EVE General Discussion

Having used both the svipul and confessor in solo and gang pvp in both lowsec and w-space. Here is what I and my corp found:

They're epic.

Probably a bit too epic.

None of us will ever fly any other frigate sized ship into combat ever again, since:

no frigate can stand up to them
no two frigates working together can stand up to them
The svipul out-performs interceptors (at intercepting)
they out-dps most cruisers (taking into account small weapon tracking, make that *all* cruisers)
They can be dual propped, dual repped, armour tanked, shield tanked, bricks or (toughened) glass cannons.
Their cap is strong enough to easily support perma-MWD.
They can insta-warp by changing from speed to defence mode 1/3 of the way through alignment.
They have an enormous cargo hold for charges, loot, MTUs, mobile depots so make perfect wormhole loot delivery vans while being able to transform themselves from short range to long range fit and from pve to pvp fit, mid-mission without any penalties to performance.

They do not have a single weakness. There is not even the punishment of skill loss for losing one. The skill loss which incidentally is arguably the *only* reason that eve is not called "TenguQuest".

Oh, and once you've bought the fittings, a fully-fitted tactical destroyer is approximately the same price as any other T2 frigate, which it will easily mince.

Does the design team have any thoughts on this?

I mean, I know the community will instantly reply, "OiGetYourDirtyHandsOffMyNewShineyPwnMobile!!!", but I imagine the dev team will have a view on eve combat that is a little less myopic than that of us capsuleers?

I hope so anyway...

I think a Destroyer is supposed to do that.

On the other points...I got nothing.

A Navy slicer will solo your yolo* Confessor any day.

*DLP

They are hilariously overpowered. Given the history of t3 they wont be fixed for another 6 years.

EVE is filled to the brim with pad pilots. I would most likely manage to lose a T3 dessy to a solo T1 frig with how bad I am but that does not mean the ship is "balanced" because someone can solo someone else piloting it. Many people have more ISK then brain and will do stupid ****.

Yeah, the original destroyers aren't terrible at it but they're slow and all that boring balancy crap. Screw that! We'll just have new ships with fancy speed mods for when you want a destroyer but just can't be bothered to fly one.

Oh well, I suppose the idea behing T3 destroyers was to throw low sec a new toy, so, that's worked, I guess.

Destroyers are the solution to a 'frigate problem'.

Good to read there's finally some out there capable with their ship chassis role.

Counters to these ships are 'cruisers, battle cruisers', webs, nuets, bubbles, drones, more destroyers and pretty much, anything but their favourite crunchy snack, frigates.

In my experience with the 'fessor, which is extensive, both PVP and PVE, I disagree with all of the above. Mostly, I use a duel-rep fit which has one legitimate major weakness - neuts. A duel-prop or other kiting fit tends to be squishy as ****, (there was a one guy kept getting his ganked by 'nados in Jita when they first came out, it was hilarious) and they don't get any dps bonuses, so 80% of the time they are no more difficult to counter than any other kiting ship. And like any other kiting ship, usually low enough on DPS that they can be easily tanked.

"no frigate can stand up to them
no two frigates working together can stand up to them
they out-perform interceptors"

Good, working as intended. I always said from the very beginning, when the 'fessor first came out, these ships will be the first efficient counter to assault frigates (when I say efficient, I mean ships of the same size that aren't the same type) and that can only be a good thing given how highly capable assault frigates can be in the right hands.

"Their cap is strong enough to easily support perma-MWD."

Only if you sacrifice reps and/or dps on the 'fessor.My duel-rep fit requires a cap booster running afterburner, which means I only have one mid left for a warp scrambler. While it is tanky as all hell (I have permatanked gate guns in lowsec and duel-web lokis with autocannons with it, it'll tank over 400dps heated and put out over 350dps heated with pulses), it sacrifices a lot to get that tank. Likewise, in any other fitting configuration, it sacrifices things to be excellent at something else. Working as intended.

"They can insta-warp by changing from speed to defence mode 1/3 of the way through alignment."

If someone's clever enough to figure out how to get the best use out of each mode and mode switching, then good on 'em. Working as intended.

"They have an enormous cargo hold for charges, loot, MTUs, mobile depots so make perfect wormhole loot delivery vans while being able to transform themselves from short range to long range fit and from pve to pvp fit, mid-mission without any penalties to performance."

This is mostly correct, until that last bit - without any penalties to performance. Sorry, that's just wrong, because how a ship performs depends on the circumstances it's required to perform in. Mode switching is not some 'I win' button that suddenly changes your entire fit, it just doesn't work that way.

The first thing I did with my friends when I first got my 'fessor was figure out how to kill 'em. It's not that hard if you put your mind to it, depends on how they're fit and how the pilot is flying it and just like in any given PVP situation, that requires 'reading your opponent', but at the end of the day, T3 destroyers explode like anything else.

I will agree with one thing - they feel a little cheap for what they are. I just took a look at current prices and I'll say this much, I felt more comfortable with their cost when they were around the 150-200 mil mark.

Question: let's say you're not pulling numbers out of your backside, does a ship that size with a 10MN mwd do anything OTHER than go at 22m/s? Because I've seen similar things done with a wide variety of ships, including Caracals and Talos', and 100% of the time they're hitting unrealistically high and uncatchable speeds while being incapable of anything else. Yet no one seems to have a problem with those...