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Corporation : New tool to track down thieves
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Bouba Centaury

Nordique Teck

Likes received: 11

#1 - 2015-03-17 14:53:48 UTC | Edited by: Bouba Centaury

Hi,

Recently my corpo was victim of a theft. This corpo member "cedrus glabra" stole all content of the corpo hangars which he had access.
The thief ended by unveiled, but during the time I was looking to find the thief, I quickly realized, that I did not have all the tools to flush it out.

Add a new tool :
In Corporation window, add a tool that will allow the CEO and director to see who put items (example : bpc, ore, vessel, ect.) in the corporation hangar and who takes the item.
We need to have a complete history of all deposits and withdrawals in the hangars of the corporation.
The list will be sorted by date, newest to oldest.

Edit : 2015.03.17 - More explanation and I add an example below

Here is a brief example of the result that could be generated by this new tool. (is just suggestion)

The result for the list is based on that found in the Wallet, / Journal tab or Transactions tab

There would be four columns : Date, Member name, Action and Description.
The columns will allow us to change the list display.
You have a button Load for display next page
You have seach tool for a specific display result
it's a static list (like a Journal tab in Walltet).
This need is a short-term need. It will help to manage the immediate problems. It is not necessary to retain long time data. 30 day of data would be more than enough and would reduce bd.

Date | Member name | Action | Description
2015-03-17 16:03:51 | Mister X | Deposit |1350 Isogen, 2455 Mexallon, 2522 Pyerite
2015-03-17 08:20:01 | Mister Y | withdrawal | 1 Orca
2015-03-16 12:01:52 | Mister Z | withdrawal | 2 Veldspar mining crystal
2015-03-15 01:11:34 | Mister Z |Deposit | 400 Antimatter Charge S, 53 Scraps Metal, 12 Tripped Power Circuit

Thank's

Asuka Solo

I N E X T R E M I S

Tactical Narcotics Team

Likes received: 3,024

#2 - 2015-03-17 15:05:00 UTC | Edited by: Asuka Solo

Auditing for corp hangers and assets....... not opposed to it at all....

hmmmmm... But now I'm trying to imagine how this will STOP corp theft and what value it will add to your posts in crime & punishment....

Scenario A:
i) Player 1 steals stuff from Corp 1.
ii) Trades it in a station to Player 2 from Corp 2.
iii) Sends toon on a 1 way trip to Doomheim.
iv) Redundant auditing feature becomes redundant...

Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!

Omnathious Deninard

University of Caille

Gallente Federation

Likes received: 3,623

#3 - 2015-03-17 15:09:46 UTC | Edited by: Omnathious Deninard

Asuka Solo wrote:

It wont stop it, but at least appropriate bounties can be placed afterward Big smile

Edit: OP sucks you lost assets but that's part of the game, and is allowable and acceptable gameplay.
As far as the root of the idea, corporate hanger audit logs would be nice to have.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.

Asuka Solo

I N E X T R E M I S

Tactical Narcotics Team

Likes received: 3,024

#4 - 2015-03-17 15:12:19 UTC

Omnathious Deninard wrote:

Asuka Solo wrote:

It wont stop it, but at least appropriate bounties can be placed afterward Big smile

Edit: OP sucks you lost assets but that's part of the game, and is allowable and acceptable gameplay.
As far as the root of the idea, corporate hanger audit logs would be nice to have.

We really need a better emote for sarcasm....

Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!

Bouba Centaury

Nordique Teck

Likes received: 11

#5 - 2015-03-17 15:21:22 UTC

Asuka Solo wrote:

This tool flush out the thieving magpie!

Example : a ship disappears from the corpo hangar and you do not know who take the vessel.
The history list being in chronological order, we just have to look at who was the last player to take the ship and you have your answer.

If I remember correctly, we had a similar tool in WoW for guildbank.

Asuka Solo

I N E X T R E M I S

Tactical Narcotics Team

Likes received: 3,024

#6 - 2015-03-17 15:24:47 UTC

Bouba Centaury wrote:

Asuka Solo wrote:

I see my first comment went over your head.

Let's try again. Slowly.

Your new tool now gives you the name of a character that gets deleted after he robs you blind. i.e. this character no longer exists. And you can go on and on.. raving about a deleted character. At least you know who dun it amirite?

Show me how your tool adds value now that nothing can be done against the character.....

Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!

Bouba Centaury

Nordique Teck

Likes received: 11

#7 - 2015-03-17 15:35:47 UTC

Asuka Solo wrote:

[quote=Bouba Centaury][quote=Asuka Solo]Auditing for corp hangers and assets....... not opposed to it at all....

