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Entosis hull restrictions

Author
GeeShizzle MacCloud
#21 - 2015-03-05 13:32:40 UTC
suid0 wrote:
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
Yeah, um... no.

Every hull should have it. Looks like patrolling your space and dealing with trolls is going to become part of the new "So you want Sov, eh?" paradigm.


QFT.

If an Inty can reinforce your stuff within a 4 hour window inside your 'prime time' then you probably need to ask yourself,

do you really use that space?
and do you actually deserve it?



lol coming from a player of a mostly sovless entity, yah i would expect you to be entirely in the griefing camp on this.
Sinigr Shadowsong
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#22 - 2015-03-05 13:44:32 UTC
Interceptors are a concern since they are virtually untouchable. Cloaky nullified T3s are fine as are expensive, easier to catch and much more satisfying to kill than worthless throwaway instawarp ceptors on worthless throwaway alts. Bombers are fine as they can be catched on gates.

BC+ restriction sounds logical, and this is the exact reason why it can't be implemented.
suid0
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#23 - 2015-03-05 15:24:28 UTC
Sinigr Shadowsong wrote:
Interceptors are a concern since they are virtually untouchable. Cloaky nullified T3s are fine as are expensive, easier to catch and much more satisfying to kill than worthless throwaway instawarp ceptors on worthless throwaway alts. Bombers are fine as they can be catched on gates.

BC+ restriction sounds logical, and this is the exact reason why it can't be implemented.


They're not really worthless throwaway ceptors when they'll cost at least 100m each.

the entire enemy support fleet is dead except for one interdictor a titan could easily finish off with drones  - Commander Ted

suid0
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#24 - 2015-03-05 15:28:11 UTC
GeeShizzle MacCloud wrote:
suid0 wrote:
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
Yeah, um... no.

Every hull should have it. Looks like patrolling your space and dealing with trolls is going to become part of the new "So you want Sov, eh?" paradigm.


QFT.

If an Inty can reinforce your stuff within a 4 hour window inside your 'prime time' then you probably need to ask yourself,

do you really use that space?
and do you actually deserve it?



lol coming from a player of a mostly sovless entity, yah i would expect you to be entirely in the griefing camp on this.


It has nothing to do with griefing and everything to do with CCP attempting to make it difficult for you to defend unused & unpopulated space.

the entire enemy support fleet is dead except for one interdictor a titan could easily finish off with drones  - Commander Ted

Arla Sarain
#25 - 2015-03-05 15:39:21 UTC
Sinigr Shadowsong wrote:
Interceptors are a concern since they are virtually untouchable

Damp
ECM
Other small ships that WILL track ceptors

Can see interceptors getting through bubbles and making you **** your pants in paranoia of someone flipping the station services

But cannot really see the flip actually happening unless the system is just empty. In which case, working as intended? Unpopulated space must go.
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#26 - 2015-03-05 15:53:06 UTC
Trollceptors are only a threat to empty, barren Sov space.

If you want to rock about in a <2k ehp paper bag with an 80m mod that blocks warping hanging off your ass, you be my guest.

The missile boats will chew you up and spit you out.
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
#27 - 2015-03-05 16:01:18 UTC
I could see making the fitting requirements for the T2 link (the one with the ungodly range) high enough that a frigate would have a really hard time fitting them. But for the short range one? Yeah, let the trollceptors have at it at that range.

Relatively Notorious By Association

My Many Misadventures

I predicted FAUXs

suid0
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#28 - 2015-03-05 16:18:44 UTC
Bronson Hughes wrote:
I could see making the fitting requirements for the T2 link (the one with the ungodly range) high enough that a frigate would have a really hard time fitting them. But for the short range one? Yeah, let the trollceptors have at it at that range.


Hardly a problem when they can't lock that far.. and if they want to fully gimp fit just to get that range, they're not a threat anyway

the entire enemy support fleet is dead except for one interdictor a titan could easily finish off with drones  - Commander Ted

blackiice
Forging Industries
Silent Infinity
#29 - 2015-03-05 19:13:29 UTC
Why not make the link expensive. Make them 2 bil each and that will stop the trolling. Also make the link act like a triage or bastion module where you can't move while using it so it doesn't matter which hull you are in you are stuck and ready to be shot. Taking SOV shouldn't be THAT easy to take.
Alexis Nightwish
#30 - 2015-03-05 19:52:52 UTC
Hakan MacTrew wrote:
...And T3's should be banned from having it for sure. Cloaky 100mn MWD interdiction T3 + Entosis Link, I'll let you mull that over for a bit...

This was actually the very first thing I thought when I read about the Entosis.

There could even be a good lore reason why as the interface to the T3 cruiser precludes using the Entosis link.

CCP approaches problems in one of two ways: nudge or cludge

EVE Online's "I win!" Button

Fixing bombs, not the bombers

Swiftstrike1
Swiftstrike Incorporated
#31 - 2015-03-05 20:38:32 UTC
Arla Sarain wrote:
Instead of panicking and doing some kneejerk reaction change

wait and see if people find enough counters with what he have.

