)....right?

Since you people keep on using ABC as the model for this bad idea...you would get this 50% tank reduction too.

Your ship in other words will be shot out long before it has applied any dps in measurable amount on the field. YOU see this besides siege is what makes dreads work. They don't instapop on landing next to a pos with guns.

Stop using ABC as basis for this argument. Leave empire, see how real bash ops go (i.e. guns are placed and online, defence shows up to save it) then tell me how a BS with larger guns but no tank is worth 2 craps. Crap tracking it be marginal at best as a gate camper even....and that be with paint and web support out the ass. Even then....you are better off with current bs's in game.
Agondray
Avenger Mercenaries
VOID Intergalactic Forces
#19 - 2015-03-19 14:15:51 UTC
Oscae wrote:
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
I'd rather have the ability to switch from large weapons to a secondary array of medium weapons (addendum: without refitting or having to deploy a mobile depot). Just my $0.02.

I always wondered why my battleships never had point defense...


this, we have 8 guns where as other spaceship games have ships bristling with all sorts of weapons of different sizes for different purposes.

also I have seen this before, like the people that want t3 everything like t3 cruisers, everyone wants frigates that can use cruiser weapons, cruisers that can use bs weapons etc.

"Sarcasm is the Recourse of a weak mind." -Dr. Smith
Wylde Kardde
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2015-03-19 15:58:57 UTC
Might as well make a Doomsday Bantam while were at it

How about a fix to the nyx and make it an Ishtar

Every ship can fit cov-ops cloaks free

Can I haz win please

Honestly when I read "monitor battleship" I thought this was going to be a Tech2 Warfare Link ship idea like an up sized command ship or something... They gave us glass cannon insta pop gate camp overkill (T3 BC's) and you just want more now?

The Origional Intention of Pirate BS's... pvp

Nightmare X-type Burn out

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyajGLoe0Kc
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