.....
I see my first comment went over your head.

Let's try again. Slowly.

Your new tool now gives you the name of a character that gets deleted after he robs you blind. i.e. this character no longer exists. And you can go on and on.. raving about a deleted character. At least you know who dun it amirite?

Show me how your tool adds value now that nothing can be done against the character.....

This is not a tool for retaliation.
It is rather a investigation or research tool. It helps to know everything that goes on in the corp hangar.

Doomheim 3
Apol Regyri Doomheim Likes received: 3	#8 - 2015-03-17 15:42:48 UTC 1 +1 Excellent tool, It will be a big gain for the management of the corpo hangar.

Reina Xyaer

Tha Lench Mob

Likes received: 99

#9 - 2015-03-17 16:24:11 UTC

Asuka Solo wrote:

Dude... you're talking as if EVERY single corp thief DELETES their character after a theft.

I would argue that probably doesn't even happen 50% of the time.

Forum troll detected.

"I see my first comment went over your head" - giant ******* troll
"Let's try again. Slowly" - huge pretentious douche

Danika Princip

GoonWaffe

Goonswarm Federation

Likes received: 5,563

#10 - 2015-03-17 16:26:36 UTC

Reina Xyaer wrote:

Asuka Solo wrote:

You're right, it's much easier to just sell the character instead.

Reina Xyaer

Tha Lench Mob

Likes received: 99

#11 - 2015-03-17 16:39:48 UTC

Danika Princip wrote:

You're right, it's much easier to just sell the character instead.

I'd be willing to bet that doesn't even happen 50% of the time either, in fact, I'd be willing to bet less than 30% of corp thieves delete or sell their characters.

OPs idea is perfectly reasonable, and there's NO reason not to have it.

I want to hear you say it Danika....

Sayyyy it....

Say an idea is good.

Is it physically possible for you to NOT be adverse to everything in F&I?

Nariya Kentaya

Ministry of War

Amarr Empire

Likes received: 1,916

#12 - 2015-03-17 16:44:01 UTC

Bouba Centaury wrote:

okay, but only if you can reprocess corpses to get a fake ID to register one of the other directors as the one who accessed the hangar instead of you (see, it adds a new safety mechanic, and balances it with an espionage mechanic, you kill a director or manage to snag his corpse and high tail it during a lowsec/nullsec op gone bad, you can frame him later on when you bail)

Bouba Centaury

Nordique Teck

Likes received: 11

#13 - 2015-03-17 16:45:03 UTC | Edited by: Bouba Centaury

Here is a brief example of the result that could be generated by this new tool. (is just suggestion)

The list is based on that found in the Wallet, / Journal tab or Transactions tab

There would be four columns : Date, Member name, Action and Description.
The columns will allow us to change the list display.
You have a button Load for display next page
You have seach tool for a specific display result
it's a static list (like a Journal tab in Walltet).

Date | Member name | Action | Description
2015-03-17 16:03:51 | Mister X | Deposit |1350 Isogen, 2455 Mexallon, 2522 Pyerite
2015-03-17 08:20:01 | Mister Y | withdrawal | 1 Orca
2015-03-16 12:01:52 | Mister Z | withdrawal | 2 Veldspar mining crystal
2015-03-15 01:11:34 | Mister Z |Deposit | 400 Antimatter Charge S, 53 Scraps Metal, 12 Tripped Power Circuit

Edit : this need is a short-term need. It will help to manage the immediate problems. It is not necessary to retain long time data. 30 day of data would be more than enough and would reduce bd.


Asuka Solo I N E X T R E M I S Tactical Narcotics Team Likes received: 3,024	#14 - 2015-03-17 17:16:31 UTC Reina Xyaer wrote: "I see my first comment went over your head" - giant ***** troll "Let's try again. Slowly" - huge pretentious douche Thank you... thank you.... I'll be here all night. Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!**

Bouba Centaury

Nordique Teck

Likes received: 11

#15 - 2015-03-17 17:27:53 UTC

Nariya Kentaya wrote:

[quote=Bouba Centaury]Hi,

......
Thank's
okay, but only if you can reprocess corpses to get a fake ID to register one of the other directors as the one who accessed the hangar instead of you (see, it adds a new safety mechanic, and balances it with an espionage mechanic, you kill a director or manage to snag his corpse and high tail it during a lowsec/nullsec op gone bad, you can frame him later on when you bail)

This need is a short-term need. It will help to manage the immediate problems. It is not necessary to retain long time data. 30 day of data would be more than enough and would reduce bd.