They're called damps. Plz Mr. Interceptor, tell me more about your 250km lock range...

Casual Incursion runner & Faction Warfare grunt, ex-Wormholer, ex-Nullbear.

Antillie Sa'Kan
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#32 - 2015-03-05 20:52:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Antillie Sa'Kan
Make activating the module set your max speed to 0 just like siege/triage/bastion. Problem solved.
Lienzo
Amanuensis
#33 - 2015-03-06 05:58:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Lienzo
I really don't like that we are throwing out one extreme of gameplay for another. In this case, we are throwing out big fleets centered around high HP barriers in favor of making everything susceptible to individuals.

We the players have developed networks to accommodate the former, but the latter aim at getting more people involved. I think we need content for both groups, all TZs, and all FCs interested in sov skirmishes. These networks are important for the game, so it would be better to add new goals and let organization spring up around them rather than wholesale deprecate them

To that end, keep the requirements for entosis modules low, but restrict their effects to SBUs or a few other infrastructure components. Leave the other structures the way they've traditionally been. Let's rely on skirmish fleets to make systems vulnerable or invulnerable to heavy ship deployments. Entosis links are a great way to regulate the viability of cyno inhibitors, or other invulnerability mechanics. This puts a soft limit on super cap deployments since they aren't going to split up and be spread all over a constellation, and rely on skirmish fleets to make objectives vulnerable.

I really don't think it would be a problem if the capitol systems of player empires had big generators that made their core structures largely invincible if their peripheral systems are not harassed, even against massive blobs. No headshotting player empires without a sustained campaign.

It was important in that past that we had an ecology of big HP walls and small HP walls upon which the big walls depend, and we just didn't have that, which was why we felt sov wasn't fun since you could only participate directly with a large group. Fozziesov as presently conceived simply doesn't promise content for all.

An ambitious approach would have content for individuals, content for small gangs, and content geared to large groups. At present, we are making large group content rely solely on player escalation, which could be somewhat problematic, and potentially just as dull as timers. A better approach puts timers a little varied in time, and allows lots of content for smaller groups between timers. The very best and most pitched form of skirmish content would be the kind that moves timers back and forth in time based on successful contests over these new sov buttons.
Catherine Laartii
Doomheim
#34 - 2015-03-06 06:39:57 UTC
How about instead of having the module limited to a ship type, have ship types be limited to the module? Giving them the same fitting stats as command links would alleviate concerns all around, as they'd mostly be usable on bc upwards, although cruisers could pull it off with a little effort.

afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#35 - 2015-03-06 08:16:14 UTC
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:
Make activating the module set your max speed to 0 just like siege/triage/bastion. Problem solved.



You're solving a problem that doesn't exist.

There's more hyperbole and utter bullshit around these modules and ships that may fit them than the next i-gizmo 98987987
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#36 - 2015-03-06 16:58:01 UTC
GeeShizzle MacCloud wrote:
suid0 wrote:
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
Yeah, um... no.

Every hull should have it. Looks like patrolling your space and dealing with trolls is going to become part of the new "So you want Sov, eh?" paradigm.


QFT.

If an Inty can reinforce your stuff within a 4 hour window inside your 'prime time' then you probably need to ask yourself,

do you really use that space?
and do you actually deserve it?



lol coming from a player of a mostly sovless entity, yah i would expect you to be entirely in the griefing camp on this.


Thus spake the forum alt.
Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#37 - 2015-03-06 17:48:31 UTC
The modules in question have been named as a Link. So I think there is a reasonable possibility they may be restricted to CBCs, CS, and link T3s.

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY

Chance Ravinne
WiNGSPAN Delivery Services
WiNGSPAN Delivery Network
#38 - 2015-03-06 18:17:57 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Promiscuous Medusa wrote:
Make it Battleship only solving the "why would we fly BS?" problem ¬_¬


I would like to point out that removing the ability to activate prop mods would functionally have an effect close to this. You know, seeing as battleships are hurt the least by lack of prop mod.


This is a much more reasonable solution to the perceived problem. It keeps uncontested space easy to win. It keeps contested space highly contested. It squashes kite trolling without outright excluding small or poor groups.

You've just read another awesome post by Chance Ravinne, CEO of EVE's #1 torpedo delivery service. Watch our misadventures on my YouTube channel: WINGSPANTT

Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
#39 - 2015-03-06 18:20:44 UTC
Petrified wrote:
After chewing on this over the last day I have come to slightly agree with those who are concerned with harassing gangs roaming about in Inties and Bombers with an Entosis modules just to grief (sorry, ibis invasions are too easy to pop to be taken seriously). Hulls capable of cloaking, hulls capable of bypassing gates easily, and interdiction nullification should not have it.

So, simply, the Entosis module should be restricted to Battlecruiser Hulls and only Battlecruiser class hulls.


CBC's not ABC's though

T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using

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