These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

server tick: cloak, warp, tackle, targeting - some technical questions

Author
Soltys
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2015-02-09 03:02:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Soltys
(for the sake of simplicity - assume lag is 0)

1) What is the priority: cloak vs. targeting ?

Let's assume that tackler starts locking and also finishes it in the same server tick - and - in the same tick the potential victim issues cloak. The next tick will announce the results of those commands (afaik), and ... locked or cloaked ?

Who wins in such scenario ? Some arbitrary priority or in order of the command completion by the server in the preceeding tick ?

2) What is the priority: warp vs. tackle ?

Somewhat similar to the above - in the same server tick - the victim finishes prerequisities to warp (75% speed, alignment), the attacker issues tackle. On next tick - warp or sitting duck ?

Basing on everything I've read so far (mittani blog, many threads here and on reddit), the victim should get away (and it's one of the reasons for the "magical" <2s align time). So in this case the priority would be arbitrary.

3) Do I have the following right

- activating point, scram, cloak (modules overall) and starting target lock

All of the above are executed immediately with the results (if applicable, e.g. lock actually did finish) being braodcasted on the next server tick.

- align, warp, doubleclick move (and possibly other similar commands - orbit, range, dock, velocity changes)

The commands are queued and begin their execution on the next tick.


EDIT:

All the answers below are courtesy of Namamai.


The key to these question is that module activations -- both cloak and point -- are handled outside of the server tick. They are sent immediately when the player presses F1/F2/etc. and get processed as soon as the server receives them. (However, the results of those actions may not be transmitted to players on-grid until the next tick.)

Knowing that, you can answer #1:


1) It depends:
* If the victim activates its cloak before the lock finishes, the lock won't finish, and the tackler will get a message at the end of the lock cycle that it cannot target that item because it's no longer present.
* If the tackler can actually finish the lock, then it will win. The cloak packet, when it arrives, will result in a failure to activate because someone's locking it.

When you finish locking, the server will decide immediately that you're locked, but won't report the visual effects of the lock (i.e. sending you the locked ship's HP) until the next tick. Cloaks will use that information as well.

2) Tackler takes priority. The check for 75%-of-max-velocity is performed as part of the server tick. Any tackle that arrives in mid-tick will take place immediately, canceling the warp at the end of the tick.

3) You are correct.

It's easiest to think of server ticks not as a interval of continuous processing that happens over 1sec, but instead as a "capstone" that happens at the end of each second of play.

Jita Flipping Inc.: Kovl & Kuvl

Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
#2 - 2015-02-09 03:04:43 UTC
It is always to your disadvantage.
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#3 - 2015-02-09 03:37:00 UTC
Always assume that articles on TMC that relate to game mechanics are highlighting which issues the writers are exploiting currently, and in no way reflect actual gameplay.

The sub-2-second align time thing? A myth. You can be locked, scrammed and podded while flying a pod. I think pods align faster than 2 seconds.

Why would people claim that sub-2-second align time is "magical"? My guess is that their lock time on a pod is 1.1 seconds and they're too lazy to get it faster, so they convince their targets to go slower.

So I'll reassert that articles on TMC about game mechanics should be used as conversation starters, and perhaps guidance on which mechanics you need to seriously research for your own edification. They should be treated as equivalent to Food Babe or Dr. Oz when it comes to veracity, integrity, and utility.

As Abrazzar said, though, regardless of how thoroughly you understand the mechanics when you have two or three ships on grid, the situation where you actually need to use those mechanics against other people will be sufficiently different to any experiment that results will vary from "odd" to "thoroughly disconcerting."
Serene Repose
#4 - 2015-02-09 15:15:38 UTC
In before the move?

We must accommodate the idiocracy.

John A Than
Big Gay Towers
#5 - 2015-02-09 16:02:23 UTC
Abrazzar wrote:
It is always to your disadvantage.

True. For instance, one time after disassembling illegal mining equipment, I locked the pod and activated my guns, which were strong enough to one-shot it. CONCORD also killed me in the same tick, and so my guns did not fire and the pod survived.

What's more, I still lost sec status for aggressing a pod, when if I had actually committed the aggressing move (firing at it with 8 blasters) it would have been destroyed instantly.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#6 - 2015-02-10 00:34:47 UTC
Soltys wrote:
(for the sake of simplicity - assume lag is 0)

1) What is the priority: cloak vs. targeting ?

Let's assume that tackler starts locking and also finishes it in the same server tick - and - in the same tick the potential victim issues cloak. The next tick will announce the results of those commands (afaik), and ... locked or cloaked ?

Who wins in such scenario ? Some arbitrary priority or in order of the command completion by the server in the preceeding tick ?

Requests are processed in order received.

Something like:
0: Issue warp command which breaks gate cloak.
1: Ship is visible. Warp disruptor activate command sent.
2: Ship is in warp. Warp disruptor has no target.

Quote:
2) What is the priority: warp vs. tackle ?

You cannot be tackled once warp-tunnel has been entered.
Chopper Rollins
hahahlolspycorp
Brave Collective
#7 - 2015-02-10 00:47:03 UTC
Pods can be tackled and killed by a rifter with a t2 sensor booster and scan res script.
Pods don't enter warp super fast, i've found that properly fitted travel inties make them look slow.
Guy who fired on a pod in the tick he was CONCORDOKKENED, you might have fired on the pod after all, it's low sig could mean barely any damage was applied though. I've seen low skilled gank toons take a few volleys to kill a pod that was slowboating out of a bubble.


Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good.

45thtiger 0109
Brave Collective
#8 - 2015-02-10 00:48:41 UTC  |  Edited by: 45thtiger 0109
In Before the crash and burn Big smileP

Crash = Server Crashes

Burn = After the server Crashes and then the hamsters Burn lol

**You Have to take the good with the bad and the bad with the good.

Welcome to EvE OnLiNe**

45thtiger 0109
Brave Collective
#9 - 2015-02-10 00:49:27 UTC  |  Edited by: 45thtiger 0109
Double post sorry CCP

**You Have to take the good with the bad and the bad with the good.

Welcome to EvE OnLiNe**

Andrew Indy
Cleaning Crew
#10 - 2015-02-10 02:32:01 UTC
Chopper Rollins wrote:
Pods can be tackled and killed by a rifter with a t2 sensor booster and scan res script.
Pods don't enter warp super fast, i've found that properly fitted travel inties make them look slow.


Quote:
Why would people claim that sub-2-second align time is "magical"? My guess is that their lock time on a pod is 1.1 seconds and they're too lazy to get it faster, so they convince their targets to go slower.


I'm not sure that this is correct. Normally when pods are caught its because the pilot was too slow.

Normally people wait for their ship to die before they spam the warp button. This gives the attacked an advantage if they have less server lag as they might start locking the target before the pod initiates warp. At which point the server processes requests in the order they are received and he pod gets caught.

If you spam warp a few seconds before your ship dies you can't be caught, well at least I'm my experience.

Don't confuse game mechanics with players derping. Sure people catch pods all the time but people suck all the time as well.
Voyager Arran
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#11 - 2015-02-10 04:47:44 UTC
People getting caught in pods come down to them being too slow hitting the warp command (swap to an escape overlay and start mashing S on random celestials before your ship explodes) or having Australian internet and taking too long to load grid in the transition from ship to pod.
Soltys
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2015-02-11 00:45:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Soltys
I reedited my post to cover answers from Namamai, so they can serve as a reference.

Jita Flipping Inc.: Kovl & Kuvl