So, if the data are not kept long time, it will correct the problem you speak.

Ferran Espaillat

The Scope

Gallente Federation

Likes received: 5

#16 - 2015-03-17 22:19:00 UTC

I love the idea and not only because of having to deal with corp theft a few times.

EVE has continued to make headlines over the years, even in non-MMO gaming news, because the actions of a single player with a hidden agenda or mixed loyalties can have repercussions that are astonishing in scope - all possible within the game itself.

One of the aspects of EVE that I have disliked since I began playing is that the existing mechanics favor "subversive" player interactions - there are a number of resources available to guard against these instances, but most of them exist outside the game as third party applications. Within EVE, the only defensive "tools" given to players are:

1) A cumbersome system for managing roles, access, and permissions that desperately needs an overhaul
2) The ability to view a character's "Employment History" - a feature that is so rudimentary, it would be nearly useless even if it wasn't completely compromised by the fact that players can buy and sell characters.
3) The Bounty system, which, while an enjoyable addition to the game, is inherently limited because it is reactive, not proactive.

If CCP and the EVE community want to maintain the 'freedom' of a sandbox universe - one that allows a player to choose to betray, infiltrate, or steal from a group of other players - there should be ways for players to protect themselves from those potential threats, beyond adopting an attitude of constant paranoia and resorting to micromanagement of every detail.

So, CCP...

Players need better ways to manage and monitor designated corporate assets. I'm have no doubt that it's something "easier said than done", but that doesn't make it any less necessary.

Personally, I think you guys should take it all further - let's really make things interesting.

The "Retributive Justice" provided by the bounty system could be expanded upon extensively.

What if a CEO or officer, upon discovering a corporate theft, could pay a fee to have a special news bulletin show up on every space-billboard within a few constellations?

- Some players might notice the thief pass through their current system, and pass that information along for a bit of isk.
- Some players might offer completely bogus information, hoping to get a handout with no effort involved.
- A few players might decide that the alleged thief could be carrying enough valuables to make intercepting and capturing or ganking well worth the time.
- Players would actually read the billboards.

What if a corporation could (within reasonable constraints) declare one of its own members suspect, allowing them to be engaged by unaffiliated players?

What if someone in a corporation could try to frame one of its own members for theft?

One new twist to the justice system of New Eden, but so many possible outcomes. And that state, that concept, is invariably where EVE is at its best... a multiplicity of possibilities, a place where nobody can say, "Well now I've seen everything."

Donnachadh

United Allegiance of Undesirables

Likes received: 1,313

#17 - 2015-03-18 00:31:12 UTC

+1 for the OP
As the manager of a corp in real life we have such tools in place as a way of detecting and identifying those who would steal. Yes I know this is a game not real life but even here having such logs on valuable materials that belong to a corp make sense.

Asuka Solo wrote:

Your new tool now gives you the name of a character that gets deleted after he robs you blind. i.e. this character no longer exists. And you can go on and on.. raving about a deleted character. At least you know who dun it amirite?

Show me how your tool adds value now that nothing can be done against the character.....

First your statement and question assume that ALL characters used in corp theft are deleted, a fact that you cannot prove to be true.
So the real question should be how can this be gamed, abused in anyway to the detriment of a specific character, or the game as a whole? If it cannot then the number of times that it may prove useful is not relevant to it's inclusion in the game.


Bouba Centaury Nordique Teck Likes received: 11	#18 - 2015-03-18 02:08:58 UTC 1 Updade OP with more explanation and example

Apol Regyri

Doomheim

Likes received: 3

#19 - 2015-03-18 12:49:41 UTC

Ferran Espaillat wrote:

You are right, the actual tool to manage members and asset of a corporation are not very good. This is not an intuitive tool.
The tool suggest in OP is a beginning and it will be very useful for what is happening in the hangar.

With this new tool, CEO may have a better idea of the quality of the members of his corporation. He can watch those who really contributed to the corporation and it will find the profiteers and thieves.

French Drop-O-Panache Snuffed Out 59
Daide Vondrichnov French Drop-O-Panache Snuffed Out Likes received: 59	#20 - 2015-03-18 14:44:17 UTC \| Edited by: Daide Vondrichnov Well if you let newbies with acces and your ships floating in pos with no pw then don't be surprised if your skiff is missing, just sayin'. Get a better recrutment process and be careful that's all... If someone wants to awox you he'll do it at the end whatever you do.