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The splitting of factions in missions
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Aven Valkyr
Over Reaction
Ligma Grindset
#1 - 2015-02-07 00:02:24 UTC
Now here is an idea I'm sure most will agree on.

We have all done it, especially in our younger years as eve pilots. We have all ruined our reputation with certain factions due to missioning, not realizing that "gallente" is actually "The Gallente Empire". So ruining your reputation while trying to run missions results in getting you blown up while traversing gallente space. Of course, as a caldari pilot, I'm using gallente as an example.

I understand that there are empires at war and that it's important to be able to lower your faction standings towards another faction in order to partake in faction warefare. So here is my proposal:

Separate agents that offer missions against your standard NPC/Rat factions from the playable faction races. Make your standard missions only deliver missions of NPC/rat factions, and create new agents that deliver missions against the warring empires. This will do several things:

-Keep people from ruining their reputation for declining missions within the 4 hour time limit
-Keep people from turning the game off due to having turn down missions and having nothing else to do
-Makes the mission turndowns less frequent since a lot of people also avoid low sec missions as well
-Gives people who are looking to enter into faction warfare an available set of agents they can run to target a specific player faction
-Gives players more control over who they are warring against.

Please consider this proposal. Thanks
Lugh Crow-Slave
#2 - 2015-02-07 00:35:39 UTC
A.) even if you just do distribution missions and kill no one as your caldari goes up your amarr will also go up and you gal and minm will go down

B.) This is a core part of the game you make a choice and live with the consequences

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#3 - 2015-02-07 01:22:25 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
A.) even if you just do distribution missions and kill no one as your caldari goes up your amarr will also go up and you gal and minm will go down

B.) This is a core part of the game you make a choice and live with the consequences


A thing regarding A) that I would like to point out is that unless you are killing a faction's ships, your standings towards any particular empire will not go below -5 and thus you will not reach "kill on sight" standings.
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2015-02-07 03:03:59 UTC
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
A.) even if you just do distribution missions and kill no one as your caldari goes up your amarr will also go up and you gal and minm will go down

B.) This is a core part of the game you make a choice and live with the consequences


A thing regarding A) that I would like to point out is that unless you are killing a faction's ships, your standings towards any particular empire will not go below -5 and thus you will not reach "kill on sight" standings.


I've been practically genocidal towards Amarr due to their slavery yet through diplomacy i can still travel there in safety. This is a non-issue if you use the skills available.
Aven Valkyr
Over Reaction
Ligma Grindset
#5 - 2015-02-07 03:15:46 UTC
I have not yet seen my standings go down for the opposing factions due to my main faction standings go up. I'm talking regular L4 combat missions here. I always declined any mission that goes against any other empire since I realized that my gallente standings got so bad I couldn't fly thru their space. All I'm asking for here is a separation between agents who give regular missions vs NPC factions and agents who give missions against the 4 main dominant factions. It's not too much to ask..
Iain Cariaba
#6 - 2015-02-07 17:43:30 UTC
Aven Valkyr wrote:
I have not yet seen my standings go down for the opposing factions due to my main faction standings go up. I'm talking regular L4 combat missions here. I always declined any mission that goes against any other empire since I realized that my gallente standings got so bad I couldn't fly thru their space. All I'm asking for here is a separation between agents who give regular missions vs NPC factions and agents who give missions against the 4 main dominant factions. It's not too much to ask..

I ran l4 Caldari Navy missions for years, not caring what my standings with the other factions were. Now that I don't run them anymore, I find absolutly no problems flying around wherever I want. FacPo doesn't bother me at all, even in Gallente space, so I really don't see what you're asking for to be very important.
Aven Valkyr
Over Reaction
Ligma Grindset
#7 - 2015-02-07 20:41:14 UTC
my standings went to -7.98 with gallente for running caldari missions throughout my career :(
Lugh Crow-Slave
#8 - 2015-02-07 20:52:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
A.) even if you just do distribution missions and kill no one as your caldari goes up your amarr will also go up and you gal and minm will go down

B.) This is a core part of the game you make a choice and live with the consequences


A thing regarding A) that I would like to point out is that unless you are killing a faction's ships, your standings towards any particular empire will not go below -5 and thus you will not reach "kill on sight" standings.


this is true

Aven Valkyr wrote:
my standings went to -7.98 with gallente for running caldari missions throughout my career :(


get your diplo skill up and it should become almost above -5.0

and if you need to fix your standings go run SOE they will more or less lower/raise your standings to 0.0

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Ix Method
Doomheim
#9 - 2015-02-07 21:03:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Ix Method
Making people run around in their fat-arsed battleships just for tags is a bit daft.

