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Point Defense System

Author
Kestral Anneto
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1 - 2015-02-19 15:02:03 UTC
Ok, so as a further to the idea that i had in the thread i started earlier today ragarding Battleships and there current uselessness in PVP.
so, throw my idea into the cauldron thats probably already been suggested.

Point Defense Module:-

High Slot
Battleship only
When active has a movement penalty of 40%.
Base chance of 50% to destroy any incoming bomb, when destroyed, bomb will still detonate but have 50% reduced blast radius.
can be loaded with scripts to either increase % chance of destruction, or further reduce blast raduis.

Given the power projection changes, lets give battleships a reason to exist in the game outside of PVE, they are the biggest sub cap, and should be the most powerful.
Arla Sarain
#2 - 2015-02-19 15:14:30 UTC
Bonus to defender missiles and bomb priority for defenders and higher damage against bombs.

Suddenly defenders.
Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#3 - 2015-02-19 15:22:38 UTC
If only defender missiles would target bombs...

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY

FireFrenzy
Cynosural Samurai
#4 - 2015-02-19 16:55:43 UTC
I have often thought on something like this, although mine was more designed as an IRL CIWS weapn system.

A small turret that loaded with small ammo (sure you can fit it to your battleships utility slot but its going to need ALOT of ammo) that turns incoming missles (and maybe frigates??? i've seen those things chew through boats on youtube) into mush...

You could have lasers drain BOATLOADS of cap instead of chewing through ammo, and maybe have different types/ranges... Rails having a longer effective range but a lower chance to actually HIT or needing more shots/hits per missles then the more inclose blasters?

Might make for a cool role in a fleet to combat bombers, a few guys rocking around in destroyers with a rack of these things being kept on hand to keep the bombers in check? With them getting a high priority for OPFOR to take down if they have bomber support, or NOT and then doing a cool double fakeout type thing...

Ofcourse you could just make defenders do something and save a lot of work, as cool as though the idea of a thrasher with a bunch of full auto chainguns Zipping around the fleet RACING to get into range of the incoming bombs before everything turns into a mushroom cloud is... (I can see the eve video already)
Master Sergeant MacRobert
Red Sky Morning
The Amarr Militia.
#5 - 2015-02-19 17:15:04 UTC
FireFrenzy wrote:


You could have lasers drain BOATLOADS of cap instead of chewing through ammo, and maybe have different types/ranges... Rails having a longer effective range but a lower chance to actually HIT or needing more shots/hits per missles then the more inclose blasters?



Coz Amarr BS are so cap stable already.

No.

If they do it. Have it fire its own type of ammo and have one variant fit all BS.

I prefer the idea of making use of an already in game asset )that currently does not work) but PD Turrets sounds better than PD Missiles.

Certainly BS should be the ship of the line, soak up damage for the fleet hulls. Perhaps a regenerative armour module and passive shield regen amplifier should be considered, for these hulls (ie: BS only)?

"Remedy this situation or you shall live out the rest of your life in a pain amplifier"

Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#6 - 2015-02-19 20:12:05 UTC
This goes too far the other way, and makes bombers entirely useless.
Sinigr Shadowsong
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2015-02-19 21:23:30 UTC
Bombers are fine, no need to nerf them. And, as said above, we have broken defender missiles so it's always better to fix an obsolete system instead of introducing new one to do it's role.
Kiandoshia
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#8 - 2015-02-19 22:01:44 UTC
Undo warp speed changes

Suddenly battleships are a thing.
Tabyll Altol
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2015-02-20 09:15:01 UTC
Kestral Anneto wrote:
Ok, so as a further to the idea that i had in the thread i started earlier today ragarding Battleships and there current uselessness in PVP.
so, throw my idea into the cauldron thats probably already been suggested.

Point Defense Module:-

High Slot
Battleship only
When active has a movement penalty of 40%.
Base chance of 50% to destroy any incoming bomb, when destroyed, bomb will still detonate but have 50% reduced blast radius.
can be loaded with scripts to either increase % chance of destruction, or further reduce blast raduis.

Given the power projection changes, lets give battleships a reason to exist in the game outside of PVE, they are the biggest sub cap, and should be the most powerful.


