These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
Previous page12
 

You want to get rid of the stagnation and blue donuts in nullsec?

First post
Author
Adrie Atticus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#21 - 2015-03-18 10:14:49 UTC
tmasher wrote:
[quote]
Not only did you not bother reading my original post, you apparently didn't bother reading my response, either.

This actually represents what an attacker would gain over an 8-hour period (aka one timezone of constant activity) of uncontested assault with two-hour timers:
http://puu.sh/gEMDv/038b2eb455.png


I personally read your proposal and addendums, this is what a group can achieve with 4 systems deep from NPC null inside 8 hours:

http://i.imgur.com/bagnw3D.jpg

This is only from NPC null or empire space, if let's say geminate and kalevala expanse attacked vale at the same time with no defenders, you'd be looking at a massive loss inside a single time zone. Instead of just looking at one avenue of attack, factor in all the possible directions per region. This is obviously as you stated a situation of zero defenders and optimal conditions, but as a whole there would be zero reason to live anywhere except at least one region deep from any NPC nullsec or empire.

Would this create a more dynamic [sic] nullsec? Yes, definitely. Is a system like this feasible and going to keep subscribers any better than current waiting game? Nope.
tmasher
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#22 - 2015-03-18 10:39:02 UTC
Anhenka wrote:
tmasher wrote:
~snip~


Why exactly did you base all of those off of the assumption that they are starting at only one spot?


It was easier to draw.

Quote:
Space control is a funny thing. You don't have to kill their fleets, then stand nicely by and allow them to reship and get coordinated again. If you start an operation by dropping a heavy camp on their staging system, you can make it immensely difficult to get out of the station alive. Bubble it to hell, massacre their logistics as they try and get off the undock, and use bombers to wipe the rest away long before they make it out of the bubbles. It's not like the mass undock is ever going to be a surprise, spies are far too common for a major breakout op not to be spoiled in advance.


What you're describing literally already happens under the current sov system and nothing will change that with the new proposal. If anything this will become easier, as an attacker under the new proposal will no longer need to send significant portions of potential combat fleets to grind through structures while other segments hellcamp the defenders' staging, as they can just send like 10 rifters with sov lasers instead.

So in that regard, nothing really changes. Depending on how far from a non-secure border an entity's staging system is, it will still require days' worth of invasion before a staging system can be taken and an alliance "headshot".

Quote:
Thank you for the dictionary post but I have several of them on my desk but as usual you picked the one that supports your idea and not the most common definition.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/dynamic
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/dynamic
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/dynamic


I'm sorry to burst your bubble but my definition resulted from me typing in "definition of dynamic" into Google and using the first result: http://puu.sh/gFeuM/1851ed1bf8.png

So who should we believe is a more legitimate and dependable source on what definition of a word is most common or relevant? You or Google? My vote is with Google.


Quote:
Got to love this, because I disagree with your ridiculous idea you immediately lump me into the "do not change anything" group that is so typical of so many on these forums. I want nul to change, I want it to become a viable and vibrant area of this game but your idea is not going to bring that about as the ultimate end to the chaos on confusion it will cause is the large power blocks still holing onto and controlling all of the worthwhile segments of nul.


I don't understand the logic behind this (probably because there is none). First you say my idea will cause nothing but chaos, but now you've back-pedalled and are claiming it will all go back to normal?

First off, nothing in the system CCP has proposed will change the status quo. Instead of fleets of Ishtars and supers grinding through sov, we'll have sov lasers and incredibly limited 4-hour windows in which all sov is literally invulnerable for 20 hours every day. That is literally the opposite of change. That is, if anything, ensuring the status quo.

But you're right in that my idea won't prevent the large power blocs and alliances controlling the best sov. Nothing will change that, and nothing really should change it. The idea here isn't to prevent the largest groups from holding all the worthwhile segments of null - it's only to prevent the largest groups from holding all of the sov. Which is exactly what's happened. 90% of nullsec is controlled by 3 entities who are under virtually no threat of losing any of it save for some cataclysmic political eruption, failcascade or drama. And the 10% they don't control is the small pocket of the most worthless space that one group is letting a smaller entity have because it's fun to **** on them all day.

Under my suggestion, holding onto this much space will simply be impossible. Holding onto any space without having people willing and able to defend it in short order will be impossible. These vast stretches of mostly-empty space inhabited by a handful of botting ratters will no longer exist as the sov-space of a monolithic entity worlds away.

So please explain to me why you think this isn't true?
Agondray
Avenger Mercenaries
VOID Intergalactic Forces
#23 - 2015-03-18 13:49:33 UTC
Unite all of highsec, go to war against null...stagnate problem solved.

PS the wars are a joke, I highly doubt its to actually try and gain more sov and the army alts of spies will insure it stays stagnate

"Sarcasm is the Recourse of a weak mind." -Dr. Smith

Daide Vondrichnov
French Drop-O-Panache
Snuffed Out
#24 - 2015-03-18 14:41:17 UTC
Agondray wrote:
PS the wars are a joke, I highly doubt its to actually try and gain more sov and the army alts of spies will insure it stays stagnate



Guud fights, that's what they said.
Kirkra
The Versa-Ex Corp
#25 - 2015-03-18 20:32:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Kirkra
tmasher wrote:


Do you have any actual reason why this shouldn't occur? Because I see no reason why people who can't or won't defend their space when it's attacked (and not 48+ hours later) shouldn't lose a bit of space.


Here's one: Christmas. Another one: National Turkey Day (or whatever it's called in USA).

Question: Have you ever tried to assemble a CTA fleet on Christmas Eve? Ask your FCs if you're not one. Most people will digitally flip you off.

Here's a fun fact connected to that: Catholic Christmas is not celebrated in non-catholic countries. Now there aren't any major Japanese or Middle-east based alliances in the game (and China is on another server entirely), but there are several based in Russia and Ukraine. You know, Orthodox countries. The ones that celebrate Christmas in January. December 25 and 26 are just two days just like the rest for them. If it falls on the weekend - perfect days for a fight.

So do you really want to lose half your space because most of your alliance decided that family is more important than spaceships? I know I wouldn't.

Different countries around the globe have very different "special" dates. Public holidays and family celebrations. Or just institutionalized flash-mobs like Black Friday. An alliance, even a multinational one, like a EU + US + AU should expect to be incapacitated in a predictable manner on Christmas and New Years and possibly weakened on several other dates like St. Valentines.

One of the things the "48 hours" timer allows for is exactly this. It makes sure that your alliance can go have a public holiday and not get evicted. Your FCs can go to Fanfest and expect to return to a maybe besieged, but functional forward base.



Another thing I disagree with you on is that you seem to think that flipping sov should be quick. If sov is so quick to lose and to gain there is no incentive to build up. It won't feel like it's yours. I certainly am against the grind, it has way too many downsides, but I am for it taking a couple of days per system (and OK with several systems contested at the same time)
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#26 - 2015-03-18 22:18:02 UTC
So basically they'd end our 0.0 dream, and then later on we'd end their 0.0 dream.


Sounds like it would shake up nullsec indeed.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#27 - 2015-03-19 00:34:38 UTC
Quote:
5. Trolling is prohibited.

Trolling is a defined as a post that is deliberately designed for the purpose of angering and insulting other players in an attempt to incite retaliation or an emotional response. Posts of this nature are disruptive, often abusive, and do not contribute to the sense of community that CCP promote.


Thread closed.

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode

Senior Lead

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

Previous page12