Wouldn't be against removing the decline timer for Anti-Empire missions though, mechanics that effectively stop people playing are pretty terrible.

Travelling at the speed of love.
Celthric Kanerian
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2015-02-07 21:42:10 UTC
There is a reason behind the Diplomatic skill books...
Aven Valkyr
Over Reaction
Ligma Grindset
#11 - 2015-02-08 00:25:55 UTC
my diplomacy is trained to 4. Look this is a simple matter that should meet little to no resistance. The point is, having to decline missions simply because they are against a majour faction really sucks. That 4 hour cooldown timer makes me stop playing the game. Does that sound reasonable to you? This is an issue and it needs to be addressed. Not everyone plays in faction warefare. Not everyone plays in lowsec. Laugh and scoff all you want but I play the game mainly in empire and I'm sick of my standings going up and down they way they do.

Also, if I am not mistaken, Sisters of Eve is to fix your concord status, not your faction standings. I have done everything I can possibly do and now I'm stuck running hundreds of L1 missions to get the menial storyline missions that increase my standings by .04 each time. It's a brutal grind to fix standings. If you guys really LOVE the system the way it is then cudo's to you. At the very *very* minimum CCP should at least allow the selling of tags to L2 data center agents at a standing of below +1. Those agents should be available to anyone with a status of -5 or better. If I can't fix my standings any other way than grinding the hell outta L1 agents then there should at least be a way for me to buy my way up to better standings. Also realize these agents can only be used once in a lifetime.

But the ideal fix would be to fix the way empire missions are granted to begin with. My idea of moving factional missions over to agents that are specific to faction warefare should be looked at. If you are in to faction warefare then great. This system I'm trying to get across here would be better for everyone. Less frequent mission declines for the carebears, the guys in FW win, and the data center agents are used for their correct purpose. To increase the hell out of already positive standings.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#12 - 2015-02-08 00:38:51 UTC
If you're on decline cooldown or whatever you call it, can't you just take your officer fir raven or whatever to another agent? There are hundreds of the buggers around.
Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2015-02-08 06:43:46 UTC
Gallente always was and is a Federation, remember this.

As an option you could have two alts running missions for you and never bother about your main.

"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP
Nebaile Sharisa
Annoying Flies At A Barbecue
#14 - 2015-02-08 13:17:00 UTC
Why not spend the money for the tags to do the faction rep missions that every faction has for one time only.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#15 - 2015-02-08 13:23:20 UTC
if you don't want to decline missions you risk dropping standings with other factions faster if you don't want to do that you are going to need to decline some missions or as i said go run missions for SOE

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#16 - 2015-02-08 14:00:33 UTC
Aven Valkyr wrote:
my diplomacy is trained to 4. Look this is a simple matter that should meet little to no resistance. The point is, having to decline missions simply because they are against a majour faction really sucks. That 4 hour cooldown timer makes me stop playing the game. Does that sound reasonable to you? This is an issue and it needs to be addressed. Not everyone plays in faction warefare. Not everyone plays in lowsec. Laugh and scoff all you want but I play the game mainly in empire and I'm sick of my standings going up and down they way they do.


Train your Diplomacy to Lv5. This is a no-brainer that should have been done even before you made a thread on the forums. The point is, you're coming around here asking for changes to the game that will strip away the need to make decisions and the consequences of those decisions and then you're surprised when you don't get a resounding vote of agreement. At its very core, EVE is a game about choices and consequences. You're asking to alter the very thing that brings many of us here in the first place, to change the nature of the game on a fundamental level just because of missions. Does that sound reasonable to you? Nobody's forcing you to stop playing. Nobody's forcing you to only do missions. Nobody's forcing anything on you or taking away other options you can choose to spend your time on except you. You are the one who is choosing to only play in highsec, to only do missions and to only do those missions for one agent. The entire scenario you're saying needs to be changed is built on brick after brick of choices that you have made.