How about no. Why is it that everybody is pissed about bombs. I just love them, its a posibility to wipe out a bigger fleet with a smaller fleet. Such things are needed more not less. So smaller alliances can hold space in 0.0 too.

-1
Kestral Anneto
State War Academy
Caldari State
#10 - 2015-02-20 09:16:53 UTC
Tabyll Altol wrote:
Kestral Anneto wrote:
Ok, so as a further to the idea that i had in the thread i started earlier today ragarding Battleships and there current uselessness in PVP.
so, throw my idea into the cauldron thats probably already been suggested.

Point Defense Module:-

High Slot
Battleship only
When active has a movement penalty of 40%.
Base chance of 50% to destroy any incoming bomb, when destroyed, bomb will still detonate but have 50% reduced blast radius.
can be loaded with scripts to either increase % chance of destruction, or further reduce blast raduis.

Given the power projection changes, lets give battleships a reason to exist in the game outside of PVE, they are the biggest sub cap, and should be the most powerful.


How about no. Why is it that everybody is pissed about bombs. I just love them, its a posibility to wipe out a bigger fleet with a smaller fleet. Such things are needed more not less. So smaller alliances can hold space in 0.0 too.

-1


I'd rather have Battleships be a thing over bombers anyday of the week
Zimmer Jones
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2015-02-20 21:43:59 UTC
In my boozed up mind it could be workable if:

*Bombs had less flight time and higher velocity
*Defenders missiles have a good chance to miss.
*Said missiles are single shots per reload, are fire and forget, target only the closest bomb, and do not retarget the next bomb in line.
*firing Defender missiles increase Sig by a very large margin
*destroying a bomb ONLY destroys it, no blast radius/damage

Tbh i think the only defense from bombs should be instalocking high alpha ships. Better to have a specially fitted ship to take out a niche ship with specialized weapons.

Use the force without consent and the court wont acquit you even if you are a card carryin', robe wearin' Jedi.

Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
#12 - 2015-02-21 00:56:30 UTC
Yep. It would be much better if CCP retasked Defender Missles into a proper Point Defense Module. Smart Bombs can be useful... but not in High Sec.

Such a module would auto target until destroyed the nearest missile or bomb then move to the next.

Such a module will fit in a high slot, use a lot of CPU, a decent amount of cap, have a fast cycle time, and have a short range - no more than 10KM.
The module will also reduce the scan resolution of the ship since the module taps into the system's sensors but in turn it auto-targets based on locked ordinance and nearby bombs.
Only one module can be fitted to the ship, uses a rapid pulse laser to perforate the incoming ordinance into uselessness.
The module is either on or off and reduces overall cap (module maintains a stored charge) and drains cap while firing.

A more advanced version could allow discrimination to auto-target only bombs or only missiles.

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.

Arya Regnar
Darwins Right Hand
#13 - 2015-02-21 01:44:19 UTC
What's wrong with bombs...

EvE-Mail me if you need anything.

Kabark
Schilden
#14 - 2015-02-21 09:17:48 UTC
Petrified wrote:
Yep. It would be much better if CCP retasked Defender Missles into a proper Point Defense Module. Smart Bombs can be useful... but not in High Sec.

Such a module would auto target until destroyed the nearest missile or bomb then move to the next.

Such a module will fit in a high slot, use a lot of CPU, a decent amount of cap, have a fast cycle time, and have a short range - no more than 10KM.
The module will also reduce the scan resolution of the ship since the module taps into the system's sensors but in turn it auto-targets based on locked ordinance and nearby bombs.
Only one module can be fitted to the ship, uses a rapid pulse laser to perforate the incoming ordinance into uselessness.
The module is either on or off and reduces overall cap (module maintains a stored charge) and drains cap while firing.

A more advanced version could allow discrimination to auto-target only bombs or only missiles.

I like this idea the best. A defender module that is either on or off and auto engages threats. Defender missles honestly suck now even more than before. Sure they were bad back when you could load them onto a rocket launcher and have to spam the fire button for the split second a missle is coming at you. But now you can only fit Rapids with defenders and still have to spam the fire button and hope that the module lag does fire a defender into space after you have already been hit. Like the useless C-Ram in Afghanistan, mortars would hit then the stupid thing would fire off into the air.
Tusker Crazinski
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#15 - 2015-02-21 16:47:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Tusker Crazinski
Or how about they just make bombs and missiles lockable like drones?

I actually really like the idea of the this because the un-bonused small guns on hulls that are normally on E-war and utility ships that are fitted essentially to whore mails and work as a heat sink are now viable point defense weapons.

I mean I keep some 250s or my hyena just to shoot drones, and apply lol DPS, I think MOAs doctrine Scimitar has One 280 scout for lack of anything else and for the aforementioned KM whoring / heat sinking.
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
#16 - 2015-02-22 01:58:26 UTC
Tusker Crazinski wrote:
Or how about they just make bombs and missiles lockable like drones?

I actually really like the idea of the this because the un-bonused small guns on hulls that are normally on E-war and utility ships that are fitted essentially to ***** mails and work as a heat sink are now viable point defense weapons.

I mean I keep some 250s or my hyena just to shoot drones, and apply lol DPS, I think MOAs doctrine Scimitar has One 280 scout for lack of anything else and for the aforementioned KM whoring / heat sinking.


Sig radius for missiles and bombs would be very small, by the time anything could lock the missile or bomb will have detonated. The exception would be long range lobbing of Citadel and Cruise Missiles. A PD module would work best by re-purposing something that is currently in the game from obscure and near uselessness to something useful.

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.

Lienzo
Amanuensis
#17 - 2015-02-22 05:43:45 UTC
The main problem I see with bombers is that they are boring. I perfectly well grasp their anti-fleet purpose, but the implementation is very parsimonious in regards to engagement opportunity.

I would prefer a more brawlesome approach to bombing rather than this align, fire and warp away if there's no bubble business. For example, a very tight radius bomb that has high efficiency against high-hp targets, but only flies a few km. In response, you give the bomber 90% resist to its preferred damage type.

That doesn't really mesh with the anti-fleet role of bombs, so I would really like to see destroyer and battlecruiser sized bomber variants that don't cloak but instead mix it up. If they have the wide area of effect bombs, then that could be balanced.

I think the bigger issue is decrepit, decade-old group warping mechanics.


Another alternative is to expand the range of anti-support cruisers by implementing changes to the variants of turrets in the same group. That would mean sharpening their target signatures and expanding their optimals in exchange for fitting requirement increases.
Enya Sparhawk
Black Tea and Talons
#18 - 2015-02-22 08:43:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Enya Sparhawk
I'd like to see a mod that actively 'wrestles' with a launched bomb's detonation trigger...

A point defense system based off of a pilot's hacking skill versus the hacking skill of the one who launched it:
- make it a toggle mod, timed activation, draws cap... while on it actively searches out for active bombs in target radius area (say 45km)
- hacks into the bomb using existing 'hacking' UI same as the drone sites, giving the person a chance to detonate it early; either away from themselves or still within range of your own ships/drones.
- essentially creating an active player defense response to any attack.
- its like combining a hacking mod with an passive targeting system.
- Ewar skills affect radius and effectiveness of the mod vs. the other pilot's (greater radius means more time)
- as for the hacking, instead of a minute to hack, you get mere seconds depending on the situation... missions will train pilots to master the controls faster...
- launching and warping away may increase your opponent's chances at survival...

Bonus: instantaneous bomb detection system. HEADS UP!! Incoming...

Fíorghrá: Grá na fírinne

Maireann croí éadrom i bhfad.

Bíonn súil le muir ach ní bhíonn súil le tír.

Is maith an scéalaí an aimsir.

When the lost ships of Greece finally return home...

Hakan MacTrew
Konrakas Forged
Solyaris Chtonium
#19 - 2015-02-22 12:42:05 UTC
Just make bombs targetable and bring along a bunch of 250mm Arty thrashers wth different ammo types loaded.
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#20 - 2015-02-22 12:55:58 UTC
Kiandoshia wrote:
Undo warp speed changes

Suddenly battleships are a thing.



This actually is a very fair change. Its not like these beasts flutter around like nano-inties.


It wasn't unbalanced to bombers either imo pre-change. As both the bomber and the bombed you still see the kills. As well the people who actually do the right thing in bs fleets was the minority. You get way more who do it wrong to see the bombs take effect. Hit MWD, go deer in headlights, or the most basic warp to spotter and just sit there....in the mass of ships that did the same thing (me, after landing I'd get my space first thing).
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