Quote:
Also, if I am not mistaken, Sisters of Eve is to fix your concord status, not your faction standings. I have done everything I can possibly do and now I'm stuck running hundreds of L1 missions to get the menial storyline missions that increase my standings by .04 each time. It's a brutal grind to fix standings. If you guys really LOVE the system the way it is then cudo's to you. At the very *very* minimum CCP should at least allow the selling of tags to L2 data center agents at a standing of below +1. Those agents should be available to anyone with a status of -5 or better. If I can't fix my standings any other way than grinding the hell outta L1 agents then there should at least be a way for me to buy my way up to better standings. Also realize these agents can only be used once in a lifetime.


SoE missions do not "fix" CONCORD standings. They - and all other missions - slowly increase security status by virtue of shooting pirate NPCs. It's the same "fix" you would get by ratting in low/null asteroid belts. You can already give tags to datacenter agents for a substantial standings boost and they're already once-in-a-lifetime. You made your choices. Live with them. Don't ask CCP to fix your mess because you were too lazy/ignorant/shortsighted to not make that mess in the first place.

Quote:
But the ideal fix would be to fix the way empire missions are granted to begin with. My idea of moving factional missions over to agents that are specific to faction warefare should be looked at. If you are in to faction warefare then great. This system I'm trying to get across here would be better for everyone. Less frequent mission declines for the carebears, the guys in FW win, and the data center agents are used for their correct purpose. To increase the hell out of already positive standings.


Why should it be looked at? What makes you so sure your idea deserves to be looked at more than someone else's? Or at all? Anti-faction missions are fine where they are; some people don't care about their standings and this would serve only to decrease the pool of missions they can draw from - something nobody wants or needs. Others who do care about them can easily decline the mission and most dedicated mission-runners have multiple agents in case they pull two bad missions in a row from one agent. Obviously you don't and feel you shouldn't have to have more than one agent, but other missioners have more than one agent.

The system is perfectly fine the way it is. The only things that particularly need changing are how god-awful boring and farmable missions are and how predictably self-entitled carebears are.

Are we done here?
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2015-02-08 14:13:37 UTC
I'd also point out that th COSMOS missions are the fastet way to repair your standings for any one given faction should the need arise. No change necessary, simply rotate through your agents when the faction missions come up and go try something new if they all lock out for a bit.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#18 - 2015-02-08 18:06:34 UTC
Faction Standing Repair Plan

However, the ability to decline faction missions without an agent standing loss would be nice. You can get a few of these buggers in a row.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#19 - 2015-02-08 18:58:18 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Faction Standing Repair Plan

However, the ability to decline faction missions without an agent standing loss would be nice. You can get a few of these buggers in a row.


Multiple agents. It's uncommon for two agents to give you a bad mission followed by another bad mission and even if it happens, you can still go run some PI or something.
Aven Valkyr
Over Reaction
Ligma Grindset
#20 - 2015-02-16 01:48:18 UTC
Well my other mission agent has given me a faction mission. So I go to the 2nd agent.. run one pathetic little L4. Great. Cashin.. next mission is against amarr. Then 3 in a row that force u to use an assault frig. Turned those ones down. No harm no foul. Then another mission against caldari. UGH. Incursions are down. Everyone in corp is offline so no pvp either. Game is now being shut off. I'm a 2006 player and I have been frustrated over this mechanic for a long time. Yeah I could spend my time flying around eve pulling missions from multiple agents. the only problem is that over half of them are in low sec. not going there with my shiny. The other ones that are in empire are so close to low sec that half the missions they give you send you to low sec. Turning those down too. Then I get another faction mission. Only about 15% of agents are "safe". But they offer many faction missions. Getting tired of it. I'm serious. CCP needs to look at this. I know you PVP guys are all about it. Well good for you. I still think something needs to be done. Switch the faction missions over to agents that are there to give you the faction missions. Reduce the frequency of faction missions. Eliminate the 4 hour cooldown time. Do SOMETHING to fix it.
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